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Sister v LLoyds Bank accounts and Credit cards.


Opalie
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Hiyas all

 

I think I am in the right place for posting this.

 

This is actually for my sister, who I am carer for, she is on disability living allowance for extreme stress related issues.

 

Anyway, she has banked with LLoyds for years and has have a normal account plus a cc. Earlier this year she ran into some financial difficulties and couldn't pay her cc for 2 months.

 

In this time she had constant phone calls, which does not help her medical situation, so I am now down as able to speak on her behalf.

 

My sister has two normal accounts, one where her money goes in and normal direct debits are paid, and one for her rent account. which she transfers money into.

 

Although we explained to LLoyds Credit card that I would take over her payments to get her on track. However, during this time, they took money from her rent account twice, making her rent account short...ugggg.

 

So i ended up putting right her rent account and moving it to another bank for her, so it couldn't happen again.

 

1. Are they allowed to do this?

 

2. the credit card is now back on track, but I am paying £400.00 per month, to combat interest rate charges, is this something I can help her on? Can we take LLoyds to court for all the charges on the credit cards, plus the high interest rate that seems to be applying?

 

Now one really nice thing is she is incredibly organized and never throws anything away, so she has all statements for both LLoyds current accounts and the credit card from year dot.

 

3. In light of the stay's that are occuring, am I right in reading that these only are affecting current accounts and not credit cards?

 

4. Is it still worth persuing the current account even with the stays going on, to be in the queue when they have to start paying?

 

Any advise appreciated, I have read more in the last few weeks, than probably books in the last 4 years!!!!

 

Thanks for your help.

 

Op's

CASES:

 

HALIFAX

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - statements received.

Waiting for money to do N1

CAPITAL ONE

WON - Fees, purchase interest, court costs and Stat.

VANQUIS BANK

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

I hate this company

LLOYDS TSB BANK (SISTER)

20/09/2007 - statements received

22/11/2007 - N1 filed

Lloyds TSB CREDITCARD (SISTER)

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

20/09/2007 - statements received

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Hiya Op's. I think its worth starting claims for both the credit cards and the bank accounts.

 

The situation with the OFT case stays and bank accounts is they should only affect claims from people who would not suffer hardship if the case were to be stayed. I think from what you have said your sister could quite successfully argue, because of her medical condition she would suffer hardship from a stay of her case. Having said that some of the Judges seem to be having difficulty with this point.

 

If your sister receives Government benifits this will also have a baring on your claim.

 

Credit Card claims should be ok as long as you claim under Common Law and dont refer to Unfair Terms in Consumer Contract Regulations 1999. I'm sure if you ask in the Other Institutions forum you will find someone who is willing to share their particulars of claim for a credit card that you can edit.

 

As far as taking money from one account to pay another unfortunatly they are allowed to do this its called "offsetting"

 

pete

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  • 3 weeks later...

got all her statements...so working on those atm...

 

I handed in a right of Appropriation* today, so hopefully they wont touch her money at the end of the month.

 

Got them to photocopy the letters and stamp them as received in the branch.

 

*=probably spelt wrong...not awake yet !!!

CASES:

 

HALIFAX

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - statements received.

Waiting for money to do N1

CAPITAL ONE

WON - Fees, purchase interest, court costs and Stat.

VANQUIS BANK

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

I hate this company

LLOYDS TSB BANK (SISTER)

20/09/2007 - statements received

22/11/2007 - N1 filed

Lloyds TSB CREDITCARD (SISTER)

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

20/09/2007 - statements received

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Opalie, I would assume the size of monthly lawful interest is dwarfing previous penalty charges, so this is the priority issue. If Lloyds agrees that the cardholder is in difficulties they will consent to suspend interest for 6 months, then review. They have also been known to completely cease applying interest, and settle for monthly payment. For this to happen Lloyds require the filling in of Income and Expenditure form as a means test, and to either suspend or terminate interest, they have the requirement of stopping use of the c.c. PERMANENTLY.

