What can we do about Fuel Prices?

[chocolatte]

Fuel outlets are another lot I would like to see fall on their arses, is there anything we can do about fuel costs and ongoing rises?

Just a thought...

[patdavies]

Here's another one.

 

Do you know how much of the price of a litre of petrol/diesel goes to the outlet?

[Movingon]

Ooooh, Pat you beat me to it. cally, over 60% of the price of a litre of petrol is tax. Most of the rest goes to producers and distributors. For each litre of fuel only a few pence goes to the petrol station...

 

BBC News | At-a-glance

[chocolatte]

That's disgraceful Stone, and like myself, there aren't many of us who realise that. I looked at your link 67% of what we pay in fuel is tax, outragous! And 6p to be shared between the delivery companies and providers? WOW! I don't believe this country, I am learning more and more every day, we are being fleeced by the fat cats more and more every day!

Having said that, if it wasn't that it would be something else they would fleece us on!

This site is certainly and education for me, thanks you guys

[patdavies]

Just to provide an illustration.

 

I filled up in Dublin last month at €1/litre; that's about 67p

[hagenuk]

It will never happen. There is simply not enough profit in petrol retail to offer any significant discount. Demonstrated by the fact that many oil companies have left the business altogether and concentrate now purely on upstream activities.

 

There is one reason and one reason alone that petrol and diesel are so expensive in this country and that is the Labour Government. sure, oil prices have risen but that has a global effect, everybody everywhere pays more for oil when the price of crude increases. The level of taxation on fuel is approximately 75% (and don’t forget that we also pay vat on the cost of fuel and the duty, so are being taxed on tax) and that is why the pump prices are so high.

 

If you take the exorbitant tax out of the equation petrol prices in the UK are among the lowest in Europe and even lower than those in the USA.

 

The petrol retailers barely see 5p profit per litre and that has to pay for all the costs associated with actually getting it to a point where we can buy it. 5p has to cover the cost of getting the product from the refinery to the distribution terminal, storing it, putting in additives to improve performance and delivering it to the retailer, the retailer's staff and other costs of running the site including credit card charges (themselves over 1p per litre), promotions and marketing costs, as well as generating an income for the retailer and a return on investment for both the retailer and the oil company.

 

It is a misconception that because oil companies make such large profits they could reduce pump prices. Each area of business must stand alone, propping up the retail side of the business by using the profits from the upstream activities could be seen as anti-competitive and would be unsustainable in the long term. Just a few years ago oil was less than $20 per barrel and the oil companies were making huge losses yet nobody offered to pay extra for fuel then did they?

 

Stealth tax by HMG is the reason fuel prices are so high, not profiteering by the petrol retailers.

 

The problem in the UK is not overpriced petrol, it is overtaxed petrol.

[tim2718281]

Sure, oil prices have risen but that has a global effect, everybody everywhere pays more for oil when the price of crude increases.

 

I'm pretty confident the price of crude oil is about 10% less than it was two years ago, down from about 45 Euros a barrel down to about 40.

 

Tim

[patdavies]

Brent crude is currently trading at $66/bbl, up $2 since two weeks ago.

 

Texas crude is trading at $64/bbl, up from $58 two weeks ago.

[Movingon]

Hag - your figures are slightly out according to the BBC website I posted much earlier in the thread. Fuel tax= approx 67%, "product", 26%, blah blah blah... retailer/delivery 7%.

 

Still - no scope whatsoever for movement at the pumps.

 

The only reason oil companies make a large profit on petrol and diesel is VOLUME OF SALES. 7% (about 6.3p) per litre multiplied by several billion litres per day is still a lot of money per day.

[chocolatte]

Just to provide an illustration.

 

I filled up in Dublin last month at €1/litre; that's about 67p

 

Grrrr!

[hagenuk]

Hag - your figures are slightly out according to the BBC website I posted much earlier in the thread. Fuel tax= approx 67%, "product", 26%, blah blah blah... retailer/delivery 7%.

