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    • I came across this discussion recently and just wanted to give my experience of A Shade Greener that may help others regarding their boiler finance agreement.
       
      We had a 10yr  finance contract for a boiler fitted July 2015.
       
      After a summer of discontent with ASG I discovered that if you have paid HALF the agreement or more you can legally return the boiler to them at no cost to yourself. I've just returned mine the feeling is liberating.
       
      It all started mid summer during lockdown when they refused to service our boiler because we didn't have a loft ladder or flooring installed despite the fact AS installed the boiler. and had previosuly serviced it without issue for 4yrs. After consulting with an independent installer I was informed that if this was the case then ASG had breached building regulations,  this was duly reported to Gas Safe to investigate and even then ASG refused to accept blame and repeatedly said it was my problem. Anyway Gas Safe found them in breach of building regs and a compromise was reached.
       
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      • 3 replies
    • Dazza a few months ago I discovered a good friend of mine who had ten debts with cards and catalogues which he was slavishly paying off at detriment to his own family quality of life, and I mean hardship, not just absence of second holidays or flat screen TV's.
       
      I wrote to all his creditors asking for supporting documents and not one could provide any material that would allow them to enforce the debt.
       
      As a result he stopped paying and they have been unable to do anything, one even admitted it was unenforceable.
       
      If circumstances have got to the point where you are finding it unmanageable you must ask yourself why you feel the need to pay.  I guarantee you that these companies have built bad debt into their business model and no one over there is losing any sleep over your debt to them!  They will see you as a victim and cash cow and they will be reluctant to discuss final offers, only ways to keep you paying with threats of court action or seizing your assets if you have any.
       
      They are not your friends and you owe them no loyalty or moral duty, that must remain only for yourself and your family.
       
      If it was me I would send them all a CCA request.   I would bet that not one will provide the correct response and you can quite legally stop paying them until such time as they do provide a response.   Even when they do you should check back here as they mostly send dodgy photo copies or generic rubbish that has no connection with your supposed debt.
       
      The money you are paying them should, as far as you are able, be put to a savings account for yourself and as a means of paying of one of these fleecers should they ever manage to get to to the point of a successful court judgement.  After six years they will not be able to start court action and that money will then become yours.
       
      They will of course pursue you for the funds and pass your file around various departments of their business and out to third parties.
       
      Your response is that you should treat it as a hobby.  I have numerous files of correspondence each faithfully organised showing the various letters from different DCA;s , solicitors etc with a mix of threats, inducements and offers.   It is like my stamp collection and I show it to anyone who is interested!
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Bill Of Sales and repossession of goods - much of this is now out of date dx 2016


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  • 4 weeks later...
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Hi There

 

Ive read all the posts under this thread with great interest!

 

I have a car on finance, secured on a bill of sale. Its not with LBL its with TFC. I was convinced that the BOS and CCA were innacurate but after sending the papers to my local CAB, they returned them as ok.

With all due respect, im not sure the lady at CAB knew quite what she was looking for so ive since been trying to find out info on what seems to be an incredibly complicated issue.

My BOS is signed by the man who sold me the car and organised the loan and weirdly enough also has my signature, even though i didnt sign it on the day! The documents are registered on 28th and the car was purchased on 21st, so im not sure how that works in terms of the 7 day rule? Is it 7 clear days or does it include the day you made the purchase? There are also some inconsistencies in the figures.

 

After reading all the information on this thread, its still not clear, what happens if the BOS is void? Are you still liable for the remaining debt? And which bit of the debt, the cost of the car or the overall finance arrangement? If the BOS is void, does that mean they cant take your car and if so, can you sell the car to pay off any outstanding arrears with TFC?

 

Sorry if im going over old ground, but im still a bit confused!

 

Thanks

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  • 1 month later...

The information in this thread is excellent.

 

I am currently trying to help a relative who had a fixed sum loan agreement (secured by a Bill of Sale) for a car. After having paid well over £4,000 off a £6,000 agreement she got into difficulties and the vehicle was "re-possessed"... (She had agreed to, and had been maintaining higher payments for the last six months, and the total loan would have been cleared by Feb next year.)

 

The vehicle was sold at auction ("as is" and without documents - V5C etc) and raised less than £800

 

I have helped her in gaining a copy of the Bill of Sale, and it would appear (judging by the advice in this thread) that the Bill of Sale is void and invalid - (dated 20 days after the original agreement, and NOT in the proper form) - so what should she do now? Should she take the finance company to court for an un-lawful re-possession and seek damages? If so, what should she claim? The realistic value of the vehicle that was "unlawfully" seized, or everything she had paid on the account to date?

 

Any help or advice greatly appreciated.

 

 

Cheers

Lefty

If the left side of the brain controls your right, and the right side controls your left, then left-handed people are always in their right mind!

 

Please help to support this site with a small donation... every little helps...

 

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How was the vehicle reposessed

 

in the street

on her drive

 

did she hand over the keys

 

Hi - thanks for replying.

 

Vehicle was repossessed from her private drive. She was in the house at the time. Nobody knocked or made themselves known to her. She only realised the car had gone a couple of hours later. (just a note pushed through the door)

 

She had, of course, received a default order some time earlier, but had been trying hard to make extra payments.