 

Unlike other banks, when Lloyds grant c.c. to Lloyds bank account holders, they make sure the cardholder will sign an agreement enabling Lloyds to transfer money out of bank account into c.c. Your sis is likely to have indicated her current account number, not her rent account.

 

If you wish to retrospectively challenge Lloyds helping themselves to rent money, you would have to pore over the wording of the agreement sis signed and no doubt still has a copy, whether the wording was sufficient for Lloyds to walk into her unnamed rent account. If the wording was watertight and Lloyds enthusiasm had exceeded their discretion, then you have the possibility of reclaiming aforesaid unauthorised transfers, plus compensation for the distress and embarassment caused -- not only did Lloyds help themselves, they did so without warning before or after rent day! Seeking a view from the Lloyds side, does the account name indicate it was a rent money account, so that Lloyds cannot now say that to them it was only account A and account B, they were not to know account B held rent money, off limits except to the account holder.

 

If you wish to commence battle with Lloyds, I should try the interest suspension/termination route first. This would be administered in Brighton office, but if you make huge waves on the second issue, the bank could use the c.c. situation for retaliation.

 

GL, and what a heartwarming story, sisters closing ranks against bloodsuckers.

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Unlike other banks, when Lloyds grant c.c. to Lloyds bank account holders, they make sure the cardholder will sign an agreement enabling Lloyds to transfer money out of bank account into c.c. Your sis is likely to have indicated her current account number, not her rent account.

 

does the account name indicate it was a rent money account, so that Lloyds cannot now say that to them it was only account A and account B, they were not to know account B held rent money, off limits except to the account holder.

 

 

 

Thank you so much for the response Mistermind.

 

I have asked for a CCA, so hopefully I can see the wording on taking out money from an account clearly labeled 'RENT'.

 

I am sending the Prelim and Spready for the Bank Account on Tuesday (hopefully if hubby prints for me).

 

The LLoyds credit card one, I started a seperate thread under other institutions so I can keep them seperate, hopefully. But I won't be sending a Prelim or Spready until I have seen the CCA.

 

Although I will be preparing the spreadsheet today for her.

 

Op's

CASES:

 

HALIFAX

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - statements received.

Waiting for money to do N1

CAPITAL ONE

WON - Fees, purchase interest, court costs and Stat.

VANQUIS BANK

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

I hate this company

LLOYDS TSB BANK (SISTER)

20/09/2007 - statements received

22/11/2007 - N1 filed

Lloyds TSB CREDITCARD (SISTER)

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

20/09/2007 - statements received

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Prelim and spready being posted tomorrow :)

 

OP's

CASES:

 

HALIFAX

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - statements received.

Waiting for money to do N1

CAPITAL ONE

WON - Fees, purchase interest, court costs and Stat.

VANQUIS BANK

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

I hate this company

LLOYDS TSB BANK (SISTER)

20/09/2007 - statements received

22/11/2007 - N1 filed

Lloyds TSB CREDITCARD (SISTER)

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

20/09/2007 - statements received

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  • 3 weeks later...

My sister had the standard response letter.

 

LBA should be going off next week.

 

Op's

CASES:

 

HALIFAX

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - statements received.

Waiting for money to do N1

CAPITAL ONE

WON - Fees, purchase interest, court costs and Stat.

VANQUIS BANK

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

I hate this company

LLOYDS TSB BANK (SISTER)

20/09/2007 - statements received

22/11/2007 - N1 filed

Lloyds TSB CREDITCARD (SISTER)

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

20/09/2007 - statements received

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Ugggg

 

Went into Lloyds today re bank account and to give in a letter for 'Right of Appropriation', and they stated if we handed in the letter then they CLOSE the account in 30 days and this was now their standard procedure. So we didn't hand it in.

 

Then they went on to say that the official standing for Lloyds and people on benefits does not stop them applying charges to their account.

