Oh forgot to mention, the only reason the Inspector said he will not stand in court and say the car needed repairs at point of sale, is that he cannot as I have had the car for 2 years.

However, Advantage had the opportunity in 2010 when I had only had the car 4 months to Inspect it and they did not, funny seeing as it is them who booked the Inspection in November.

I had a mechanic say exact the same thing as the Inspector back in Feb 2011, but Advantage dismissed it and refused to contact him.

Nish,

Best of luck with it mate, the only thing that appears to be against you in the length of time. As I understand it under sale of goods act in the first six months the onus is upon the creditor to prove that the issues did not exist when the vehicle was purchased as it would be presumed that they were. After six months and up to one year the onus is upon you to prove the issue did exist at the time of purchase, two years in you probably have your work cut out under sale of goods.

Best of luck with your legal wrangling, you have a fair chance against these guys as their attention to detail is appalling meaning that they normally leave themselves down - all you need to do is spot their screw ups and capitalise upon them.

Keep me update on progress

RCT40

now thats very good news

 

and good new the judge is indicating you'll poss get your monies back

 

tell us more on that front

 

we have always believed it was possible too

 

dx

Hi DX,

The judge has already said that Advantage have to refund every single penny, the only reason it couldn't be done today was that I need to file a counter claim first and then he will order a complete refund.

I'll keep everyone updated on progress, but this should happen in about 28 days.

RCT

Today I've managed to get Advantage Finances claim dismissed in county court, and the judge has also given me leave to lodge a counter claim and get all of my monies back. This is the end of a very stressful eighteen month journey for me.

To all of you who have been in a similar position to me, stand up for your rights, don't give up - give them what they deserve!!

Thanks to everyone who have offerred me advice and guidance, you'll never know how much I appreciate the help you've given.

I am the defendant in a small claims case. The claimant witness statement says that during a telephone conversation between ourselves on 29/9/2010 they requested I obtain a diagnostic report on the vehicles condition which is not true.

I have a recording of this call provided by the director prior to the commencement of proceedings, having listened to tis this evening there was no requesr for a report. This proves that the claimant lied on their witness statements. I'm unsure how I should best deal with this, the trial is on 9/1/12.

Good Luck with it, hope you give them what they deserve.

 

Just wondered on something. When you receive written correspondence from Advantage do you find they are clever with their words?

I am getting constant written correspondence at the moment, but whenever they have questions to answer, they are very cagey with the answers I get.

 

I have a car going for inspection soon, and in a letter they wrote they told me if the car is fine, I will have to pay the inspection fee, and any arrears and fees I have.

So I asked in return what if the report is in my favour, what will happen then. Instead of answering the question they told me they cannot jump to conclusions. Lol, after I informed them they already had regarding charging me to the hilt in their previous written communication, I asked them again, what happens if the report is in my favour, will they fix the car, or will they write it off. Again the response was clouded to say the least.

I am starting a thread on my problem, I hope you look in, you may see something, even small that may help you, I dont know. Thanks again, and as I said Good Luck.

Hi Nish any update on your inspection, if as your post suggests you allowed Advantage to carry out the inspection my money is on they found it to be completely problem free (they always are). Can't wait to get to court next week.

Good Luck with it, hope you give them what they deserve.

 

Just wondered on something. When you receive written correspondence from Advantage do you find they are clever with their words?

I am getting constant written correspondence at the moment, but whenever they have questions to answer, they are very cagey with the answers I get.

 

I have a car going for inspection soon, and in a letter they wrote they told me if the car is fine, I will have to pay the inspection fee, and any arrears and fees I have.

So I asked in return what if the report is in my favour, what will happen then. Instead of answering the question they told me they cannot jump to conclusions. Lol, after I informed them they already had regarding charging me to the hilt in their previous written communication, I asked them again, what happens if the report is in my favour, will they fix the car, or will they write it off. Again the response was clouded to say the least.

I am starting a thread on my problem, I hope you look in, you may see something, even small that may help you, I dont know. Thanks again, and as I said Good Luck.

Hi Nish

I have stumbled across something very interesting in the claimant witness statement. The person making this statement says that during a telephone call that they informed me that they required a full diagnostic report on he vehicle to validate the issues exist.

