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CCA's and Dave against the world !!!


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Good for you Dave. I think its a brilliant idea. Like others if you need a hand I would gladly lend you one. CAG is excellent but sometimes trying to find something on is like trying to find a brain cell in a DCA.

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Dave - brilliant idea - I'm about to take MBNA to court for charging my account whilst they where in default and I'm trying to write my POCs so a reference site like you have described would be heaven sent.

I'd also be more than happy to lend a hand.

PLEASE sign this petition to reduce amount of time CRAs hold your data

http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/CreditRA

 

I HATE MBNA :evil::-x:mad::-x

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Hi Dave , ODC and everyone else who wants to help! I was hoping you could have a look at my thread at:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/natwest-bank/101587-shane-natwest-credit-cards.html

 

and let me know your thoughts on the letter I want to send. I'm trying to challenge the CCA that Natwest, monument and several others have sent me!! I thought it best not to hijak your thread anymore dave!

 

kind regards,

shane

____________________________________________

All advice is offered freely & without prejudice

 

 

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Hi dave i gave you a shout not long ago to tell you Im after um like you:)

 

I need some advice.. I asked RBS for my credit card CCa. well it arrived yesterday and Im kinda thinking it's not enuf. They have sent me my original application form, signed by me, which trys tell sell you loads of wonderfull stuff like ppi etc. A copy of a consumer credit act agreement that was quite obviously printed off yesterday, with no signatures or place for either party to sign, and 7 leaflets telling me of variations in terms from the last 3 years. NOW THEY SENT THIS AS PART OF A SAR REQUEST AS WELL AND THERE IS NO LETTER FROM THE ACCOUNT HISTORY SHOWING CANCELLATION RIGHTS WERE EVER SENT OUT ETC. Is it me or does that sound like they havn't got the original signed agreement?. If so what do you advise me to do now and what are my options? There is £6000 owing on this card!

 

Any advice would be great

 

geoff :)

Strategy without tactics is the slowest route to victory. Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat.Thus, what is of supreme importance in war is to attack the enemy's strategy. What is essential in war is victory, not prolonged operations.

 

Sun Tzu 'The art of war'

POST THE LETTER AND SIGN THE PETITION AT POST 88 ON THE LINK BELOW TO GET THE OFT TO INVESTIGATE THE CRA'S

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/campaign/153512-campaign-oft-against-unfair.html

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Ok.....

 

An application form is not an agreement, the T&C should be from when you signed....

 

Can you scan the application ? it would help

 

rgds

 

Dave

** We would not seek a battle as we are, yet as we are, we say we will not shun it. (Henry V) **

 

see you stand like greyhounds in the slips,

Straining upon the start. The game's afoot:

Follow your spirit; and, upon this charge

Cry 'God for Harry! England and Saint George!'

:D If you think I have helped, informed, or amused you do the clickey scaley thing !! :D

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Just got a reply to my complaint to Lloyds TSB, they are endeavourng to find my application but it might take another 2 weeks. Oh well, looks like I can cross them off the list ... and two more weeks, please I only requested my CCA in February ...your Honour !!

Professional Halifax Loather

 

"In the dark, all cats are grey"

 

Illegitimi Non Carborundum

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Hi dave i gave you a shout not long ago to tell you Im after um like you:)

 

I need some advice.. I asked RBS for my credit card CCa. well it arrived yesterday and Im kinda thinking it's not enuf. They have sent me my original application form, signed by me, which trys tell sell you loads of wonderfull stuff like ppi etc. A copy of a consumer credit act agreement that was quite obviously printed off yesterday, with no signatures or place for either party to sign, and 7 leaflets telling me of variations in terms from the last 3 years. NOW THEY SENT THIS AS PART OF A S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) REQUEST AS WELL AND THERE IS NO LETTER FROM THE ACCOUNT HISTORY SHOWING CANCELLATION RIGHTS WERE EVER SENT OUT ETC. Is it me or does that sound like they havn't got the original signed agreement?. If so what do you advise me to do now and what are my options? There is £6000 owing on this card!