 

/sigh disappointing response to be honest.

 

LBA sent today though, before we went in to do Appropriation letter.

 

OP's

CASES:

 

HALIFAX

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - statements received.

Waiting for money to do N1

CAPITAL ONE

WON - Fees, purchase interest, court costs and Stat.

VANQUIS BANK

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

I hate this company

LLOYDS TSB BANK (SISTER)

20/09/2007 - statements received

22/11/2007 - N1 filed

Lloyds TSB CREDITCARD (SISTER)

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

20/09/2007 - statements received

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Account closure is brutal retaliation for persons not well placed to open another account elsewhere. The FOS rapped A&L for this, fining them £125 which they gave to the victim, but not much consolation there.

 

Your LBA is unlikely to trigger retaliation, outcome to depend on the High Court test case. If what figure the OFT has in mind is known to anybody on this site, he or she would certainly be unable to tell us. Several circumstances, however, are not encouraging.

 

On 5th April 2006 the OFT announced that if CC's did not reduce charges to £12 by 31st May 2006, the OFT "did not rule out legal action". Later the OFT clarified that the same trigger point applied to banks and mortgage lenders, but the latter laughed at the OFT, who did nothing.

 

About a month ago the OFT let slip, that they agreed with banks that charges levied when overdraft limit was breached (bad cheque honoured) were service fees, not breach of contract penalties, and hence Dunlop-v-Garage refund precedent did not apply.

 

In 12 days time Lloyds - that proactive hawk in the battalion of banks, will RAISE their charges, not lower them. If Lloyds does know something about the position the OFT is preparing for the test case, then this is not an encouraging straw in the wind.

 

The OFT and PenaltyCharges.co.uk jointly proposed a lawful charge pegged at £5. At Christmas 2006 a joint delegation visited the OFT HQ in London. The OFT refused to speak to the delegation, totally locking their front doors.

 

So Opalie, if you have not yet negotiated for interest suspension with TSB card office in Brighton, then sooner the better. After the test case verdict there might not be much refund coming.

 

GL.

 

 

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thanks for the response Mistermind.

 

After LLoyds said what they did, we went to Nationwide to see if she could open an account and she was turned down....now this is what amazes me..

 

My sister kept her account clean for several years, then through the last year had issues and that was just with Lloyds, she has no other accounts, no other debts..yet this is the way she is treated and it worries her a lot, being on DLA for depression / stress does not help.

 

Fortunatly, we have a joint account, so we have moved everything to that account today.

 

As far as her credit card is concerned, it looks like it may be unenforceable, but we will wait and see, we haven't gone after charges with it yet, think that is taking a different direction to her main account. However we did change the contact phone number to my mobile and put myself to speak on her behalf.

 

What really amazes me...is that after years of banking with Lloyds how uncaring they are of their customers...there wasn't a how can we help sort this out or nothing like that...it was purely defensive...'this is the banks view'.

 

The real funny thing was...when we went to the bank today the adviser...a nice woman, said basically ..you are on benefits and we cant touch your money, i know this, then after a phone call how that really changed...

 

And...if she files for right of appropriation they will close her account with a £2k overdraft...but we cant say close the account...and they would then say..we cant do that because of the overdraft...it's going to be a rocky road with the Lloyds..and i need to spare my sister of this pain as much as I can or it will break her...and heaven help the bank if that would happen.

 

OP's

CASES:

 

HALIFAX

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - statements received.

Waiting for money to do N1

CAPITAL ONE

WON - Fees, purchase interest, court costs and Stat.

