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    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
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    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
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    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 161 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Sage v NatWest. **I WON!!**


katesage
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Hi

 

Great site!

 

I've called NatWest 4 days ago. They said that to get info on all charges, you don't need to request all statements, if you write to your local branch and ask for a list of all charges, this will be provided free of charge.

 

The guy I spoke to was really helpful and explained all of this to me. He said it was a good way to escape the £5 charge too.

 

Guess what - I wrote to my local branch and I had the relevant info today - saves me sifting through 6 years worth of statements and saved me a fiver!

 

Hope this helps others.

 

James

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Doh!!!!! :eek:

Well I hope they don't miss anything out as it's not a full lega SAR disclosure but hey - well done that man. Good for the newcommers too.

[SIZE=1] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=black][B]NatWest [/B] Offer accepted - 24/07/06 - £615[/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=black]-----------------------------------------------[/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=black][B]Cap One [/B] Prelim - 22/08/06[/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=#000000]LBA sent - 06/09/06 [/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=#000000] MCOL issued 06/10/06 Served 11/10/06. Acknowledged - Deadline 25/10/06 [COLOR=Red] Offer of full settlement via personal cheque accepted £269. Wait 14 days in post for cheque from - 07/11/06 [/COLOR] [/COLOR] [/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=2][COLOR=magenta][B][COLOR=darkslateblue]Hit the [/COLOR][COLOR=darkslateblue][URL="https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr"][COLOR=red]DONATE BUTTON[/COLOR] [/URL]and give 5% back to support this site! And don't forget the [COLOR=red]survey ;) [/COLOR][/COLOR][/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [/SIZE]

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Oooh I've been having fun!

 

Rang Natwest Current Account to request statements, explained about 'lost' DPA's (all three of them!!) they agreed to send me all statements for a fiver, couldn't have been nicer although they did ask why? Totally honest and upfront to the lady, so i'll probably get naff all!!!

Then rang credit cards.........totally different! 'No, DPA requests don't cover statements, that'll be 3 quid per statement'

Obviously I beg to differ.........Put thru to supervisor..........who said the same thing, over and over and over!!! I told her i had sent full DPA request so she needed to supply me this info. She said she could help me no further because she didn't know whether what i was saying was correct, could i please ring head office.

This is the funny bit, she then said, if head office agreed with my point of view could they 'kindly send a memo to Southend, to enable them to give accurate advice to customers making these requests'

Ha bloody ha!! I then rang the Customer Relations number supplied from the contact details for Natwest. Not Head office i found out. The first question after I explained was ' and did credit cards give u this number'?!

I said no 'I had it on file'!!! Any way she got straight onto my complaint, said she'd investigate missing DPAs credit card request etc. Lo and behold I got a call from a lovely Mrs Carpenter who agreed to send me all my credit card

statements pronto, gratis.

and yes...I did say to 'head office',Credit Cards, Southend would appreciate a memo from you guys to explain what they can and can't offer customers, they are pretty confused and would appreciate guidance from head office' I could almost hear her retching!!!!!!

They are not happy bunny's:p

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'No, DPA requests don't cover statements, that'll be 3 quid per statement'

Obviously I beg to differ.

 

This is quite correct.

 

DPA requests do not cover bank statements (or credit card statements), so it is important you do not request statements. Instead request a list of charges. If they then decide to send you statements because it is easier for them, then fine - but this is their choice. You can't request statements under the DPA.

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Opinions given herein are made informally by myself as a lay-person in good faith based on personal experience. For legal advice you must always consult a registered and insured lawyer.

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Thanks for that Barracad:)

Now i'm really confused, I thought that Durant v FSA 2003 clarified that statements and all transactional data did fall under the data protection act.

I know its open to interpretation but as statements represent the most comprehensive record of info on a subject held by a bank, I thought that for practicality purposes this was now covered????

Strangely the second lady Mrs Carpenter also agreed to send statements as she now believed they were subject to SAR. It was my mentioning the 'lost' DPA that caused her to agree to comply with my wishes.

Can anyone recommend a thread that explores this fully, I can see there are subtleties and I dont wish to prejudice my case with basic c*** ups!!

kate

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just found one of the posts that led to me forming my opinion

 

Repy to them making sure that they undersatnd that they have received a Data Protection Act request from you.

Quote Durant (linked in the library) that it has been held that data does include statements. Remind them that they have fiduciary duty towards you under which they are obliged to excercise utmost care in the accuracy of the statements which they make to you and that to make a false representation would be a serious breach of this duty and that if they persist that you may bring the matter to the attention of the Court as well as the Information Commissioner whene you make your complaint.

 

Remind them also that they have a contractual as well as a statutory duty to comply fully with your reasonable requests unther UK legislation - viz. the Data protection Act and this also might be brought to the attention of the court.

