help with cabot, b/card and cca

[karen654321]

Hiya

 

I have sent a cca request off to cabot who are dealing with an old barclaycard debt of about £1000.

 

I had which looks like a standard letter back saying that they will contact barclaycard on my behalf to get this copy.

 

So i sent b/card a cca request and have never heard anything back.

 

Both of these companys have now had there 12+2 and 30 days and ive not heard anything from them.

 

I dont know whether i should just leave it now and see if they contact me or if i have to report it or what to do really.

 

The other thing is barclays and kings hill (cabot) have both put entries on my credit report for the same debt is this correct?

 

Any help would be appreciated

 

karen

[Seahorse]

Nope, there should only be ONE entry per default in your credit report. Write to the CRA's and tell them that the Barclaycard default should NOT be there. They will contact BC, who SHOULD authorise the removal. If they don't, you will have cause to report BC to all and sundry.

 

What I would do now is, SAR BC AND Cabot. Neither of them have any option; they MUST comply with your SAR within 40 days.

 

DO that and wait to see what that chucks up before planning your next move.

[karen654321]

Thanks seahorse. I have already sent a sars. With barclaycard i got lots of old statements and with cabot i got statements and a letter stating that the debt has been taken over by cabot.

 

i have contacted cra and let them know so hopefully will hear back from them soon.

 

thanks

 

karen

[Seahorse]

Hmmm. Interesting. So, nowhere in the bundle from Barclaycard is the "goodbye" letter that you got from Cabot, supposedly printed by Barclaycard? DID you get a Barclaycard goodbye letter sent to you by Cabot?

[karen654321]

Yes i did get this letter sent by cabot headed up barclaycard. I presume this is a standard letter then that you know about.

 

Any ideas on what to do next?

 

thanks

 

karen

[Seahorse]

Oh, yes. Cabot CLAIM that they send you a letter from Barclaycard (the "Goodbye" letter), along with their supposed Notice of Assignment (The "hello" letter). But it has long been suspectd that CABOT produce both letters. Now, I'm not entirely sure of the legality of this, but at the very least, I'd call it misrepresentation. Others might call it fraud. I have questioned Cabot about this, but at no time have they said, "Oh, yes. We do make the letter up, but Barclaycard said it's OK."

 

So as far as I'm concerned, I've been approached by a company, who are telling me they have bought a debt from Barclaycard, and to prove their claim, they send two letters. Both of which they produce themselves. And folks are supposed to believe that? And that's definitely misrepresentation, as far as I'm concerned. It basically means that, at no time have I been informed by the Original Creditor that they have sold my account. So I have another nail for their coffin should it get as far as court.

 

Not everything needs to be acted on or questioned immediately. Sometimes it's just nice to know you have something in reserve.

[karen654321]

Im still confused. So Cabot have full ownership now of the account? So really its them thats failed to produce the cca not barclaycard?

As there time is up now to produce it do i need to do anything or just wait for there next move?

 

thanks

 

karen

[NailPost]

Ownership of the debt is one issue a SARN would resolve. Failure to comply would result in you filing a complaint to the Information Commissioner.

[Seahorse]

Yup. As Nailpost says, you SHOULD see a Deed of assignment in your bundle. But won't. There will very likely be NO indication that a lawful assignment has taken place. But STILL Cabot would like you to believe that they own the account, and are entitled to YOUR money. Just because they say so.

 

I'm afraid you will have to get used to doing a lot of complaining. But it DOES get addictive and fun.

[itsamomentintime]

if there is no deed of assignment, what implications does that have?

[karen654321]

Thanks for that. So the fact that neither barclaycard or cabot have produced a cca and there time limit is up means i have to complain to whom?

 

Or do i just leave it and wait to see what they do?

 

thanks

[Seahorse]

Well, Barclaycard should know better. The CCA DOES apply to them. Cabot are fixated on their mantra of "The CCA dosn't apply to them", so may be allowed the same sympathy you might give a person with an abnormaly low IQ.

 

But. You ARE entitled to complain to all and sundry. I would start with the Information Commissioners Office, Trading standards and OFT. Information Commissioners Office and OFT have websites, so complain from there. Trading standards will be in your local council's web site. (PM me if you need a hand with letters, as it will be helpful to point out the various sections of things that they have breached. But The Information Commissioners Office site at least lets you make a first complaint online, so you don't need to worry until they ask you to follow it up.)

 

You CAN complain to the Financial Ombudsman, who will slap a £400 fine on as soon as they investigate. But they will require you to have exhausted each company's complaints procedures first.

 

So the first thing you should do is a very quick letter to each. Doesn't need to be fancy. Something along the lines of..

