Koala Attack Vs Barclays

[angel_1]

thanks

[angel_1]

here is my letter KA - i feel great! (thank you for not minding me post on your thread) what do you and others think ? ta very much - laters maz

 

**********

 

Dear Sir,

 

RE: My visit to xxxx branch on xx/xx/xxxx at xxx time.

 

I am writing to you to complain about an incident at the above branch which I visited on the above date to pay my xxxx credit card. I have enclosed a copy of my credit card statement so that you can trace your bank employees concerned.

 

The lady cashier was a little while checking out my account on screen, suddenly she got up and said, to what I can recall as;

 

“oh you are paying lots of interest and charges I will try to get us to save you money”,

 

without waiting for me to answer she was off, people behind me in the line looked at me, as the cashier had gone off to find someone. She clearly held my credit card statement in her hand, it did look odd. I was feeling quite embarrassed and uncomfortable, as she darted from one section of the office to another then finally about nearly 5 minutes came to me at the cashier till where I was still waiting. She gestured for me to follow her and that I was to go into an office and someone was waiting for me with my credit card statement on her desk, all the time others were staring at me, I felt like I had been caught in a fraud act or something.

 

As I entered the small room where your other bank employee was standing, I noticed my credit card statement on the desk. I addressed your bank employee in the small room and directly said to her,

 

“I really don’t know why I’m here; no one asked me if it was convenient",

 

To which she didn’t even answer me, picked up my statement, handed it to me and I replied “thank you” and walked out of the room.

 

Clearly there was something on the screen that made the cashier do what she did, if this is one way of getting new sales accosting people, it is not good.

 

 

I have thought about the incident everyday since and finally decided to write this letter after having spoken to a number of people about the issues raised.

 

 

This has struck me as very unprofessional, being treated in this manner.

 

I’m a very reasonable person, had it been communicated with me that if in the first instance whether it was convenient for me at that moment, they would like to talk to me to save me money on my credit card account. I could have understood, explained of course I could come back after my gym session. However, it was just assumed and presumed to usher me in an office and get on with it!

 

Now, I would like to know what it was they were trying to do once they had sat me down in that small room. Therefore, I would like a full investigation into this incident and what information that so excited your cashier in raising such a fuss about my credit card account, and to what offers were being planned to be discussed with me.

 

 

Not least when you consider Section 7 of the CPUT Regulations 2008:

 

Aggressive commercial practices

 

7.—(1) A commercial practice is aggressive if, in its factual context, taking account of all of its features and circumstances—

(a) it significantly impairs or is likely significantly to impair the average consumer’s freedom of choice or conduct in relation to the product concerned through the use of harassment, coercion or undue influence; and

(b) it thereby causes or is likely to cause him to take a transactional decision he would not have taken otherwise.

(2) In determining whether a commercial practice uses harassment, coercion or undue influence account shall be taken of—

(a) its timing, location, nature or persistence;

(b) the use of threatening or abusive language or behaviour;

© the exploitation by the trader of any specific misfortune or circumstance of such gravity as to impair the consumer’s judgment, of which the trader is aware, to influence the consumer’s decision with regard to the product;

(d) any onerous or disproportionate non-contractual barrier imposed by the trader where a consumer wishes to exercise rights under the contract, including rights to terminate a contract or to switch to another product or another trader; and

(e) any threat to take any action which cannot legally be taken.

(3) In this regulation—

(a) “coercion” includes the use of physical force; and

(b) “undue influence” means exploiting a position of power in relation to the consumer so as to apply pressure, even without using or threatening to use physical force, in a way which significantly limits the consumer’s ability to make an informed decision.

 

It has taken me some time to decide to write this letter but it’s the fact that I have not stopped thinking about this since the incident that finally persuaded me that I had to let you know about what happened.

 

What I am absolutely appalled at is being treated in such a condescending manner. I believe it is only polite and professional to ask me if it is at least convenient for me to speak with someone before your bank employees goes ahead without giving me any chance to reply. Had she not taken my paperwork with her, I would have been able to leave the branch much earlier, but luckily I arrived just in time for my gym session.

I am relatively savvy when it comes to banking matters, what worries me is how many people would have ended up bowing to the pressure and would have taken out something that may have further spiralled themselves into further debt.

 

I trust you can see that this is highly inappropriate behaviour and that something needs to be done to ensure that it does not happen again. It was an attempt at a poorly disguised potential sales pitch and left me feeling humiliated whilst walking out from the office and branch as other customers had clearly viewed the actions taken by your staff.