 

hope you can see why i'm lost?!:p

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Statements arrived yesterday in double wrapped brown envelope, taped up properly, all statements requested going back to 2001. Not bad considering I only called up for them last wednesday. 10/10 for prompt serveice.

 

If any one can answer my previous query I'd be most grateful.

 

Now to tot up all those charges.................................:p

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Wow Kate that's great! Really pleased for you.

 

Checked my post last night and nothing :mad: This is really pi**ing me off now. All I have now are statements from 28/12/00 -> 03/10/02 which they sent last friday. Where are the rest!?!?!?!

 

Going to call them again now...

 

Watching for answer to above also! :rolleyes:

 

Pixl

[SIZE=1] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=black][B]NatWest [/B] Offer accepted - 24/07/06 - £615[/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=black]-----------------------------------------------[/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=black][B]Cap One [/B] Prelim - 22/08/06[/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=#000000]LBA sent - 06/09/06 [/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=#000000] MCOL issued 06/10/06 Served 11/10/06. Acknowledged - Deadline 25/10/06 [COLOR=Red] Offer of full settlement via personal cheque accepted £269. Wait 14 days in post for cheque from - 07/11/06 [/COLOR] [/COLOR] [/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=2][COLOR=magenta][B][COLOR=darkslateblue]Hit the [/COLOR][COLOR=darkslateblue][URL="https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr"][COLOR=red]DONATE BUTTON[/COLOR] [/URL]and give 5% back to support this site! And don't forget the [COLOR=red]survey ;) [/COLOR][/COLOR][/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [/SIZE]

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Grrrrrrrr! Pix that is typical inconsistent behaviour from snatchwest, my friend just rang up to ask for her statements for a fiver. They tried to refuse and said she had to make a formal DPA written request for £10.

She said, Yes I know that and I will do that if you insist but my mate Kate XXXXXXX just got all hers for a fiver. Why are you treating us differently. She then gave them my account details and they said they'd look into it and call her back. They did 10 mins later and agreed to send all her statements for a fiver!

Really hope your statements arrive soon Pix cos you rang up for your before me??

Hardly consistent or fair really.

K:confused:

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Strangely, I also phoned up for my statements and they arrived in two batches. The first from July 2000 -> Oct 2002, then the second package with statements for Nov 2002 -> present, arrived several days later. Hope they arrive soon for you.

My original 2006 claim - Victorious!

13/06/2006 - Sent Data Protection Act Request (NatWest), recorded delivery.

19/06/2006 - Sent preliminary letter, requesting £3483

17/07/2006 - Sent LBA for revised figure of £3601 (after finally managing to open a parachute account with Lloyds TSB!)

07/08/2006 - Filed Moneyclaim for £4401

11/09/2006 - Defence received from Cobbetts

25/09/2006 - Sent AQ to court and CPR18 response to Cobbetts

30/09/2006 - AQ due at court

25/10/2006 - *WON* Cheque for full amount received from Cobbetts

 

"Things are made of littler things that jiggle"

- Richard Feynman

 

 

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Exactly the same thing here... I asked NW to send me all my old statements, reprinted... "why?" they asked. "For my records." I replied.

 

So they posted them all out... or rather they posted out all of them SINCE 2002...

 

I wasn't best pleased (especially as it cost me a tenner to get them), so I phoned up and complained. Nice girl in the call centre (they have quite a good team in the call centre, surprisingly), said she'd get previous ones in the post, going back to 1999. Well that covers the last six years which is all I'm aware I can claim on. :):rolleyes:

 

GOOD LUCK and thank you for running this thread, it's been very helpful (I'm about to start my own little war and think I'd better get one going too!

 

Ben

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Cheers Ben and welcome to the site.

Hope you get your earlier statements promptly. Can't predict when as they seem to be in a right muddle at the mo!

look forward to reading your thread.

good luck

Kate:)

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Ok just an update.

 

Credit card statements and personal account statements received ok, also letter from joyce tudor promising the rest of the statements and returning two of my DPA cheques, happy to provide all 3 accounts.

They owe me a total of £2724 on the current and credit card but i will claim them separately.

sent off preliminary request letter today for the personal account and the cc goes tomorrow.

hopefully biz statements will be here soon.

 

so far so good.........:-D

 

ps

my totally skint best mate (single mum holding down v low paid job) has received her statements, she rang me up squealing, oh my god they owe me nearly 4 grand. for her, that money literally means the end of being in debt and worry, literally lifechanging stuff. Thanks BAG:)

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Blimey!

I only posted my preliminary letter on tuesday, got bog off letter from stuart higley today. so that means staight to LBA. i dont think they are even bothering to read our letters properly anymore but at least quick reply, bringing moneyclaim even closer.:D

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Lucky minx! Glad to see at least you got a reply anyway ;-)

Running just behind...