 

Cheers

Lefty

If the left side of the brain controls your right, and the right side controls your left, then left-handed people are always in their right mind!

 

Please help to support this site with a small donation... every little helps...

 

CAG- The Nation's Weekly Info Store!

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And how long ago was it repo

 

taken (repossessed) two weeks ago. Sold at Auction 1 week ago

 

 

Cheers

Lefty

If the left side of the brain controls your right, and the right side controls your left, then left-handed people are always in their right mind!

 

Please help to support this site with a small donation... every little helps...

 

CAG- The Nation's Weekly Info Store!

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Well its def unlawful recession of contract you are entited to annother car

same age and milage or cash allternartive

 

all payments made with 8 %

 

and termination of all responsabilities as to the agreement

 

are we talking the funding co as the finance company

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Well its def unlawful recession of contract you are entited to annother car

same age and milage or cash allternartive

 

all payments made with 8 %

 

and termination of all responsabilities as to the agreement

 

are we talking the funding co as the finance company

 

Yep - funding co is finance company. Used car dealer who specialises in car credit for "people who can't get car credit" - the car dealer exclusively uses just one local finance company. All one and the same, I suspect.

 

So, as it was NOT a hire purchase agreement (the workings of which I am pretty well clued up on - I mainly over-see the BrightHouse and rent to own HP forum here at CAG) and WAS a fixed sum loan agreement (with a BILL OF SALE as security - essentially a CONDITIONAL Bill of Sale) AND, as it most certainly appears, the Bill of Sale is VOID - does that now mean the repossession was well and truly unlawful? If the Bill of Sale WAS valid (which it wasn't) then the repossession on her private property WOULD have been lawful?

 

In essence, then, what you are suggesting is that the finance company is now LIABLE for the value of the car (at the time of repossession) but NOT (as would be the case in a Hire Purchase agreement) a full return of ALL monies paid on the account?

 

Really appreciate your help

 

 

Cheers

Lefty

If the left side of the brain controls your right, and the right side controls your left, then left-handed people are always in their right mind!

 

Please help to support this site with a small donation... every little helps...

 

CAG- The Nation's Weekly Info Store!

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The finance agreement has now been terminated through unlawful recession of contract

 

you are entitled to a car of same age and milage all free from the finance co or cash allternative

 

all repayments made with 8 %

 

the law is quite specific on this

 

ive done four claims myself on just this matter and won all of them

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The finance agreement has now been terminated through unlawful recession of contract

 

you are entitled to a car of same age and milage all free from the finance co or cash allternative

 

all repayments made with 8 %

 

the law is quite specific on this

 

ive done four claims myself on just this matter and won all of them

 

Excellent! Thanks again...

 

 

Cheers

Lefty

If the left side of the brain controls your right, and the right side controls your left, then left-handed people are always in their right mind!

 

Please help to support this site with a small donation... every little helps...

 

CAG- The Nation's Weekly Info Store!

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If you need help composing a letter give me a bell

 

you need to send the fiunding co a letter of dispute and give them eight weeks to comply or court action will start

 

two of my victories were against tfc

the other two was welcome

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If you need help composing a letter give me a bell

 

you need to send the fiunding co a letter of dispute and give them eight weeks to comply or court action will start

 

two of my victories were against tfc

the other two was welcome

 

Again, I really appreciate your help, and your hard earnt knowledge on these matters... AND I see EXACTLY the point you make... but...

 

...SURELY much of her case MUST rest on the fact that the security (the Bill of Sale) is null and void? Had the Bill of Sale been enforceable (again, which it was not) then the finance company DID have permission from a court to repossess from private land? (This permission would have been embedded in the Bill of Sale by virtue of it being registered and stamped by the Royal Court of Justice?)

 

I just want to be completely accurate and sure with the advice I give.

 

Cheers

Lefty

If the left side of the brain controls your right, and the right side controls your left, then left-handed people are always in their right mind!

 

Please help to support this site with a small donation... every little helps...

 

CAG- The Nation's Weekly Info Store!

;)

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Even with a bill of sale the finance co would need an order from the court to reposess from private land

 

remember

 

a credit agreement with all the rights runs along side the bill of sale

 

a bill of sale does not give cart blanch to the creditor

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If we are talking of a vehicle on the public highway

 

then thats a different matter

 

Nope. Definitely a private drive. Off road and on private property. Furthermore, the property is privately rented, so - technically - the vehicle was taken from a 3rd party's private property..! (The address of the property is the home of the debtor though - and the vehicle was correctly registered at that address, as was the paperwork for the fixed sum loan agreement.)

 

Again, really appreciated!

 

 

Cheers

Lefty

If the left side of the brain controls your right, and the right side controls your left, then left-handed people are always in their right mind!

 

Please help to support this site with a small donation... every little helps...

 

CAG- The Nation's Weekly Info Store!