As it so happens I have a recording of this call given to me by the company as they tried to [EDIT] me with some daft comments I made even though the recording was made without my knowledge. Having listened back to the recording of the call again tonight I can say that they definitely did not ask for this report, and so have clearly lied in their witness evidence which I believe puts them in contempt?

This trial is Monday coming, and I haven't a clue what I can do, should I bring this up in court and ensure that the recording is with me on my iPad or should I approach the legal manager at the finance company who made the witness statement?

Could really do with some advice on the best course of action.

I have stumbled across something very interesting in the claimant witness statement. The person making this statement says that during a telephone call that they informed me that they required a full diagnostic report on he vehicle to validate the issues exist.

As it so happens I have a recording of this call given to me by the company as they tried to blackmail me with some daft comments I made even though the recording was made without my knowledge. Having listened back to the recording of the call again tonight I can say that they definitely did not ask for this report, and so have clearly lied in their witness evidence which I believe puts them in contempt?

This trial is Monday coming, and I haven't a clue what I can do, should I bring this up in court and ensure that the recording is with me on my iPad or should I approach the legal manager at the finance company who made the witness statement?

Could really do with some advice.

Sorry given the date of the trial this appears to be a small claim - in which case it is not necessary for the witnesses to attend but it may in any case be wise to get them to go as live evidence is always better than paper evidence.

Gaston,

Thank you very much for the information.

Yes there is something in their evidence that could only have been derived from my witness evidence. This is in relation to receipts that I cannot find.

You are correct that it is Small Claims. I'm going to attempt to get the witnesses to court but its nice to know that I can use the statements should work commitments not allow them to be there.

Could really do with some advice with this, we go to trial 9th.

I already have a thread running but I have a feeling from correspondence that one of the contributors is actually the finance company.

Basically my question is that statements and documents had to be exchanged by 26th December, but the court advised me that due to holidays my information HAD to reach the company by 23rd December. But it seems that this has given the finance company the opportunity of writing their statement in such a manner that it undermines mine, it I now its based on my disclosure because it refers to comments made in my statement that had been made previously. It appears because they were sending to a residential property there was a big chance that someone was there to sign for a Xmas eve special delivery. Can they do this? Surely this places me at a disadvantage? I certainly feel at a disadvantage.

They also ask for strict proof of the conduct of the repossession company, I can provide statements from my wife and father as they witnessed what occurred, can I and is it worth asking the court to take these extra statements into consideration?

I'm not sure I would say that they are clever with their words, in my case they almost admit what their doing, but of course hide behind 'without prejudice' at the top of the letters making them pretty useless in evidence.

Don't know what will happen in court, but the bottom line is they can't take what you haven't got - and as long as you can prove your income and expenditure you can pay next to nothing meaning it would be a very long time before Advantage see the full amount.

We're going to trial on 9th January.

Today I received a telephone call from Advantage asking me how much I propose to pay every month of the supposed amount I owe them (still had no breakdown of how they come to this total as yet), I told them I proposed to pay nothing as this was in dispute and a letter is in the post.

I later received a an email from my employers HR department saying that advantage had faxed them a questionaire asking for...

• Job Title
  
• Length of service
  
• Full Time/Part Time
  
• Temp/Perm
  
• Average net pay per month
  
• Is the customer off sick?
  
• Is the employee entitled to sick pay?
  
• For what length of time?
  
• Are there any plans for redundancies?
  
• Address if different for above.
  

Thanks to the data protection act I needed to give my permission for my employers to release this information, which of course I refused to do. Our HR department gave me the fax, and to my horror it includes my signature taken from the HP agreement, and is done in such a way that it almost looks as if I gave my permission for this information to be released.

I contacted Advantage (by phone) as I was obviously pretty annoyed. They told me that as I refused to make any payments they were going to an attachement of earnings. Can anyone bring me up to speed, can they just request an attachement of earnings and get it irrelevant of the fact that this is in dispute and they clearly need to take me to court to resolve the issue once and for all?

Be hugely greatful for replies!

Hello RCT hope you are well. Actually this statement is not necessarily true Giving consent by way of giving keys etc doesn't necessarily mean you gave INFORMED consent, the 2 are quite different.

Hi Wannabe hope your well. Thanks for your input, it's very useful - I'm having proper fun and games with these guys...

Hi RCT,

 

Wow, I have just found your thread.