 

"I refer you to my latest communication of (whatever the dates were), in which I requested documents as are my right under the Consumer Credit Act 1974. As I have had no response to my request, I have no other option but to invoke your complaints procedure. Please provide me with a copy of your Company's Complaints Resolution procedure, by return.

 

I do not need to remind you that I have recourse to escalate my complaint to the Financial Ombudsman, but I am giving you this opportunity to address my conerns before doing so.

 

I also intend to contact the folowing to advise them that I am unhappy with your conduct so far; Trading Standards, the Information Commissioner and the Office of Fair Trading."

 

Hopefully that will buck them up a little.

[Seahorse]

IAMIT, the fact that there is no DoA means that they cannot prove any assignment ever took place. Should it get to court, one of the things that should be asked for is a DoA. Not only will they need to produce it to prove their ownership, but it will show what was used as the vehicle to assign the account, whether the rights AND duties were assigned, whether the assignment was equitable or absolute. And perhaps any number of other juicy tidbits might appear.

 

This is something their solicitors would probably hold back on, right up to the very last possible moment. But if court action is imminent, it IS something which should be insisted on, even if you have to keep asking over and over again.

 

To recap... No DoA means no proof of Assignment, as the OC have not notified you of the Assignment; it's merely Cabot's word for it so far.

 

Equally, no Agreement means no proof of a debt in the first place, and even if one DID exist, it is unenforcable. So by continuing to try to collect on an unenforcable debt, they will be digging themselves into an ever deepening hole, with the possibility that YOU may be entitled to take THEM to court.

[djdave]

Hope this is useful:

 

In my case I SAR'd Barclaycard and there was no Notice of Assignment or any similar letter in their reply. I wrote back and asked specifically if such a letter existed in B'Card's records. It does not. So who produced it?

[Seahorse]

I think we all know the answer to that Dave, don't we?

 

I have just sent Barclaycard another S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) demanding all sorts of juicy documents. Just in case they think that all I'm after are my statements. I have also tried to get Cabot to admit that they produce the letter, but so far I've had neither a denial OR an admission. So if BC come back and tell me that they HAVEN'T sent me a "goodbye" letter, I shall be making some rather serious accusations. Perhaps everyone should ask BC where the "goodbye" letter is when they get their SAR bundle?

 

Depending on the answers to the above, I will need to make enquiries as to whether or not this constitutes fraud, if it is true. I'm damned sure I'd be locked up for demanding money with no proof to back up that I was owed it. So why should Big Business be any different?

[itsamomentintime]

with the possibility that YOU may be entitled to take THEM to court.

 

 

what offence would you levy against them?

[karen654321]

Thanks for the info everyone. Have done another letter to each for the complaints procedure. Will keep you posted.

 

karen

[karen654321]

Well still havent heard back from b/card or cabot. Gone very quiet. Dont know if i should be worried or whether they are searching high and low for this credit agreement.

 

Im a little concernced as i have now stopped the £5 per week payments to cabot. The stories ive read about them on here are scary.

 

I just hope i dont get woken up one morning with balliffs at the door.

 

will keep you posted ( if the balliffs dont take the pc)

 

karen

[pmhcfc]

I just hope i dont get woken up one morning with balliffs at the door.

 

will keep you posted ( if the balliffs dont take the pc)

 

karen

 

Stop worrying - this is not going to happen.

[rory32]

Bailiffs need a court order to turn up. As previously stated it's not going to happen.

 

I sent Cabot a CCA request at the beginning of April, not a peep out of them since except to say that my account was being put on hold and a half *rsed attempt at a statement of account from them about a month later.

[Dibsthefrenchie]

I do not wish to hijack this post, but it would appear that Cabot are not the only DCA printing the notice of assignment, as Thames Credit also sent me a notice allegedly from Marks & Spencer, with a smudged logo, no personal details on the letter, addressed to Dear Customer and unsigned and Thames Credit tell me don't need a CCA as they didn't purchase the agreement.

Sorry Karen, I do have my own thread for this, but i'm intrigued by the legality of this and just how common is this deceptive practice?

I will follow your thread and wish you luck, i'm still waiting to actually hear back from Cabot!

[karen654321]

Thanks for the advice everyone so basically just sit tight and wait to hear.

Its just really strange that i was getting bombarded with letters from them and not anything for a while now.

 

will keep you posted

 

karen

[karen654321]

Ive had a letter from cabot today apologsising to take so long to deal with my complaint but they are still looking into it and will be in contact soon.

 

very polite letter actually..

 

will keep you posted

 

karen

[djdave]

Well under FOS rules they've got 8 weeks. Cabot did send you a copy of the FOS leaflet, didn't they?

[karen654321]

No not yet. maybe that will come with the next letter.

 

thanks

 

karen