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V-bird vs Hinckley and Rugby BS [HRBS] Contemporaneous listing.


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Hi there, another day... another war.


This time a real biter.





Hinckley & Rugby Building Society,

Upper Bond Street,



LE10 1DG




2nd April 2007




Data Protection Act 1998

Subject Access Request




Dear Sir/Madam






Please supply me with a complete list of transactions and charges relating to my history with your organisation. Alternatively, a complete set of statements for that period will be acceptable.


Additionally, where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any member of your staff, or any other person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my business with you.


If you are unable to supply this data because there has been no such manual intervention, then please be so kind as to confirm this in your response.


I enclose the statutory maximum fee of £10. You have 40 days in which to comply. Furthermore, if I discover that you have levied disproportionate penalties against me, then I shall be reclaiming them, and also reclaiming the enclosed £10 DPA subject access request fee.


If there is specific information which you require in order to satisfy yourself as to my identity, please let me know by return. However, please note that the above address is the one which henceforth you are to use to communicate my private business to me.




Yours faithfully,

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They sent some stuff but not enough to really sort the wheat from the chaff... Their reply to the above.


19th April 2007

Dear xxxxx

Re: xxxxxx

I refer to your letter dated 2nd April 2007 with regard to subject access request under the Data Protection Act 1998 and your cheque for £10.00

Please find enclosed copies of your mortgage statements for the above account. As the lastdid not contain a breakdown of the fees charged I have enclosed a computer print out listing these charges individually together with copies of our tarriff of Mortgage Charges during the duration of this mortgage.

Whilst writing I note that in the original mortgage agreement the mortgage charges applicable at the time were a sealing fee of £75.00 with separate dispatch of title deeds of £25.00. The total fees for redemtion administration at the time you entered the mortgage agreement with the society amounted to £100.00.

As you have paid a higher fee than originally quoted, I have enclosed the Societys cheques for £95 split between the two mortgage holders to refund this overpayment.

I trust this is in order but if i can be of further assistance then please do not hesitate to contact me.

Yours etc etc.

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My reply to the above




Hinckley & Rugby Building Society,

Upper Bond Street,



LE10 1DG




22nd April 2007




Data Protection Act 1998

Subject Access Request




Dear Mrs. Whitwood



ACCOUNT: xxxxxxx



I am in receipt of your letter dated 19th April 2007 and its enclosures.


I note that you have failed [so far] to provide the full information that you obliged to under the Subject Access Request, as defined by the provisions of the Data Protection Act 1998.


I would draw your attention to the case of Durant v Financial Services Authority (2003) EWCA Civ 1746 and recommend that you use the details in that case as a guideline for the extent of information that I have asked and have paid in full for.


I would further advise you to contact the Information Commissioner’s Office, and seek guidance in the full scope of the request.


To clarify what I am asking for:


As per my Data Subject Access Request, I require disclosure of any notes (including computer screen notes), letters, documents, and any other evidence or information to or from both joint account holders that may have caused any action to be taken by yourselves in relation to the cause, level or financial break-down of these charges.


Also, where these charges have been applied due to manual intervention by any member of your staff or any other person, I require any evidence you hold of that manual intervention.

In an additional effort to assist you I include below a brief outline of the scope of your obligations, the list is not comprehensive, but it may be of value.



Statement… I consider that many ’charges’ that have been made to the account to be in fact penalties levied for my breach of contract and I require that you supply a certified breakdown of your actual costs incurred for each ’charge’ or breach.


You are, of course, aware that penalty charges are outlawed.


Statement… I require a full explanation of the ’legal’ charges, and your justification for imposing them without a breakdown or proper account of the charge, I require that you supply a certified proof of your actual costs incurred for each ’legal’ charge or breach of contract.


You are, of course, aware that penalty charges are outlawed.


Statement… I require a copy of the Insurance Policy for which I have been charged £617.44 providing sufficient information for me to ascertain whether or not this is a further penalty masquerading as a legitimate charge.


This ‘insurance’, presumably for the benefit of both parties, is not ‘part’ of a the mortgage per se and the figures given to xxxxxx should have reflected this.


Statement… I require a breakdown of how the sum of £8681.80 was arrived at as the arrears figure which was then subsequently given to xxxxxx


I contend and can prove that the redemption figure of £152,747.70 is too great and that the figure of £144,065.90 [£152,747.70 - £8,681.80] as the figure that would be the redemption amount if payments had been maintained as per the agreement is too small, leading to further errors in the final settlement sums.


Statement… I require the schedule of interest rates and mechanism for repayment sums and their change dates during the time of this mortgage so as to ascertain the exact amount of the errors mentioned above.


It has come to my attention that the regime of fees which you applied to my account is unlawful at Common Law, Statute and recent Consumer Regulations - a view that has been upheld by the recent announcement from the Office of Fair Trading.


Whilst I agree that some of the charges levied on my account may be legitimate expenses incurred by yourselves but until such evidence proving such legitimacy of all or any of the sums involved is supplied I dispute that they are a true reflection of your actual costs.


I now turn my attention to the sum of £95.00 refunded by yourselves.


Thank you for the return of this sum and it correct allocation, however please be aware that any future payments are to be sent to me alone, the reasons are simple, it is me that has paid for the arrears in their entirety and the insurances too.


The two elements that are in question are [a] the projected figure [as if payments were made on the due date] and the final redemption figure.


When the projected figure [a] has been proved wrong then I will claim the difference directly through the courts [as I have had to previously] and when the redemption figure is revised to its correct value the Society will refund the difference directly to me in the form of a cheque, it is NOT under any circumstances to be divided equally as you have done with the previous refund. As this will result in my having to issue a further Writ of Execution upon yyyyyyy


Please confer with xxxxxxx should you wish to verify the legal position in this matter.


Yours faithfully,

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Instant reply... the glorious power of sending through snail-mail and E-mail...

Dear xxxxxxxx

Thank you for your emails of 20 & 22 April. We understand what is required from a subject access request, however we were endeavouring to provide you the specific information you requested in you email of 2 April. I am in the process of gathering the further information you have requested in order to resolve your issues and would request that you provide us with a telephone number, so that I can contact you prior to sending out this information.

I trust this is in order and look forward to hearing from you.

Yours sincerely

I will give my mobile to them but will preface any conversation with 'something' but as yet i am not sure exactly what that preface should be... any suggestions???

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By sheer fluke the 40 days on this one are up on the 26th May...


No 'phone call so far, so time passes... slowly.


Lloyds Bank are now in the firing line... I am quite getting into this, it is very empowering to take back some control over those that have thwarted you...

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  • 3 weeks later...

Some stuff arrived today.


I don't think these people have a clue as to what is going on!!!


They show no manual intervention with regard to the letters that are charged at variously £10 to £100 [really!!!] so they seem to owe me a good proportion of the £750 they have charged for letters I would say that £700 refund is in order...


Also the arrangement had been for them to do insurance 'in house' and they did not cancel the insurance for 6 months after the sale [incurring some £250 charge] which they seem to think I should pay!




The redemption seems wrong to me also [i paid it off with a windfall] but i am not 100% confident doing it with a calculator and parper and pen... is there a program for the Open Office software that will do mortgages correctly?


I have looked but seem to have failed miserably if there is, sorry if I am thick.


All the above 'charges' have been simply added to the total sum owed so would like a smart spreadsheet to kill this completely.


My figures seem to suggest that they owe me around £1200 and of course if paid will contribute 5% to the site...


Cheers for any help in nailing the first of my tormenters to the cross of their own making.

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