Me versus Abbey, advice on next step pleae!

[ejh263]

Hi all, wondered if anyone had any advice for me? I received a refund of charges at the beginning of the year just from one years worth of statements. I got it after just writing the two letters 'request for repayment' and then 'letter before action' . Since then I requested rest of charges back after receiving the last 6 yr statements and the Abbey refused. It's now gone as far as small claims. Today I received ' Notice of Transer of Proceedings' from court with the Abbey's defence attached. I'd like some advice on my next step please! What should I be preparing/expecting? Is it likely to go to court? I'm hoping, by reading other posts it won't. My claims for £1525.35. Any advice REALLY appreciated. Thanks.

[mariejader]

If you filed on MCOL then I think it's standard practice as they are moving your case to your local court, having said that there seems to be a change in the way the courts are proceeding now, did you get a AQ to complete?

 

It may pay you to read this

 

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=78873&goto=newpost

[ejh263]

Hi, no did not get AQ to complete, it says....'the filing of aq be dispensed with in this case....' so I guess it's just a question of waiting for next step, the court date I suppose? Thanks.

[lateralus]

hi, i looked you up after posting that reply to you on the link above.

yes, the fact that the filing was dispensed with is exaclty what we are talking about on that thread - so next you will hear from the court whether they want an aq or will just set a court date. my advice - get those charges in an acceptable form and send them off to both - then have a read of post 1 in that link and consider sending the bank that nudging letter in post 1. your claim is just a little untidy and we are tidying it up tonight by what i told you there - not much work - just a little - then post it tomorrow - and then do the letter. hopefully you will hear from your bank's solicitors with an offer very soon.

[ejh263]

hi, thanks for replying to my thread. Only just seen it. Don't know if you read my other replies on other thread? In a nutshell, i already calculated the interest but now i look at all this info available i don't think it was in the correct way!! I sent highlighted copies of charges with an explanation of interest to banks solicitor at thier request....if i do this again, by using spreadsheet will they a) think I'm a div and b) will it make my original claim invalid as the figures don't match up?! Doh!:idea:

[FOXYLADY1970]

i have also had this letter but the court have advised me AQ is in post so should get one tommorrow i have tried to call to see if they will settle out of court but they just said my case is being dealt with and that i will hear from them in due course.

[lateralus]

ok, liz, sorry i'm just getting to this now -

i guess you could just leave it the way it is - however - i think you'll get a better response from the solicitors if it is in the accepted format - meaning the simple spreadsheet -

i think i'd enter them all on - did you understand that explanation of how to make it look as if it was done on the day you originally filed your mcol?

that was back on that other thread in the hsbc forum - you might try just changing the date on the s/s to the date you filed you mcol. that should work - i'm not sure - if it doesn't - you'll have to look back at how pete said to change the date on the computer. but try the other first.

so, just enter all the same charges - oldest to newest and see what you get. if it is only slightly different - i'd go ahead and send this breakdown to the solicitors (with the nudging letter from post 1 of my thread about the no aq's where you were yesterday) and i would put a little note on the letter.

I apologise for the minor discrepency in the calculations on this spreadsheet as I have only learned that you prefer the charges in this format. The claim total stands at XXXX.XX (use the mcol claim total as it is what you were claiming).

 

If it's a big difference - get back - as i might not advise sending it in this format - just typing out a list of the charges, by date and putting on the amounts and adding the interest at the bottom according to your older figures - does this make sense to you. pm me if you need more help - i'm afraid i haven't been much help to you here - let me know.

[lateralus]

ejh, just keeping you in the loop - here's some more i've added to my thread on the hsbc forum - thought you might like to see it.......

 

It has been suggested by Bookworm in this thread:

Is your court dispensing with the Allocation Questionnaire?

that if you find yourself in this position - you send the Draft Direction to the court you've now been transferred to - the same as if you were filing an AQ using the new strategy:

New strategy for Allocation Questionaires

So, this would mean a cover note like this:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Your address]

The Court Manager

****** County Court

Court Address

Court P/code

 

 

[date]

 

 

 

Dear Sir/Madam

 

 

 

You -v- Bank Plc

Claim Number: *******

 

 

It is noted that in my case referenced above that the Allocation Questionnaire has been dispensed with. I am aware that this is likely due to the large volume of claims that consumers are bring against the high street banks. I am also aware that to date the banks have failed to defend a case in the courts and that they often use the court process to extend and delay the period of time within which deal with these matters satisfactorily.

 

 

In light of this the Claimant respectfully suggests that special directions may be made as per the attached draft order.