 

Any advice would be great

 

geoff :)

 

Hi FL,

 

as Dave said, it would help to get a scan up, but it sounds like the response to your CCA is very similar to mine

 

They havent got a hope, as if they had an executed agreement theyd send it

 

As Dave also said, application form just doesnt cut the mustard, and without the original T and C's they cant prove they had the right to vary the agreement (APR, general terms, etc)

 

If your app form is like mine, it will make no reference whatsoever to the terms and cons, this in itself wont work as the 74 act quite clearly states the terms must be laid down in the 'agreement' or directly referenced (and the OFT's opinion in their 786a docment is ALL terms and cons must be in the agreement, not just the ones that refer to prescribed terms)

omnia praesumuntur legitime facta donec probetur in contrarium

 

 

Please note: I am not a member of the legal profession, all advice given is purely my opinion, if in doubt consult a professional

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Hi Guys,

 

I'm in the same situation as many of you. CCA requests sent to 5 different creditors, all sent back application forms signed by me only, not them. for the past few weeks i've been rigorously researching the legal veracity of these documents and if the alleged debt can be challenged on these grounds.

 

Where I stand at the moment:

 

The Creditors, if requested by the debtor are required under S78 (1) to provide the debtor with a copy of the executed agreement.

 

However, under the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983 there is a loophole that says any copy supplied to the debtor must be a 'true' copy and that this true copy can omit certain information such as the creditors signature.

 

Then again, this 'true copy' loophole only applies to the banks doing exactly that, providing a copy to you of the agrement. They must keep a copy of the original, signed agreement signed by both them and you (if it exists that is!) In order for them to enforce it, ie have you carry on making payments, etc they need to provide a legally binding regulated correctly executed agreement which, among other things MUST contain both signatures as mentioned below in S61 (1)

 

A Regulated agreement is not properly executed unless:

 

a.) a document in the prescribed form itself containing all the prescribed terms and conforming to regulations under section 60(1) is signed in the prescribed manner BOTH BY THE DEBTOR OR HIRER AND BY OR OR ON BEHALF OF THE CREDITOR OR OWNER,

b.) the document embodies all the terms of the agreement, other than the implied terms, and

c.) the document is, when presented or sent to the debtor or hirer for signature, in such a state that all its terms are readily legible.

 

So, in lamen terms yes they can send you a copy of the agreement omitting their signature and hide behind the 'true copy' law aformentioned above however if they do this they cannot enforce it.

 

This is the point where my confidence falters slightly. I can argue that the debt is unenforcable and stop paying them and either i can take them to court or they take me to court to resolve this. the big problem here is that, if during the case the actual agreement is produced then I am in trouble. more than likely if this happens depending on the temperament of the judge i will lose and have to pay costs for wasting the courts time.

 

So now i am researching ways to avoid having to take this risk. I also hold the belief that some creditors might use this as a strategy, send a true copy and then wait and see if the debtor challenges the debt, if he does take them to court and all of a sudden after a more thorough search provide the agreement and win!

 

I'm looking into disclosure and fraud arguments at the moment. the idea is that they have misrepresented to me and had me believe by their actions that the debt is unenforcable by providing me with their 'true copy' of the agreemnent which omits their signature even after i requested the original one. being that my claim was based solely on that and they did not provide evidence to me (being the original agreement) which, if i received would of dropped the claim they can be found guilty of fraud:

 

The Fraud Act is small as it contains only 16 sections plus 3 schedules.

 

All Theft Act deception offences are abolished to be replaced by 3 new fraud offences: fraud by misrepresentation.......f raud by failing to disclose information and fraud by abuse of position..

 

Under section 1 a person is guilty of fraud if they are in breach of any offences in sections 2,3,4.

 

Under Section 2 representation must be made dishonestly which is established under the two-stage test as set out in Rv Gosh (1982) QB 1053, 75 Cr App R 154 in which the defendant was dishonest by the standards of ordinary people

 

Subsection (1)(b) requires that the representation is made with the intention of making a gain for himself or causing a loss or risk of loss to another. Loss and gain are defined in section 5 as being money or property

 

Section 3: Fraud by failing to disclose information

18. Section 3 makes it an offence to commit fraud by failing to disclose information to another person where there is a legal duty to disclose the information. A legal duty to disclose information may include duties under oral contracts as well as written contracts. The concept of "legal duty" is explained in the Law Commission's Report on Fraud, which said at paragraphs 7.28 and 7.29:

"7.28 ..Such a duty may derive from statute (such as the provisions governing company prospectuses), from the fact that the transaction in question is one of the utmost good faith (such as a contract of insurance), from the express or implied terms of a contract, from the custom of a particular trade or market, or from the existence of a fiduciary relationship between the parties (such as that of agent and principal).