 

Still - no scope whatsoever for movement at the pumps.

 

The only reason oil companies make a large profit on petrol and diesel is VOLUME OF SALES. 7% (about 6.3p) per litre multiplied by several billion litres per day is still a lot of money per day.

 

Quite right, fuel duty and vat in fact makes up less than 70% but still a tax rate of around 200%

[indebtstudent]

Thing is if they took this tax off they would just slap it on somewhere else.

 

Here's a thought I've confused myself with. What do the emergency services run thier vehicles on? Tax on petrol is huge and petrol is used by fire engines, police cars and ambulances. So we pay our taxes then they pay for the petrol (which is heavily taxed) with our tax money!

 

It's a little like when they say NI is going up to put more money into the health service when this in turn means that the NHS as an employer will pay out more in NI. Madness!

 

I would be interested to know what the tax % would come out at if all the taxes we pay indirectly came out of our pay packet.

[barracad]

is there anything we can do about fuel costs and ongoing rises?

 

Walk?

[Movingon]

Thing is if they took this tax off they would just slap it on somewhere else.

 

Here's a thought I've confused myself with. What do the emergency services run thier vehicles on? Tax on petrol is huge and petrol is used by fire engines, police cars and ambulances. So we pay our taxes then they pay for the petrol (which is heavily taxed) with our tax money!

 

It's a little like when they say NI is going up to put more money into the health service when this in turn means that the NHS as an employer will pay out more in NI. Madness!

 

I would be interested to know what the tax % would come out at if all the taxes we pay indirectly came out of our pay packet.

 

Public bodies such as the Police and so on get their fuel duty free.

[patdavies]

Public bodies such as the Police and so on get their fuel duty free.

Are you sure about that?

 

I know that it is VAT free (or reclaimable), but how do they reclaim the fuel duty? Round here, they don't have their own pumps, the use a local garage account.

[Movingon]

Are you sure about that?

 

I know that it is VAT free (or reclaimable), but how do they reclaim the fuel duty? Round here, they don't have their own pumps, the use a local garage account.

 

As far as I know they use a fuel card which records simply the amount of fuel bought. The garage bill them for the amount of fuel bought and the finance department pays them the amount agreed in the local government contract... which AFAIK is duty and VAT free.

 

Certainly that's true of the RAF and army, when they have to refuel outside their internal system.

[naughtyemit]

As far as I know they use a fuel card which records simply the amount of fuel bought. The garage bill them for the amount of fuel bought and the finance department pays them the amount agreed in the local government contract... which AFAIK is duty and VAT free.

 

Certainly that's true of the RAF and army, when they have to refuel outside their internal system.

 

Plus of course, if you check the tax disc on a marked police vehicle, you will see that it was issued for £0.00,it would be a bit daft, us paying tax to fund the old bill then them having to pay tax on their cars and fuel!

 

I wonder does 2 jags pay VAT on his fuel bill? do they have VAT on pies? No wonder Brown doesn't want him around

[Movingon]

Plus of course, if you check the tax disc on a marked police vehicle, you will see that it was issued for £0.00,it would be a bit daft, us paying tax to fund the old bill then them having to pay tax on their cars and fuel!

 

I wonder does 2 jags pay VAT on his fuel bill? do they have VAT on pies? No wonder Brown doesn't want him around

 

Marked military vehicles don't even bother with a tax disc at all...

[naughtyemit]

Marked military vehicles don't even bother with a tax disc at all...

Back in my day, we didn't bother with seatbelts, redlights, speed limits, convoy drills but that's another story!!!

 

Marked military vehicles are, as I understand it, owned by the Monarch and as such, exempt from Vehicle Excise Duty, for the same reason you will never see a tax disc in that big black motor of hers

[B1nary]

Marked military vehicles don't even bother with a tax disc at all...