My story and continuing gripe with Advantage is similar in some ways, so we may be able tp help each other.

I have a car through Advantage. I had one previous and they were fantastic when it broke down. However my circumstances now rise from when I got another car.

Firstly the car was financed through a dealer, who said his "sister firm" were going to finance the car on their behalf. Great, no probs there (since found out the 2 businesses were not related) . But when I tried after 2 days to cancel as the car was a shed, I was told no, as it was signed on trade premises. I paid the car, only to find at an MOT all the work needed to be done, were only bodged to last a few months.

Cut a long story short, I stopped paying after also receiving Default Notices off Advantage. They said I was £498 in arrears over the space of 2 months, to which It was paid up to date, they offered no defence to the fact it was an up to date account, but also never said where the outstanding amount had come from.

Along with the existing problems with the car, I stopped paying in Sept 10. Funny enough I have now found out that due to the Doorstep Sellers Regulations that my agreement is unenforcable due to the fact it was NOT signed on the dealers premises, hence I should have been able to cancel within 5 days.

Advantage, will not give up, and would like to prepare you for a bumpy ride.

Firstly the Default Notice you received, can be issued after just one missed payment if they dont think you will bring the account up to date, Trading Standards confirmed it to me, however, as the car was repossessed before it was issued, I believe that makes your agreement unenforcable.

 

I can however make it easier for you.

 

Check your agreement where it mentions broker commissions and see if there is an amount entered.

ACF, are classed as a broker, and will be paid a commission by Advantage, and this has to be disclosed to you by law.

If the broker fee section is blank or has 0.00 in then it is unenforcable full stop. Approach a solicitor just on that matter, the rest will fall into place. And will save you grief of mountains of evidence to collect.

If there is no section for Brokers fee, that also deems the agreement unenforcable.

 

If there is one and the amount is disclosed, and you say you were issued the DN after the car was took, then Advantage are cornered.

The reason they are trying so hard, is they realise they have no defence to their own stupidity.

 

I am dealing with a guy called Darren Young. The poor guy does not know commercial law, as I have offered to settle my account in THEIR favour and they refused. Oh Dear.

Hi Nish

Had another letter from our good friends today, and I'm intrigued by your mention of 'Doorstep Sellers Regulations' from what you've said it seems you signed your agreement of the premises of ACF - as did I, can you point me at some information of how the Doorstep Sellers Regulations would apply in this case?

Hi, as far as holding it against them and you giving them the key, you can hold it against them.

If they turn up, and the car is on private property, they must leave and come back with a court order. The fact they approached you and informed you they were there to repossess makes them act illegally.

Personally, I would use that fact for legal reasons. Why? well as the car was collected illegally, you are entitled to all the money you have paid back. But if you challenge the agreement on the fact you were issued with the DN unreasonably or illegally, you at best will get the agreement written off, you wont get the compensation as their solicitors will pick up on what the main dispute is. I am saying this from experience only. I hope you get it sorted.

 

As for the staff you mentioned above.

Each account will have a "team" dedicated to it, and that will run through any possible procedure, hence why its always the same people dealing with you. I don't like this fact as they can all discuss an account and stick to a scenario between them.

 

One thing to get things sorted for you is to contact the Director called Keith Charlton. I may have his email addy I will check for you, but, in all honesty, he is a nice guy and quite understanding. I am going to email him myself soon when I dig the addy out, but if something can be done amicably, he will do.

I also know from experience, that Mr Charlton strives very hard to make Advantage the best and most responsible lender out there. He would be horrified if he knew half the things customers were told by his so called dedicated staff. I know he hates taking a hard line with customers, and I personally feel some of his staff are a bit above their station at times, acting like it's their own money you have borrowed. Maybe that is not a bad thing, but when customers are not getting a fair hearing, then someone needs to sort things.

Nish,

Thanks for the further info - your very knowledgable when it comes to Advantage. I beleive you was referring to this email address [email protected] HTH

They can't take what you haven't got Russell.

OOOPS forgot to mention.

As it was took off your parents drive without a court order, you are entitled to all money paid to the account to be refunded.

It does not matter wether it is your house, your parents house or Father Teds. If you had permission to put it there, they cannot take it.

That also has made your agreement nul and void as far as your obligations are concerned.