 

Pixl

[SIZE=1] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=black][B]NatWest [/B] Offer accepted - 24/07/06 - £615[/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=black]-----------------------------------------------[/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=black][B]Cap One [/B] Prelim - 22/08/06[/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=#000000]LBA sent - 06/09/06 [/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=#000000] MCOL issued 06/10/06 Served 11/10/06. Acknowledged - Deadline 25/10/06 [COLOR=Red] Offer of full settlement via personal cheque accepted £269. Wait 14 days in post for cheque from - 07/11/06 [/COLOR] [/COLOR] [/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=2][COLOR=magenta][B][COLOR=darkslateblue]Hit the [/COLOR][COLOR=darkslateblue][URL="https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr"][COLOR=red]DONATE BUTTON[/COLOR] [/URL]and give 5% back to support this site! And don't forget the [COLOR=red]survey ;) [/COLOR][/COLOR][/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [/SIZE]

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Hi Pix

Dont know if the fact i sent mine special delivery made a difference? You sent your prelim before me didnt you?

It made me laugh that they said in my letter

'Having reviewed your account, I can find no instance where charges have been applied when they were not properly due. They have been associated with lack of covering funds in the account'

 

How did they have time to 'review' the account, they received my letter and replied to it on the same day!?

Still can't complain, I'm typing my LBA next!!:-D

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HI ALL

 

I've just typed up my LBA and as requested by Stuart Wriggly I will send it to head office, not Borehamwood.

Thats cool, but to whom do I address the letter? It seems weird just sending it to Natwest with no name or department to direct it towards.

 

Any help appreciated.

 

Kate:)

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Send it directly to the person who you received the last letter from.

 

Although your response probably mentioned using the Head Office address when filing your claim, you aren't filing the claim yet so just cary on communicating with the same person.

Opinions given herein are made informally by myself as a lay-person in good faith based on personal experience. For legal advice you must always consult a registered and insured lawyer.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Received negative response to my LBA from Stuart Higley.

 

Strangely he said....

 

Dear Ms KateSage

Thankyou for your further letter, undated but received here on 5 July 2006. (ooops!)

I note that you believe that we had acted as your fiduciary but this is not part of the normal banker/customer relationship and I am unsure of the basis of your contention.

However I am sorry that we have reached this poaition but I regret there is little that I can add constructively to my last letter and I note your proposed course of action. I have alerted our lawyers and litigation department blah blah blah.

Thank you for letting me know of your intentions.

Yours sincerely

Stuart Higley

(signed in proper fountain pen)

 

so i think i got his personal attention!

 

What on earth did he mean?

 

Strange comment that I havn't seen before.

 

Also since my LBA I have had 3 further £38 charges. Can I add these to my Moneyclaim or do I need to write another letter.

Now for Moneyclaim, which I will probably leave till next week when I get my broadband back. I'm on dial up at the moment and it is fairly slow.:(

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Well thats good news staffmem. Glad to see you are hitting the right spot anways Kate and making progress. My 'manager' is still sending me scribled notes and asking me to please call her...

[SIZE=1] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=black][B]NatWest [/B] Offer accepted - 24/07/06 - £615[/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=black]-----------------------------------------------[/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=black][B]Cap One [/B] Prelim - 22/08/06[/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=#000000]LBA sent - 06/09/06 [/COLOR][/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=1][COLOR=royalblue][COLOR=#000000] MCOL issued 06/10/06 Served 11/10/06. Acknowledged - Deadline 25/10/06 [COLOR=Red] Offer of full settlement via personal cheque accepted £269. Wait 14 days in post for cheque from - 07/11/06 [/COLOR] [/COLOR] [/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=2][COLOR=magenta][B][COLOR=darkslateblue]Hit the [/COLOR][COLOR=darkslateblue][URL="https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr"][COLOR=red]DONATE BUTTON[/COLOR] [/URL]and give 5% back to support this site! And don't forget the [COLOR=red]survey ;) [/COLOR][/COLOR][/B][/COLOR][/SIZE] [/SIZE]

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  • 3 weeks later...

KateSage, what are you playing at? You received a not on your nelly response to your LBA two days before I even sent my first letter. Then I sent an LBA, then I did MCOL, then I received a registered letter and now it's all over. Goodbye NatWest!

 

And all you've done is sit there ..... and do school holidays, build a cottage, study, work, etc AND AND AND make posts to this forum, 25 of them in the last two weeks. You could have completed your MCOL in less than the time you spent writing about it!

 

Consider yourself hassled :wink: Get on with it!

 

Good luck :grin:

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PMSL:D :D

 

You sound like my mum!!!!

Ok I have left this afternoon TOTALLY FREE to do it. Please keep me company guys, I expect a total b*llocking if i havnt done it by 4.30pm. Clock ticking!!

 

25 posts in 2 weeks, THATS Nothing!!! I used to do WAY more!!:D

 

Thanks so much !!

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