 

...gonna paint camouflage on my peugeot

[chocolatte]

Back in my day, we didn't bother with seatbelts, redlights, speed limits, convoy drills but that's another story!!!

 

Marked military vehicles are, as I understand it, owned by the Monarch and as such, exempt from Vehicle Excise Duty, for the same reason you will never see a tax disc in that big black motor of hers

 

How funny, was just reading this out loud to hubby, bit off topic I know, but funny and true all the same...

I Should Never Have Survived!

According to today's regulators and bureaucrats, those of us who were kids in the 60's, 70's and early 80's probably shouldn't have survived,

 

because our baby cots were covered with brightly coloured lead-based

paint which was promptly chewed and licked.

 

We had no childproof lids on medicine bottles, or latches on doors or

cabinets and it was fine to play with pans.

 

When we rode our bikes, we wore no helmets, just flip-flops and fluorescent 'spokey dokey's' on our wheels.

 

As children, we would ride in cars with no seat belts or airbags riding in the passenger seat was a treat.

 

We drank water from the garden hose and not from a bottle and it tasted the same.

 

We ate chips, bread and butter pudding and drank fizzy juice with sugar in it, but we were never overweight because we were always outside playing.

 

We shared one drink with four friends, from one bottle or can and no-one actually died from this.

 

We would spend hours building go-carts out of scraps and then went top speed down the hill, only to find out we forgot the brakes.

 

After running into stinging nettles a few times, we learned to solve the problem.

 

We would leave home in the morning and could play all day, as long as we were back before it got dark. No one was able to reach us and no one minded.

 

We did not have Play stations or X-Boxes, no video games at all.

 

No 99 channels on TV, no videotape movies, no surround sound, no mobile phones, no personal computers, no DVDs, no Internet chat rooms.

 

We had friends - we went outside and found them.

 

We played elastics and rounders, and sometimes that ball really hurt!

 

We fell out of trees, got cut, and broke bones but there were no law suits.

 

We had full on fist fights but no prosecution followed from other parents.

 

We played chap-the-door-run-away and were actually afraid of the owners catching us.

 

We walked to friends' homes.

 

We also, believe it or not, WALKED to school; we didn't rely on mummy or daddy to drive us to school, which was just round the corner.

 

We made up games with sticks and tennis balls.

 

We rode bikes in packs of 7 and wore our coats by only the hood.

 

The idea of a parent bailing us out if we broke a law was unheard of...They actually sided with the law.

 

This generation has produced some of the best risk-takers and problem solvers and inventors, ever.

 

The past 50 years have been an explosion of innovation and new ideas.

 

We had freedom, failure, success and responsibility, and we learned how to deal with it all.

 

And you're one of them. Congratulations!

[patdavies]

Marked military vehicles don't even bother with a tax disc at all...

 

Or insurance or MoT

 

I also understand that hackney carriages are exempt the MoT - because they have mandatory 6 monthly inspections

[Movingon]

Or insurance or MoT

 

I also understand that hackney carriages are exempt the MoT - because they have mandatory 6 monthly inspections

 

Military drivers ARE insured to drive and Crown Insurance will cover it where Crown Indemnity doesn't

 

Military vehicles are the most over-serviced vehicles I know of - they get inspections every day, month, six months and year along with additional checks based upon mileage. There is no way a military vehicle operating in the UK would EVER fail an MOT.

[indebtstudent]

Well you learn something new everday, perhaps there is still some sense in the government. Still my point about NI stands though I concede it is off topic...

[spotnot]

If you own a diesel car, it can easily be converted to run off vegetble oil. It gives out no nasty emissions and is free: get hotels, restaurants etc to give you their used oil. It may take a little more effort than standing at a fuel pump, but it is so worth it financially and environmentally. Technically, you still need to pay fuel duty on it, but @ 27.5p per litre is still much cheaper.

 

Those hippy roots of mine are once more resurfacing!

 

Spotnot