iainlinsdell v Natwest

[steven4064]

Is the court date for a prelim hearing or a full hearing? If it is the latter, you will get to do a court bundle - you can make a much better case then. It might be worth looking at the statement of evidence in any case, and even taking that to a prelim hearing with other stuff (such as draft directions, removal of stay stuff)

[iainlinsdell]

Hi Steven,

Its a prelim hearing. I got a "AQ should be dispensed with..." response from the transferring court and have rec'd this prelim hearing date. I have the "Got a court date? later stages" thread to help me. However, other threads seem to indicate that I should be filing a draft directions thingy and possibly ringing the court to offer to pay £100. Is the money to pay for allocation to small claims and do I need to pay it? I'm a bit confused suddenly...

[iainlinsdell]

Hi Steven,

I've also noticed that others in the same position are approaching the banks to try to force settlement prior to the prelim hearing. Is this worth a go? There are some suggested letters on the site along the lines of saving the court time etc. Waddya think? Thanks for all yer help BtW. Feels very scary without it!!!

[hedgey06]

I really wouldn't bother using the 'nudge' letters. This is your claim and you don't have to contact Cobbetts unnecessarily - you wait for them to defend the claim as opposed to asking them to settle by letter.

 

The guidance thread that you have (got a court date) explains everything that you need to take to the hearing with you as follows:

 

Stuff to take with you;

Bank statements & schedule of charges (in case they want to settle)

Allocation hearing Witness Statement

Draft order for directions & Reason's why they should be ordered

Copy of this order - page 1 & page 2 (to demonstrate that other courts are already routinely ordering those directions in small claims cases)

Statement of evidence (to refer to if necessary)

*Copy of the text of the Lincoln 'abuse' order

*List of settled cases

 

*Optional - take if you want to show it to the judge and politely suggest that a similar order may be appropriate in your claim.

 

I'd also suggest taking the 'stay' template (completed with your own details) to give to the Judge should Cobbetts attempt to have your claim 'stayed' at the hearing.

[glensorie]

Hi Iain.

I actually played with the idea of sending Cobbetts a nudge letter or two and whether it would be more detrimental or not in the long run, then I read this post by Bookworm on the cons of nudge letters, so decided against it. http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/show-post/post-1027160.html

I'm sure more learned people out there would argue this point but who am I to argue with the great Bookworm.

So I agree with Hedgey on this point.

Looks like we're neck and neck at the moment Iain, race you to the finishing line.

Glensorie.

[iainlinsdell]

thanks everyone. will wait it out and prepare for the hearing - its a bit like LA law... except they were all lawyers and I'm not.

[iainlinsdell]

Morning everyone,

I have today rec'd a letter from NATWEST offering me a settlement of £1300, (my case is for £2300 inc fees). This is the second time this has been offered. The letter includes the following:

 

"We have asked the FSA to suspend the normal timetable for dealing with bank charges complaints, and the FSA has agreed to this request subject to conditions that proect your rights."

 

It goes on to make the offer, then at the end it says;

 

"Once the legal proceedings between the OFT and the banks finish, we will resolve your complaint as quickly as possible and apply the (test case) principles. This may produce a smaller or larger figure when compared with the current offer. We are sorry that we have not been able to respond in full to your complaint now, but we (together with the FSA and OFT) think that it is necessary to resolve the key legal issues before we decide how we should respond to your complaint."

 

I can see that they are trying to make people jump at the offer rather than wait, and I am content to wait it out and go to my prelim hearing on 21st Sept. However, how should I respond? Is there a way of encouraging the judge not to issue a stay? Is this letter just a way of forcing lower settlements?

 

What do people think?

[steven4064]

If you have a prelim on 21st you could wait until then. Have a look at this thread and take the application for the removal of a stay with you so that you can use the argument if a stay is requested at the hearing.

[iainlinsdell]

Hey there. Can I run something by you... I am running two accounts with the Natwest and when i recieve correspondance from them I get it twice; once for each account. In this case I have rec'd two goodwill offers, one for each account. One of them is for the full amount, the other for a paltry sum. Could I accept the offer on the first account and continue to pursue the other? I presume in this case I would need to inform the court and complete an amendment form. What do you think of this as an idea?

