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    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
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    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
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      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 160 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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initial claim queries


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i am currently preparing a claim against rbs, most of my charges are for unpaid items and referal charge, can these be claimed i am unclear if referal charges come under the unfair penalty charges. As this is a business acc claim on following instructions in your step by step instructions i have used the spreadsheet that says that this will calculate the interest at 8% apr as allowed by s.64 the county courts act ( 1984 ) . as my account goes back to 2000/2001 this adds up to a lot of money, I wanted to know is this to be included in the initial claim letter as advocated in your step by step instructions.

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8% is not included in the initial calim. You add that when you get to court.

 

Don't know what referral charge is. Ask the bank what it refers to. Another name for penalty I expect

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its when somethings referred to them to decide wether to pay it or not. I've paid £80 to £100 each time in referal charges!!! They have expensive thought processes!!! So in my first letter I just ask for the total of the charges, without any interest? Thanks.

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If the referral has involved some special process such as manual intervention, then it may not be a disproportionate penalty.

 

Do they charge for an unpaid item plue a referral charge for the same iteM

 

Do they charge a referral fee for every unpaid item or only for some?

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I was told I had a £2000 overdaft facility, but when my business was failing and my accountant had a meeting with the business manager to sort things out he asked why there were so many massive charges on the account which were crippling the business. We were then told that he hadn't actually put an overdraft on the account, just what he explained as an unofficial overdraft, where every transaction was referred to him to authorise and he charged an extra £20 a time for the privelege, as well as the charge for going overdrawn. My accountant did ask him if he could do anything about these charges as it was not our fault he didn't put an official od on the account but he refused and said there was nothing he could do to help us. He did not actually do anything manually, just make a decision yea or nay.

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Is your accountant prepared to make a statement and give evidence?

 

Do the T&Cs refer at all to unofficial overdrafts or any similar facility?

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i ended up selling the business over 4 years ago so i have not got a copy of the t+c, i just wandered if anyone on the site has had any experience of referal charges as they are quite common.thank you

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Would you like to respond to the questions which I asked you

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If the referral has involved some special process such as manual intervention, then it may not be a disproportionate penalty.

 

Do they charge for an unpaid item plue a referral charge for the same iteM

 

Do they charge a referral fee for every unpaid item or only for some?

And these questions?

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You really need to understand more about the referral.

 

I think that you will need to start accumulating information to build a case. It will mean a DPA request, I'm afraid but you will have to modify it to obtain all information relating to the conduct of your account since it stated and in partcular any deatils of any manual intervention which was applied to your accoutn when deciding whether or not to pay a bill.

 

Also you need to contact the accountant and ask him about the meeting.

He will have charged you for his time so he will have a note of it and may well remember when you talk to him about it.

 

Also, where is the manager who gave you this unofficial overdraft? Is he still there? you need his name and at some point you may beed to try and interview him - tricky but he would have to be able to explain in court why he was approving all of these payments when you didn't have an overdraft facility.

It would be very interesting to know if at some level bank staff are paid commission on the charges.

If the accountant remembers then you don't need to worry so much about the manager.

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rbs have already given me my statements for this account at a cost of 5 pounds, is it worth writing to the bank asking them to clarify excactly what a referral charge is for, what it entails, and how it is implemented.

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Yes, why not. They won't give you a reply but at least you are on record as having attempted dialogue with them.

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Hello john,

i don't know if this is any help but i've had stacks of referal charges applied to my accounts which are just normal current accounts so these don't seem to be exclusive to business accounts. when i asked what they were for they said it was purely the fact that someone has to make a decision at branch level whether or not to pay it. i assume they would refer to this as manual intervention.

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  • 12 years later...

This topic was closed on 03/06/19.

If you have a problem which is similar to the issues raised in this topic, then please start a new thread and you will get help and support their.

If you would like to post up some information which is relevant to this particular topic then please flag the issue up to the site team and the thread will be reopened.

- Consumer Action Group

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