 

 

The Claimant believes the proposed directions will further the Overriding Objectives in that they identify the most fundamental issues in dispute (as detailed below), and allow them to be assessed in advance of any hearing so that this claim may proceed justly and expeditiously.

 

 

- The crux upon which this claim rests is the true loss suffered by the Defendant as a result of the contractual breach from which its charges arise. If the Defendant cannot substantiate the cost of each charge as proportionate to its loss incurred, it has charged contractual penalties contrary to the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 and common law principles established since the early 1900's.

 

 

- In the event that the Defendant's charges were accepted as being a fee for a service (which is refuted), examination of its true costs is required to determine whether the price is reasonable as required by the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982.

 

 

The Claimant believes that if the Defendant has the serious intention of defending this claim at trial as is indicated by its defence, that it is incumbent on it to disclose such information. Further, the proposed directions are already routinely ordered in claims of this nature in the Mercantile Court in London, as well as in small claims track cases in Leicester, Derby, Chesterfield, Northampton and Mansfield County Courts.

 

 

As the law relating to contractual penalties is long established, the Claimant believes the outstanding issues to be of fact. Accordingly, the Claimant respectfully requests that this claim be allocated to the small claims track, and estimates that the hearing of the claim should last no longer than one hour.

 

 

Yours faithfully,

 

 

 

[name]

 

 

enc: Draft Order

 

 

 

THEN ON A SEPARATE PIECE OF PAPER - THIS:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Draft Order for Directions

 

 

 

1. The Claimant shall within 14 days of service of this order send to the Defendant and to the Court:

• a) A schedule setting out each charge repayment of which is sought, showing the date, amount, and reason given (if any) for that charge being made;

• b) Copies of any statement or other document relied upon as showing that each and every charge has been made;

• c) A statement of evidence of all matters relied upon as tending to show that the charges are irrecoverable as penalties or otherwise;

• d) Copies of decided cases and other legal materials to be relied upon.

If the Claimant fails to comply with this order, the claim will be struck out without further order.

 

 

 

2. The Defendant shall within 14 days thereafter file and serve a response to the Claimant's schedule, stating in respect of each item claimed;

• a) Pursuant to what contractual provision such charge was made, producing a copy of the contractual document relied upon;

• b) Whether such charge is accepted to be a penalty, and if not why not;

• c) If such charge is alleged to be a pre-estimate of the Defendant's loss incurred by the Claimant's actions (whether or not such action is treated as a breach of contract between the parties), all facts and matters intended to be relied upon as showing that such was a proper estimate of such loss, and all evidence to be adduced at trial as to what the true cost of dealing with the matter was;

• d) If such charge is not alleged to be a pre-estimate of the Defendant's loss incurred by the Claimant's actions then facts and matters intended to be relied upon showing the basis upon which the charge was calculated and all evidence to be adduced at trial as to show that the charge was fair and reasonable.

• e) Any witness statements.

• f) Copies of decided cases and other legal materials to be relied upon.

If the Defendant fails to comply with this order, the Defence will be struck out without further order.

 

 

 

 

AND ONE FURTHER BIT OF INFO - I KNOW IT'S DRAGGING THIS POST OUT BUT I THINK IT BEST TO HAVE AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE ALL IN ONE PLACE SO:

 

If the judge were to grant the draft order it would mean that when the court asks for the info - this is it, in triplicate (one set you, one for the court and one for dg) - so DON'T do this until it is ordered by the court and it is about 5 days from being required as it is a heck of a lot of copying - probably over 200 pages times 3.

but this is the info that would be required should the draft direction be made an order:

 

If the judge agrees with the draft order and makes it a direction, it will come back to you and you will have at least 14 days (the date will be on the paperwork) to send in four things.

a) your schedule of charges.

b) your statements showing the charges. Alternatively, the list of charges which the bank provided under your S.A.R (subject Access Request) (only send the statements with charges on them.)

c) A Statement of Evidence: (post 55 in the new strategy): New strategy for Allocation Questionaires

d) All the statutes and decided cases on which your claim relies. ie, UTCCR's, UCTA's, SOGA, case law, etc. For this, I'd just submit the whole of the Basic Court Bundle.

This whole thing runs to around 200 pages and should be done in triplicate: one copy for you, one for the court and one for dg – that’s 600 pages of copying – LEAVE IT UNTIL YOU KNOW FOR SURE YOU NEED IT. If an offer comes in from DG and is accepted you wouldn’t need it. Really leave it until you have to do it to meet the deadline set by the court!