7.29 For this purpose there is a legal duty to disclose information not only if the defendant's failure to disclose it gives the victim a cause of action for damages, but also if the law gives the victim a right to set aside any change in his or her legal position to which he or she may consent as a result of the non-disclosure. For example, a person in a fiduciary position has a duty to disclose material information when entering into a contract with his or her beneficiary, in the sense that a failure to make such disclosure will entitle the beneficiary to rescind the contract and to reclaim any property transferred under it."

 

More specifically, section 3 states:

3 Fraud by failing to disclose information

A person is in breach of this section if he-

(a) dishonestly fails to disclose to another person information which he is under a legal duty to disclose, and

(b) intends, by failing to disclose the information-

(i) to make a gain for himself or another, or

(ii) to cause loss to another or to expose another to a risk of loss

Gain and Loss Specified

5 "Gain" and "loss"

(1) The references to gain and loss in sections 2 to 4 are to be read in accordance with this section.

(2) "Gain" and "loss"-

(a) extend only to gain or loss in money or other property;

(b) include any such gain or loss whether temporary or permanent;

 

My apologies for this rather long post, but i would really appreciate any feedback to the above arguments, has anyone else tried these, does anyone know of a section of subsection that can be used by the banks to dispute the arguments above etc. I'm hoping to try and set a precedent here. as i always say, i am no legal expert but it seems to me the arguments are pretty strong and backed up by UK statue law.

I look forward to your comments.

____________________________________________

All advice is offered freely & without prejudice

 

 

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This is the point where my confidence falters slightly. I can argue that the debt is unenforcable and stop paying them and either i can take them to court or they take me to court to resolve this. the big problem here is that, if during the case the actual agreement is produced then I am in trouble. more than likely if this happens depending on the temperament of the judge i will lose and have to pay costs for wasting the courts time.

 

Im sure your aware that a creditor had 12days plus a further 30 days to produce your agreement, if not they commit an offence.

 

So if you start court proceedings and the time limit is up, then the creditor would have to own up to fact that they have committed an offence, an offence which has a punishment fine of £2,500.

 

So if you owe them £1,500, would they rather write that off or own up, pay £2,500 in a fine and collect £1,500 from you?

 

I will be taking 2 creditors to court within the next week, neither have produced an agreement, i just want a court order saying the debt is unenforcable.

 

A judges word would be final? Well i hope it is :D

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Hi Guys,

 

I'm in the same situation as many of you. CCA requests sent to 5 different creditors, all sent back application forms signed by me only, not them. for the past few weeks i've been rigorously researching the legal veracity of these documents and if the alleged debt can be challenged on these grounds.

 

Where I stand at the moment:

 

The Creditors, if requested by the debtor are required under S78 (1) to provide the debtor with a copy of the executed agreement.

 

However, under the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983 there is a loophole that says any copy supplied to the debtor must be a 'true' copy and that this true copy can omit certain information such as the creditors signature.

 

Then again, this 'true copy' loophole only applies to the banks doing exactly that, providing a copy to you of the agrement. They must keep a copy of the original, signed agreement signed by both them and you (if it exists that is!) In order for them to enforce it, ie have you carry on making payments, etc they need to provide a legally binding regulated correctly executed agreement which, among other things MUST contain both signatures as mentioned below in S61 (1)

 

A Regulated agreement is not properly executed unless:

 

a.) a document in the prescribed form itself containing all the prescribed terms and conforming to regulations under section 60(1) is signed in the prescribed manner BOTH BY THE DEBTOR OR HIRER AND BY OR OR ON BEHALF OF THE CREDITOR OR OWNER,

b.) the document embodies all the terms of the agreement, other than the implied terms, and

c.) the document is, when presented or sent to the debtor or hirer for signature, in such a state that all its terms are readily legible.

 

So, in lamen terms yes they can send you a copy of the agreement omitting their signature and hide behind the 'true copy' law aformentioned above however if they do this they cannot enforce it.