 

I look forward to hearing from you in due course and would like a written response to my complaint.

 

Yours faithfully

Edited September 16, 2008 by maz1964

[Bookworm]

"Dear Sir/Madam,

 

RE: Meeting with Barclays Personal Account Manager

 

I am writing to you to complain about a meeting I had with xxxxxxxxxx (Personal Account Manager, Barclays Bank xxxxxxxxxxxxx) at xxxxx on Saturday xxxxxxx 2008. I appreciate that I am sending this letter almost a month after the meeting, but this just serves to prove how angry this meeting made me. I have thought about the meeting everyday since and finally decided to write this letter after having spoken to a number of people about the issues raised.

 

I was telephoned by xxxxxxx during the week previous to the meeting and asked whether I would like to come into the branch and discuss overdraft charges. I currently have a claim outstanding against Barclays Bank to reclaim my overdraft charges which has been put on hold pending the Office of Fair Trading investigation. When xxxxxxx called me and invited me in I naturally assumed that it was to discuss this case and, keen to sort an amicable solution to the claim (as per the instructions of the Judge presiding over the case), I agreed to the meeting.

 

 

On the day, xxxxxxxxxxx, I arrived at the bank at xxxxxx only to find xxxxxxx had telephoned me to see where I was, something that I found a little unusual given that I was only one minute late. As I approached the desk, xxxxxxxx offered me a chair whilst saying:

 

 

“Oh well, you were nearly on time babe,”

 

 

I have to say, I found this more than a little unprofessional. When I explained why I was late, she replied saying:

 

 

“Never mind babe, you’re here now”.

 

 

Again, this struck me as unprofessional but I took it as a sign of friendliness and thought nothing more of it. Unfortunately, I was referred to as ‘babe’ the whole way through the meeting and I have to say that I began to find it very uncomfortable towards the end.

 

 

After about two minutes of chatting about my account, it became apparent to me that this meeting was nothing more than a sales pitch. xxxxxxxxx was desperate for me to change my account to one that would cost me more money, no doubt fuelled by the promise of commission (namely the Additions account) {I assume. BW}. Further to this, she pressed me to “upgrade” my joint account which, as I explained on a number of occasions, is by its very nature a joint account held by me and my girlfriend. I will not do anything to this account (save for paying in money) without talking it through with my girlfriend first – I think you’ll agree that this is best practice. Not only did xxxxxxxx encourage me to “upgrade” our joint account, she also tried to get me to increase our overdraft and use it to pay off my personal overdraft. When I once again explained that it is a joint account and therefore not for me to make decisions on alone, xxxxxxxx said to me:

 

“Oh, so you’re still with your girlfriend then yeah?”

 

Not only did I find this question completely irrelevant and unprofessional, I was amazed at how long it took for my message about how our joint account operates to sink in, especially as I was dealing with someone who is apparently an expert in personal banking. Up until this point I was a little disappointed with the direction that xxxxxxxx was taking the meeting, however I certainly wasn’t shocked or surprised especially given the way I was originally signed up to my Additions account some years ago (for the record, I was never asked about signing up I just received an information pack through my door letting me know that I had a new type of account).

 

It was her next sales pitch that left me angry, shocked and questioning whether I had made the right decision.

 

xxxxxxxxxx pointed out that I am eligible for a Barclaycard {no space between Barclay and card, it's a brand name}. I told her that this was not a route that I wanted to go down. I was given a Barclay Card some 12 years earlier when I started university and it ended up causing me no end of grief and cost me a lot of money. I recently paid that card off and do not wish to take out another one. I explained this to xxxxxxxxx and she eventually looked me straight in the eyes and said:

 

“Either you take out this Barclay Card and pay off your overdraft or Barclays will close your account”.

 

I was stunned by this. I can honestly say that when I agreed to the meeting the last thing I expected was to be sitting, chatting to a professional personal banker who was threatening to close my account if I didn’t take out a Barclay Card. If there was ever a classic case of aggressive commercial behaviour then I think you would have to agree that this would be it. I can only assume that xxxxxxxxx made this statement as a reflection of her personal beliefs as I cannot imagine Barclays Bank would promote such an attitude, especially when you consider the level of bad press you received after the BBC’s Whistle Blower programme and not least when you consider Section 7 of the CPUT Regulations 2008:

 

“Aggressive commercial practices

7.—(1) A commercial practice is aggressive if, in its factual context, taking account of all of its features and circumstances—

(a) it significantly impairs or is likely significantly to impair the average consumer’s freedom of choice or conduct in relation to the product concerned through the use of harassment, coercion or undue influence; and

(b) it thereby causes or is likely to cause him to take a transactional decision he would not have taken otherwise.