 

Advantage with me are in schtuk. It is SORN on a private drive and has been for 5 months. To take it they need a court order, and they wont get one and they know it. I move on 1st March and the landlords said it can stay here and will charge Advantage storage. Happy Days

I let the repossession company take the car from the drive, gave them the key and everything, so I don't think I can hold that against them - the fact it was taken before a default notice was served upon me didn't do them any favours though.

Hi Nish,

Thanks for the information, very interesting. I'm surprised that you say the Trading Standard confirmed that a default noticed can be issued after one missed payment, as the Consumer Credit Act clearly states that it has to be two. I have a receipt for the car from the repossession agent, and also his mobile number should I ever need him to clarify anything which is also dated the same day as the default notice. I've just checked the agreement and all other paperwork received at the time with the car and there is no mention at all of any Broker fees.

I've also received a number of notices with varying amounts, most recent [last week] was a request for over 7k, but they'll accept 3.8k if I pay by 3rd March. None of these figures make any sense when examining all of the documentation I've managed to collect they are obviously a complete bunch of cowboys and try to get by on frightening tactics. I wrote back to them the very same day refusing payment for the various reasons mentioned within this thread and suggested that they now go away, or issue court proceedings at which time I will counter claim for the return of every single penny I ever gave them. I can't see this ever getting to court as they appear cornered on the DN, but after the information you provided today regarding broker fees looks like they're double cornered.

Darren Young, I thought the company only consisted of Simon Douglas and Pamela Sizer as they seem to do every role within the company in my case - Pamela is now the legal department in the last letter, but was repossessions and customer relations in others

I don't think this will every find its way into a court, and I guess I'm destined for a long chain of threatening letters, but I'm not at all worried about a bumpy ride from these guys they can bring it on as far as I'm concerned, I'm happy to fight them tooth and nail all the way to the end.

Actually mcjonhnson is correct - but rather than pay those cowboys I think I would take my chances.

Hi sorry for the delay,

 

 

That was my thinking too. Just to stop paying.

 

The car is still in my possession but its practically worthless at its non driveable and has been since 2008.

 

I own my own house and I work in the public sector so I was thinking the worst they coudld do would be attachement of earning order?

 

My hope is that they take me to court I file unreasonable atcion on there part as Ive effectivley paid the loan of and all tehy are after now is the interest.

 

Honestly if their credit department wopuld have told me that to get out of the loan would cost £1500 I woudl bite there hands off.

 

Woudl a court be in my favour??

Have you paid 50% of the agreement? If so under the terms of the agreement [regulated by CCA] you can hand the car back and walk away.

Hi RusselSmart,

I'm not sure what to tell you, from the thread you can see how mine has played out - I still get the odd arrears notice from Advantage showing a monthly charge for arrears management, but no demands for payment have ever been received, and Mrs Sizer has long since given up on me as I'm as awkward as she is.

If I were in your shoes, I would stop paying them and take my chances. If you credit record is already screwed you've nothing to lose really. I would think the worst that they can do would be to take you to court.

Tell me, how many missed payments were there before the car was repossessed? i.e. was it taken from you legally?

I've received a Statutory Arrears Notice in this mornings post, I'm not really sure what my reply should be to this - as far as I can see we're far past arrears notices as the agreeement legally ceased on 29th September when the car was repossed via an invalid default notice.

Any advice on how I should proceed?

I think that the email you are thinking of sending back is very good, if you want to send it I would say that it need only be altered a little to remove the bit that says "pass it to the legal dept" and substitute it for the resolution you require.

 

I would think you do need to reply to their letter just in case they are stupid enough to take it further, just to show how reasonable you are

Hi WannaBe,

I have received a letter as follows...

HIRE PURCHASE NOTICE OF TERMINATION

In view of your failure to comply with the terms of the Default Notice served in accordance with Section 87(1) of Consumer Credit Act 1974, the hiring under Agreement between us is now terminated. Any insurance policies taken out under this agreement are also terminated.

You are no longer in possession of the goods with our consent. If they are not made available to us for collection we shally apply to the County Court for their return.

Your sincerely.

Can you tell me in your opinon, does this need a reply pointing out again that the notice wasn't served correctly or do you think I should sit tight and see what occurs as I would only be saying again what I've already told them?

Thanks for your help again!