 

The short answer to this is to tell the DCAs that the application form is not a true copy of the agreement and that as such the debt is unenforceable. If they rely on the 1983 loophole then they will need to have the original for any proposed court case. So if they intend taking you to court they would be obliged to produce a copy for you to examine prior to you meeting a judge.

 

Im sure some of the legall eagles on here can confirm things more clearly. You are after all making your request under the CCA. Not the1983 act. So in my opinion this defence would be a red herring as they are not complying with the CCA

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The short answer to this is to tell the DCAs that the application form is not a true copy of the agreement and that as such the debt is unenforceable. If they rely on the 1983 loophole then they will need to have the original for any proposed court case. So if they intend taking you to court they would be obliged to produce a copy for you to examine prior to you meeting a judge.

 

Im sure some of the legall eagles on here can confirm things more clearly. You are after all making your request under the CCA. Not the1983 act. So in my opinion this defence would be a red herring as they are not complying with the CCA

 

 

It has to be a true copy of the actual agreement. Therefore if you completed it your handwriting will be on it.

 

Have they added any interest charges while you were waiting for the CCA - were they in default?

 

If so write back, and say that you are giving them 14 days notice to refund the interest unlawfully added and that as they are not prepared to give you trueas you are intending to commence court proceddings you require sight of the original agreement in order to comply with CPR rules 31.6

You may receive different advice to your query as people have different experiences and opinions. Please use your own judgement in deciding whose advice to take.

 

If in doubt seek advice from a qualified insured professional. Any advice I have offered you is done so on an informal basis, without prejudice or liability.

 

If you think I have been helpful PLEASE click the scales

 

court bundles for dummies

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Im sure your aware that a creditor had 12days plus a further 30 days to produce your agreement, if not they commit an offence.

 

So if you start court proceedings and the time limit is up, then the creditor would have to own up to fact that they have committed an offence, an offence which has a punishment fine of £2,500.

 

So if you owe them £1,500, would they rather write that off or own up, pay £2,500 in a fine and collect £1,500 from you?

 

I will be taking 2 creditors to court within the next week, neither have produced an agreement, i just want a court order saying the debt is unenforcable.

 

A judges word would be final? Well i hope it is :D

 

 

Hiya,

 

thanks a lot for replying, i eagerly await to hear your court outcome. My dilemma is that if the correctly executed agreement is produced during the court proceedings then the debt becomes enforable again and then you run the risk of having to pay their legal costs as well. Is there some way, some legal action/requirement that will allow me to effectively request that the creditor provide this properly executed agreeement before it is heard infornt of a judge, that way if they cannot supply it then i know that for a fact and any surprises in court the might suddenly uncover later on could be classes as inadmissable?

____________________________________________

All advice is offered freely & without prejudice

 

 

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Hiya,

 

thanks a lot for replying, i eagerly await to hear your court outcome. My dilemma is that if the correctly executed agreement is produced during the court proceedings then the debt becomes enforable again and then you run the risk of having to pay their legal costs as well. Is there some way, some legal action/requirement that will allow me to effectively request that the creditor provide this properly executed agreeement before it is heard infornt of a judge, that way if they cannot supply it then i know that for a fact and any surprises in court the might suddenly uncover later on could be classes as inadmissable?

They cannot just spring it on you on the day of a court. They would have to produce it before then to give you a chance. If they did go down the court route you could enter as your defence that they failed to comply with your request for a copy of an executed agreement. Personally I think they are bluffing with the application form ploy. Who is the DCA and what is the alleged debt for. Go ahead and say it CRAPone and RWC or Clownells

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If they try and produce it in court on the day then they will have to explain to court why it ewasn't produce re your CCA request. They face a fine of £2500 for the offence and you will most certainly not have costs awarded against you.

You may receive different advice to your query as people have different experiences and opinions. Please use your own judgement in deciding whose advice to take.

 

If in doubt seek advice from a qualified insured professional. Any advice I have offered you is done so on an informal basis, without prejudice or liability.