[steven4064]

You can do that. Once you have acceepted an offer (and once you actually have the money) you send in a from N279 to the court to tell them the case is sttled.

[iainlinsdell]

Does that mean that I reduce the amount of my claim to the charges for just the one account?

[steven4064]

have you done both accounts on one claim?

[iainlinsdell]

Yes, but they keep responding separately to each account.On one account they have offered a full settlement but on the other they have only offered About 25%. In the terms of acceptance, (i.e. box 1) they state;

 

"I understand that acceptance means that it is unlikely that I/we would be awarded a further sum even if the test case indicate that I/we could be entitled to a potentially larger amount."

 

As I have rec'd this form for both accounts I'm tempted to accept the offer for the full amount of one and amend my claim. However, I'm worried that ticking box 1 would mean that I'm foregoing my entitlement to claim the other amount. I suppose that I could write my own acceptance letter, stating my intention to pursue the other amount and my fees through the court. Waddya think???

[steven4064]

In that case write and accept as a partial settlement only (it may be a full settlement for one account but it is only a partial settlement of your claim). and explain that you intend to carry on for the full amount of £x. Ditch their terms of settlement.

[iainlinsdell]

Cheers Steven.

[iainlinsdell]

Hey there,

 

With ref to above, I have prepared a letter accepting partial settlement and would like to know what you think:

 

NatWest Customer Response Services Unit,

The Cornerstone,

60 South Gyle Crescent,

Edinburgh.

EH12 9WF.

 

11th August 2007

Sort Code: xxxxxx

Acct No: xxxxxxxxx

 

Dear Mr Higley,

 

Thank you for your correspondence related to the above account. In response, I would like to accept your goodwill offer, the sum representing the full amount of the claim on the account xxxxxxxx, your ref xxxxxxxx. Accordingly, I enclose the settlement form and trust you will action payment as soon as possible.

 

I should like to make clear that I view this only as a partial settlement of my claim, court ref xxxxxxxx. Your offer for account number xxxxxxxx, your ref xxxxxxx falls considerably short of the sum in my claim and therefore I decline this offer and will continue to pursue my claim for £xxxx plus court costs. I will write to the court to amend the amount of my claim once I have received the settlement sum from yourselves for account xxxxxxxx.

 

Further your correspondence, I have received a date to attend a preliminary hearing at my local county court. I feel that the courts have now adopted this approach to bank charges claims as a direct response to the banks wasting court time by stalling. I fully intend to attend the preliminary hearing and will argue strongly against the imposition of a stay on my case. If you would like to make another goodwill offer for account xxxxxxxx, you ref xxxxxxxx I would be happy to give it consideration as I feel that finding an expedient and amicable resolution to this matter would save both parties and the courts valuable time and resources.

 

 

Kind regards,

 

 

What do you think?

[steven4064]

Iain

 

I suggest the follwoing changes so that they are in no doubt that this is only a partial settlement - they are very slippery.

 

I wouldn't bother telling the court at this stage - your total claim still stands - tell the court when it is completely settled.

 

 

Dear Mr Higley,

 

Thank you for your correspondence related to the above account. In response, I would like to accept your offer as partial settlement of my total claim, as the sum represents the full amount of the claim on the account xxxxxxxx, your ref xxxxxxxx only. Accordingly, I enclose the settlement form and trust you will action payment as soon as possible. I have modified the form to make it clear that this is only a partial settlement. [I have also crossed out the confidentiality clause as that is unacceptable to me].

 

I should like to reiterate that this is only as a partial settlement of my claim, court ref xxxxxxxx. Your offer for account number xxxxxxxx, your ref xxxxxxx falls considerably short of the sum in my claim and therefore I will continue to pursue my claim for £xxxx plus court costs.

[iainlinsdell]

That's fab, cheers mate, I feel like I should be payin yer!!!

[iainlinsdell]

Oh, BtW, there isn't a conf clause on it. It simply says that I should understand that it is unlikely that I would be awarded a further sum even if the test case indicates that I could e entitled to larger amount. That is what was causing me concern... that I would unwittingly agree to the full claim being settled.

 

Thanks again.

[steven4064]

That's why I thought you should make it absolutely clear on the letter. In fact I wondered whether you should not use their form - just send the letter. Even if you modify the form they still might not realise that you are going on with the claim.