;)

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taken (repossessed) two weeks ago. Sold at Auction 1 week ago

 

 

Cheers

Lefty

 

 

Hi lefty. i would like to look over the bill of sale .

the CA repossession does not cover a bill of sale. if the car belongs to the loan owner and was at the address of which was stated on the bill of sale then they would not need a court order to remove the car. this is term 8 of the bill of sale.

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  • 2 months later...
Going back to obtaining a copy of the BOS, who would you need to make the payment out to? Royal Courts of Justice?

 

Hi Lefty

 

Yes, make your cheque payable to either the Royal Courts of Justice or the name you state above. Trust me they will cash it.

 

Further; I agree with you.... If you can get a declaration that the bill of sale is void.... Then whether they took the car from a private drive or a public highway; it would have been unlawful.

 

If you have all the details pertaining to the bill of sale; namely the name of the lender, the borrower and respective addresses alongwith the account number, the cost should be £5..., it may be more now, but call them to confirm ; )

 

Apple ; )

[COLOR="red"][B][CENTER]"Errors do not cease to be errors simply because they’re ratified into law.” [/CENTER][/B][/COLOR][B][CENTER] E.A. Bucchianeri[/CENTER][/B]

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  • 6 months later...

Hi everyone,

 

Looking for some plain, simple, easy to understand advice please?

 

I have/had a loan with Mobile Money (Bristol Office) which I took out in March 11. I do realise how stupid this was with hindsight. I immediately fell into difficulties due to family bereavements, extended hospital stays, etc, and as a result, did not make any payments on the loan.

 

On Friday 29th July, 2 men turned up to collect the car. They had a tow truck. I had been in touch with MM (by letter) asking for time to get caught up and proposing a payment scheme that would eventually get me back on track. I was awaiting a response. To cut a long story short, they left with the car (one of them drove it away - it wasn't taken on the truck). The person I had communicated with previously was on holiday, but spoke with the area manager, who advised me he would look at it monday 1st August, as he had left the office for the weekend. He did confirm verbally that the car would not be auctioned until the 15th Aug, and that full settlement would prevent this. He also promised me he would email confirmation of that when he got home, but nothing to date received (and he will not answer his phone to me).

 

Before anyone points out that I am an idiot and perhaps get what I deserve for defaulting on my payments, then let me just say that I know, and if there is nothing I can do then so be it. I will take it on the chin.

 

If however there is anything I can do, then I would be very grateful for any constructive advice given. A few points that may be noteworthy are:

 

 

  • I asked the 'bailiff' from LT Holdings to see his SIA ID - he told me he did not need one (his ID was actually pathetic. I could create a more professional looking one on my laptop and home printer. No phone number, no ID number, just photo, his name, company name. Nothing else!) He also has no uniform (mucky jeans and t-shirt)
  • As they were leaving they gave me a letter from MM titled 'Repossession Instruction & Authority'. At the bottom of this it says 'Enclosed: Bill of Sale, Copy Credit Agreement, Copy Default notice (Not to be left with third parties)' - None of these were enclosed, and I do not consider myself to be a third party.
  • Some of my personal possessions were/are in the car. Most notably my sat nav, which I got one of the guys to add to the Vehicle Receipt.
  • At the time of signing the documents and taking out the loan, there were only 2 people present - The rep who dealt with me, and the branch manager. With regards to what (I think) I read about the BoS, surely if the manager is a witness, he is not a proper one as he has a vested interest?

Having spent a few hours trawling through the 15 pages here, I am not much wiser sadly, as what I really need is step by step instructions laid out in layman's terms. I am not too good with technical language sadly...

 

Many thanks for any advice that anyone may have for me. :wink:

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Oh yes - one more additional point. The car is essential to my job, and I have had to hand in my notice as a result (I have no alternative transport available). This was pointed out to the area manager, as well as the 'bailiffs', but totally disregarded.

 

It may not have any bearing, but I wanted you all to have as full a picture as possible.

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I have just read the above information, I have just had my car taken by balifs. They removed the car under a log book loan from the previous owner who is a friend. I new nothing about about the LBL untill the balif turned up in January this year to reposse the car. The car was at the time in a garage having a new engine new clutch and MOT. All of which I paid for. The car was then given to me because the promise of payment from my friend fell through just after I paid for the engine by credit card on the 8th January this year. This was to cover the money used for the repair due to the fact that I had paid for all the repairs to the said vehical.ey I paid to put the car back in working order. i contacted the LBL and told them that the car was mine because the person that had the loan couldnt pay me the money I had used to pay all the garage bills. I kept calling but nothing happened. My friend had not recieved any kind of paper work telling him of their intentions to remove the car. Untill they came this week.

After reading other posts I have taken a closer look at the bill of sale

I have fouind several opoints that would void the bill of sale. Can any one pease confirm this for me

There was only two signiture on the bill of sale the agent for the lender and my friend the borrower. Its states that the witness has to be independant of names listed on the bill

I would also like the bill of sale that was used to enforce the removal of goods to be cheaked because I really dont no what to look for would anyone be able to do this

 

i doubt they were bailiffs but repro guys claiming to be such

 

if the vehicle was on private property then they had no legal right to take it.

 

baliffs only come after its been to court,

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

 

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

 

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

 

 

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