 

If you think I have been helpful PLEASE click the scales

 

court bundles for dummies

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hi dave. great stuff this whole thread. just would like your thoughts on an issue. its dead straightforward. if a loan company cannot supply copy of original agreement t&c included, then is the debt unenforceable? i took out a loan in 1994 for £4000, company was taken over by paragon personal finance i have so far paid back approx £7500. i have been on reduced payments for many years. if they cant supply a valid loan agreement form doesnt the fact that i have been paying prove something? im just so fed up of paying them, they still say i owe them nearly £3000, this will go on for ever and ever, i dont think they will have the loan agreement form. your thoughts please. good luck with all your battles. :)

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hi dave. great stuff this whole thread. just would like your thoughts on an issue. its dead straightforward. if a loan company cannot supply copy of original agreement t&c included, then is the debt unenforceable? i took out a loan in 1994 for £4000, company was taken over by paragon personal finance i have so far paid back approx £7500. i have been on reduced payments for many years. if they cant supply a valid loan agreement form doesnt the fact that i have been paying prove something? im just so fed up of paying them, they still say i owe them nearly £3000, this will go on for ever and ever, i dont think they will have the loan agreement form. your thoughts please. good luck with all your battles. :)

 

 

No CCA = No enforcement of debt. Wislon v Sec of State of Trade & Industry 2005 = Creditor cannot sidestep CCA and has lost any monies owing unless you want to voluntarily pay them.

 

You can initiate a claim for refund of all interest you have paid and any defaults or late payments to be expunged from your cra

You may receive different advice to your query as people have different experiences and opinions. Please use your own judgement in deciding whose advice to take.

 

If in doubt seek advice from a qualified insured professional. Any advice I have offered you is done so on an informal basis, without prejudice or liability.

 

If you think I have been helpful PLEASE click the scales

 

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hi! bluedawn

 

Once you have sent you CCA request they have 12 +2 Working Days from receipt to comply, if after this time no CCA is forthcoming then after another 30 days the Creditors are in Criminal Default and the debt becomes enforceable only by a Court Order.

 

minky xxx

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They cannot just spring it on you on the day of a court. They would have to produce it before then to give you a chance. If they did go down the court route you could enter as your defence that they failed to comply with your request for a copy of an executed agreement. Personally I think they are bluffing with the application form ploy. Who is the DCA and what is the alleged debt for. Go ahead and say it CRAPone and RWC or Clownells

 

Actually no DCA's involved here, creditors are Capital One, Monument, Lloyds TSB and Natwest Card Centre and Solution Finance (all credit cards).

 

OK So my defence would be they failed to respond to my CCa request but did they? I mean, what they sent me was, in my opinion not a Correctly executed agreement but then under the consumer credit regulations 1983 aformentioned all they need do is provide a true copy which can omit the info. What i am worried about is if sometime down the line after i have filed my claim they claim that 'after yet more rigorous attempts at locating yor agreement we have now found it' then what, i will loose the case, run the risk of having to pay costs and more than likely have a CCj then threatened against me. I know its unlilely thay they have the correct agreement but not impossible.

 

 

If they try and produce it in court on the day then they will have to explain to court why it ewasn't produce re your CCA request. They face a fine of £2500 for the offence and you will most certainly not have costs awarded against you.

 

Actually i wasn't aware there was a financial penlalty for them not complying to my CCa request if lapsed over 30 days. i know they commit a crim offence after this time; i read somewhere that it may be possible to actually send them a default notice if they do this, is this possible? also, in regards to them commiting a criminal offence does this apply to the 'true copy' or the correctly executed agreement containing BOTH signaturs? if the latter then i think i could use it, if not then surely by supplying me what they deem to be a 'true copy' even though we know it to be simply an application form they are within the law under the consumer credit regulations 1983?

____________________________________________

All advice is offered freely & without prejudice

 

 

If my post has been useful to you please click the scales

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hi! bluedawn

 

Once you have sent you CCA request they have 12 +2 Working Days from receipt to comply, if after this time no CCA is forthcoming then after another 30 days the Creditors are in Criminal Default and the debt becomes enforceable only by a Court Order.

 

minky xxx

 

hiya,

 

sorry but i don't think the Creditors need a court order to enforce the debt if and when they provide the CCA be it 30 days or up to 6 years after the debtor requests it. I am under the impression that as soon as they provide it the debt becomes enforcable again and the creditor is no longer deemed in default?