(2) In determining whether a commercial practice uses harassment, coercion or undue influence account shall be taken of—

(a) its timing, location, nature or persistence;

(b) the use of threatening or abusive language or behaviour;

© the exploitation by the trader of any specific misfortune or circumstance of such gravity as to impair the consumer’s judgment, of which the trader is aware, to influence the consumer’s decision with regard to the product;

(d) any onerous or disproportionate non-contractual barrier imposed by the trader where a consumer wishes to exercise rights under the contract, including rights to terminate a contract or to switch to another product or another trader; and

(e) any threat to take any action which cannot legally be taken.

(3) In this regulation—

(a) “coercion” includes the use of physical force; and

(b) “undue influence” means exploiting a position of power in relation to the consumer so as to apply pressure, even without using or threatening to use physical force, in a way which significantly limits the consumer’s ability to make an informed decision.”

 

As soon as she realised that this tactic would not work one me, and that she was not going to be able to sell me anything, xxxxxxxxxx lost all interest in the meeting and it was swiftly drawn to a close. I left, still amazed by her comment about my account and the Barclay Card application.

 

It has taken me some time to decide to write this letter but it’s the fact that I have not stopped thinking about this since the meeting that finally persuaded me that I had to let you know about what happened. I can laugh off being referred to as ‘babe’ for the whole meeting however unprofessional it is. I can even cope with a poorly disguised sales pitch and having to repeat myself about the joint account. What I am absolutely appalled at is being threatened into taking out a Barclay Card. I am lucky as I am a strong person and I am relatively savvy when it comes to banking matters, what worries me is how many people would have ended up bowing to the pressure and would have taken out the card, further spiralling themselves into debt.

I trust you can see that this is highly inappropriate behaviour and that something needs to be done to ensure that it does not happen again.

I look forward to hearing from you in due course.

Yours sincerely"

 

Like I say, any changes would be great!

 

Thanks,

 

KA.

 

My replacement version for the part highlighted in blue, bear in mind that I pull no punches, so feel free to disregard if too aggressive for your liking, I won't get offended ;-):

 

(...) that I needed to lodge this complaint.

I find it unacceptable and unprofessional that xxx called me "babe" throughout the meeting. I am a customer, not one of her Facebook mates.

I find it unacceptable that I was summoned under what can be interpreted as false pretence to pitch me a product.

I find it unacceptable that even if there were no false pretence, I was summoned for a sales pitch full stop.

I find it unacceptable that xxx made the comments she did about the relationship between me and my girlfriend or that I had to repeat myself over the modus operandi of our joint account.

More importantly, I find it totally unacceptable that xxx repeatedly tried to talk me into a high interest product (the Barclaycard, which carries a much higher APR than say a fixed term loan) as a way to consolidate an existing overdraft facility. This is nothing short of irresponsible lending practices and is further compounded by the threat to close my account if I didn't take the product coerced upon me. I consider xxx's behaviour on that day to be a clear breach of s.7 of the CPUT Regs and am currently considering reporting the incident to the OFT.

I estimate myself lucky that I didn't fall prey to these aggressive sales tactics because I am relatively astute when it comes to banking matters, but I can not help wondering how many more people less experienced bowed to the extreme pressure and took the card further spiralling into debt.If xxx can coerce 1 person per 1/2 hour (maximum), this could end up being a very effective way to reach her sales targets, don't you think?

I am totally disgusted with the whole experience and expect from you:

a) an enquiry into what happened that day, whether xxx acted on her own initiative or with the branch manager's collusion, or worse with head office's approval.

b) a full apology from yourselves for this absolutely inappropriate way of trying to do business.

c) an undertaking that this sorry state of affair will not be allowed to be repeated.

d) appropriate compensation for wasting my time and travel costs.

e) an undertaking that xxx will be re-trained with emphasis on the relevant parts of the CPUT Regs 2008.

Yours faithfully,

**************************************

That should give them the kick up the backside they so justly deserve.

[angel_1]

Bookworm.... you certainly do not pull any punches, that is fantastic, after reading it a few times after and getting back on my chair, it gets to the points forthwith!

 

of course like you say its how anyone would feel in sending is up to them and of course KA, but i think i need to be more assertive in my letter writing now.