VANQUIS BANK

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

I hate this company

LLOYDS TSB BANK (SISTER)

20/09/2007 - statements received

22/11/2007 - N1 filed

Lloyds TSB CREDITCARD (SISTER)

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

20/09/2007 - statements received

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Opalie, if an account is closed the overdrawn balance remains payable. The difference is no further penalty charges can be levied on a closed account. If it is made plain to the bank that due to age and unemployment there is no point the bank adding on further monthly debit interest then the bank will probably stop the latter, and wait for monthly repaymentd to reduce the closing balance. But if the account holder owns a house then the bank will chase harder. So for practical reasons it may pay to close this account if the parties so wish. Nationwide is not the only fish in the sea. If your sis would derive a feeling of normalisation to have a new account opened elsewhere starting with a clean sheet, then suggest you:

 

click SEARCH on the blue bar near the top, click ADVANCED SEARCH, input keyword PARACHUTE, search THREAD TITLE only, click SEARCH at the bottom --> this would then list numerous threads showing how to proceed.

 

30 years ago bank staff were human beings, respected by the local community for their integrity and understanding. But over the past 20 years staff headcount was cut, and human contact with customers replaced by IT automation. A large branch can hold 50,000 accounts. Anyone who tries to ring the branch now gets put through to impersonal Service Centres, or worse still Indian call centres, who have never heard of the customer.

 

Centralising and dehumanising changes transformed high street retail banks into anonymous wholesale money warehouses. Emphasising the letter rather than the spirit of banking, bankers became unhelpful to customers on whom they rely to deposit the capital which keeps banks afloat. With banker and customer no longer on speaking terms, not surprising that at Northern Rock a small whiff of distrust led to self-fulfilling suspicion, then to the first run on a British bank since the 1830's. Today the chairman of Northern Rock resigned. The brand name has suffered such irreparable damage that it cannot come back under its own name. Let other banks beware.

 

 

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I would also write to the FOS this is a flagrant breach of the banking code, the benefits act and the FSA waiver.

 

The bank are supposed to carry on investigating cases of hardship not threaten account closure.

 

I cannot think of a worse situation than your sister is in, she is disabled, totally dependant on government benefits and help from you yet the bank see nothing wrong in depriving her of her state benefits to fill their pockets.

 

it's disgusting

 

Here's the thread for parachute accounts, there are loads listed and what you get with them

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/13832-do-you-need-parachute.html

 

pete

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  • 1 month later...

NI filed in court yesterday for the bank account.

 

Did it on the benefits area, so will wait and see if it gets stayed or heard.

 

Credit card is another area, will post under the thread I have there, as I am a little stuck.

 

Op's

CASES:

 

HALIFAX

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - statements received.

Waiting for money to do N1

CAPITAL ONE

WON - Fees, purchase interest, court costs and Stat.

VANQUIS BANK

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

I hate this company

LLOYDS TSB BANK (SISTER)

20/09/2007 - statements received

22/11/2007 - N1 filed

Lloyds TSB CREDITCARD (SISTER)

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

20/09/2007 - statements received

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Subscribing:)

 

Els

BANK CHARGES CAMPAIGN CONTINUES - PLEASE SIGN THIS PETITION

 

Aktiv Kapital £300.00 SETTLED IN FULL

Capital One £741.47 SETTLED IN FULL

Citi Cards £1221.00 SETTLED IN FULL

LTSB(personal) £3854.28 SETTLED IN FULL

LTSB(business) £7487.97 SETTLED IN FULL

 

What poor education I have received has been gained in the University of Life

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  • 3 weeks later...

Well got the NI back from court, as deemed served on Lloyds, and on same day a letter from the courts saying they intend to defend, and have 28 days from the 5th of December.

 

No doubt they will be applying for a stay, will keep you posted as I can.

 

Op's

CASES:

 

HALIFAX

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - statements received.

Waiting for money to do N1

CAPITAL ONE

WON - Fees, purchase interest, court costs and Stat.

VANQUIS BANK

07/09/2007 - S.A.R SENT

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

I hate this company

LLOYDS TSB BANK (SISTER)

20/09/2007 - statements received

22/11/2007 - N1 filed

Lloyds TSB CREDITCARD (SISTER)

18/09/2007 - C.C.A SENT

20/09/2007 - statements received

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