____________________________________________

All advice is offered freely & without prejudice

 

 

If my post has been useful to you please click the scales

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thank you for that. i was also wondering if they do supply cca and the interest charges are huge do i have a chance of simply writing to the loan company and telling them that i consider that having paid more than £3500 in interest as well as paying back the original sum of £4000, that i believe i have paid more than enough back and a further £3000 to pay is totally unacceptable to me and therefore refuse any further payments until a court decides what a fair amount is. or am i being naive?:-?

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Actually no DCA's involved here, creditors are Capital One, Monument, Lloyds TSB and NatWest Card Centre and Solution Finance (all credit cards).

 

OK So my defence would be they failed to respond to my CCa request but did they? I mean, what they sent me was, in my opinion not a Correctly executed agreement but then under the consumer credit regulations 1983 aformentioned all they need do is provide a true copy which can omit the info. What i am worried about is if sometime down the line after i have filed my claim they claim that 'after yet more rigorous attempts at locating yor agreement we have now found it' then what, i will loose the case, run the risk of having to pay costs and more than likely have a CCj then threatened against me. I know its unlilely thay they have the correct agreement but not impossible.

 

 

You tell them in your LBA before initiating court action that as part of disclosure under CPR 31.6 you require a copy of your original agreement. However if they have produced ana greement if you accept that as the true copy then that is all they can produce to court under Ithink s. 172 (4) CCA

 

Actually i wasn't aware there was a financial penlalty for them not complying to my CCa request if lapsed over 30 days. i know they commit a crim offence after this time; i read somewhere that it may be possible to actually send them a default notice if they do this, is this possible? also, in regards to them commiting a criminal offence does this apply to the 'true copy' or the correctly executed agreement containing BOTH signaturs? if the latter then i think i could use it, if not then surely by supplying me what they deem to be a 'true copy' even though we know it to be simply an application form they are within the law under the consumer credit regulations 1983?

 

 

DEFAULT UNDER THE CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974

FAILURE TO PRODUCE AGREEMENT

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

ACCOUNT NUMBER: ***********************

 

I wrote to you by Special Delivery/Recorded Delivery ( Ref ***********) on ********, 2007 asking for a copy of the above agreement together with the relevant information under Section 77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, enclosing the statutory payment of £1.00. This letter was delivered and signed for on ***** , 2007.

 

The Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for this request to be carried out before your company enters into a default situation. This occurred on *******, 2007. If the request is not satisfied after a further calendar month, your company commits an offence. Therefore on *******, 2007 this time limit will expired.

 

I have still neither received a copy of the agreement as required by S78 Consumer Credit Act 1974, nor any other information relating to same. As such, this account has become unenforceable by law. As you are no doubt aware subsection (6) states:

 

If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

 

(a) He is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement; and

(b) If the default continues for one month he commits an offence.

As such, now that the 12 working days have expired (from your receipt of the request for the agreement and supporting documents) the account is now in dispute. Whilst it remains in dispute the agreement is unenforceable.

 

Whilst it is unenforceable, no interest is to be added to the account. No action can be taken against me. No adverse credit references or defaults can be listed against me with Credit Reference Agencies. The account cannot be passed to a Debt Collection Agency. And lastly, I am not obliged to make any further payments to the account. Essentially, the account is ‘held’ as it was on the date of the CCA request expiring (*******, 2007)

 

Should you nevertheless choose to initiate legal proceedings against me, I will expect to receive, with any Letter before Action, a copy of the document that you will be relying on as proof that a properly executed agreement, complying in all respects with the form and content requirements of the CCA was signed by myself in respect of this alleged debt.

 

As an offence of this nature may have an impact on your ability to hold a credit licence, it is important that you give this letter your immediate and prompt attention.

 

Data Protection Act (Data Protection Act 1998

 

Furthermore, under the Data Protection Act (S. 10), you are also denied the authority to pass on any of my personal data. To do so in the circumstances is I understand a breach of the Data Protection Act 1998, and also the OFT guidelines, and should you ignore my request it would again result in you being further reported to the relevant authorities.

 

I also require that you remove all my data from your files within the next 7 days and look forward to receiving a letter from you within 10 days confirming that you have complied with this request.

 

 

Yours faithfully,

 

 

 

 

Mr ************

You may receive different advice to your query as people have different experiences and opinions. Please use your own judgement in deciding whose advice to take.

 

If in doubt seek advice from a qualified insured professional. Any advice I have offered you is done so on an informal basis, without prejudice or liability.

 

If you think I have been helpful PLEASE click the scales

 

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Hopefully it wont go to court :cool:

 

Hiya,

 

yeah definitely, if they settle out of court it only strengthens our cause. In some ways i do envy you, in your case the creditor didn't provide any agreement at all which is tantamount to criminal, they really dont have a leg to stand on! :(

 

In my cases i've got back what they say is a true copy and are backed up by statue law. i need to prove the document is not correcly exexuted and that one does not exist; i run the risk ok them suddenly producing it suffering the reprecussions

____________________________________________

All advice is offered freely & without prejudice

 

 

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DEFAULT UNDER THE CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974

FAILURE TO PRODUCE AGREEMENT

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

ACCOUNT NUMBER: ***********************

 

I wrote to you by Special Delivery/Recorded Delivery ( Ref ***********) on ********, 2007 asking for a copy of the above agreement together with the relevant information under Section 77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974, enclosing the statutory payment of £1.00. This letter was delivered and signed for on ***** , 2007.

 

The Consumer Credit Act allows 12 working days for this request to be carried out before your company enters into a default situation. This occurred on *******, 2007. If the request is not satisfied after a further calendar month, your company commits an offence. Therefore on *******, 2007 this time limit will expired.

 

I have still neither received a copy of the agreement as required by S78 Consumer Credit Act 1974, nor any other information relating to same. As such, this account has become unenforceable by law. As you are no doubt aware subsection (6) states:

 

If the creditor under an agreement fails to comply with subsection (1)—

 

(a) He is not entitled, while the default continues, to enforce the agreement; and

(b) If the default continues for one month he commits an offence.

As such, now that the 12 working days have expired (from your receipt of the request for the agreement and supporting documents) the account is now in dispute. Whilst it remains in dispute the agreement is unenforceable.

 

Whilst it is unenforceable, no interest is to be added to the account. No action can be taken against me. No adverse credit references or defaults can be listed against me with Credit Reference Agencies. The account cannot be passed to a Debt Collection Agency. And lastly, I am not obliged to make any further payments to the account. Essentially, the account is ‘held’ as it was on the date of the CCA request expiring (*******, 2007)

 

Should you nevertheless choose to initiate legal proceedings against me, I will expect to receive, with any Letter before Action, a copy of the document that you will be relying on as proof that a properly executed agreement, complying in all respects with the form and content requirements of the CCA was signed by myself in respect of this alleged debt.

 

As an offence of this nature may have an impact on your ability to hold a credit licence, it is important that you give this letter your immediate and prompt attention.

 

Data Protection Act (Data Protection Act 1998

 

Furthermore, under the Data Protection Act (S. 10), you are also denied the authority to pass on any of my personal data. To do so in the circumstances is I understand a breach of the Data Protection Act 1998, and also the OFT guidelines, and should you ignore my request it would again result in you being further reported to the relevant authorities.

 

I also require that you remove all my data from your files within the next 7 days and look forward to receiving a letter from you within 10 days confirming that you have complied with this request.

 

 

Yours faithfully,

 

 

 

 

Mr ************

 

 

 

Shane

 

After this great letter Josie's done for you, please don't come back still wearing your pessimistic hat. Think positive and be optimistic!

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thank you for that. i was also wondering if they do supply cca and the interest charges are huge do i have a chance of simply writing to the loan company and telling them that i consider that having paid more than £3500 in interest as well as paying back the original sum of £4000, that i believe i have paid more than enough back and a further £3000 to pay is totally unacceptable to me and therefore refuse any further payments until a court decides what a fair amount is. or am i being naive?:-?

 

From figures you have supplied the interest rate would seem to be high. What interest rate are they charging ? If its excessive the court has the power to either reduce or stop further interest.

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You may receive different advice to your query as people have different experiences and opinions. Please use your own judgement in deciding whose advice to take.

 

If in doubt seek advice from a qualified insured professional. Any advice I have offered you is done so on an informal basis, without prejudice or liability.

 

If you think I have been helpful PLEASE click the scales

 

court bundles for dummies

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