 

you have opened my eyes thanks, hope KA reads it later

 

Ciao for now maz

[Bookworm]

here is my letter KA - i feel great! (thank you for not minding me post on your thread) what do you and others think ? ta very much - laters maz

 

Maz:

 

1) It would be easier if you had your own thread on this, it will save confusion as your situation and KA's are quite different.

 

2) You can't really use the CPUT in your case as there was no actual attempt to flog you anything, only you guessing that this was the aim (we all know you're right, of course, but they'll be able to wriggle out of it, since nothing actually happened!)

 

I would still complain, but more stressing the humiliation of eveyone staring at you for what you assume was going to be a sales pitch, complain about the fact that you were given no explanation following this and the rudeness of the person who was in the office. Say that you want an explanation of what made the staff acting in such a manner, demand to know whether there is a flag on your account which marks you as a sales prospect.

Say that you want an apology for the way you were dealt with. Don't say that you are a reasonable person etc... to them that just means doormat.

 

If you need help, just holler. ;-)

[angel_1]

Yes Bookworm thank you, will start a new thread and take on board your comments, much appreciated. Dont worry will holler if i need further help.

 

update - done my own thread under banks, lloyds complaint if you wish to see.

 

Good luck KA.

Edited September 16, 2008 by maz1964

[Bookworm]

Hi guys,

 

Bit facetious I know but do you think, should someone get a claim through and win, Barclays could claim economic hardship given everything that is happening in the banking World at the moment?!

 

In all seriousness, is the current climate likely to affect our claims?

 

Cheers,

 

KA.

Having heard on the news that Barclays are now going to buy off some of Lehman's core assets, I think that question has been safely answered now.

[koalaattack]

Having heard on the news that Barclays are now going to buy off some of Lehman's core assets, I think that question has been safely answered now.

 

Absolutely. The poor buggers have a few billion burning holes in their pockets at the moment no doubt!

 

Cheers for all of your advice. I'm going to send my letter with your ammendments at the end just to see what happens. Of course, this could all go wrong and they could look at how I've run my account over the last few years and close it! About two years ago I called to complain that they charged me £30 for being £3 overdrawn and the bloke on the phone told me I was "lucky to find someone to put up with me". Still, nothing ventured, nothing gained!

 

Thanks for all your help as always - and Maz, good luck too!

 

Cheers,

 

KA

[koalaattack]

Hi everyone,

 

Long time since I posted in here; shocking really!

 

Anyway, I was out on Friday and got chatting to a lawyer at my mate's birthday party. I explained my situation and he was fairly certain that the banks will try their hardest to get costs paid from those of us who have already begun court action.

 

I just wondered what people thought about that and, if that is the likely outcome, how these things will end up being paid?

 

He suggested my costs could be something like £3,000 based on the size of my claim which I obviously don't have just sitting around. He even suggested that Barclays may well be able to add it to my mortgage! I explained that my mortgage isn't with Barclays, apparently that's not a problem as they can still do it.

 

Cheers,

 

KA

[slick132]

Hi KA - how ya doing.

 

Have you read the Site Announcements about POC's being re-drafted by our advising QC, so that claims can proceed.

 

Keep an eye out for the updates.

 

I wonder if your lawyer friend is working for the banks - I've not heard of the banks seeking costs anywhere.

[koalaattack]

Hey Slick,

 

I'm good thanks, you?

 

I'm fairly certain that the bloke I spoke to isn't working for the banks, but I guess it was the first time I met him. So much suspicion! I did mention that I thought it was all extremely corrupt ultimately; one trainee agreed completely, the guy that told me the other stuff (about the mortgage etc) made his case and then said the most telling thing he said all night which was "fairness comes last in a court of law". Sad but true.

 

Anyway, he seemed to think that my claim (over £6K) is enough for Barclays to try for costs; I guess we'll see one day.

 

I'd be interested to see if anyone else has heard of judges staying cases for another 12 months whilst they wait for the OFT's next move. That's what I was told yesterday by the court in Plymouth (I've elaborated in the H.O.L Decision thread).

 

Cheers,

 

KA.

[slick132]

Hi KJA,

 

Yup, doing fine thanks.

 

It could also be that the chap was referring to your case being for over £5K which could, in theory, mean your case being heard in the Fast Claims track. On the FCT, costs are not as limited as they are on the Small Claims track.

 

Anyway, keep an eye on the announcements for guidance.

[Bookworm]

Like Slick says, over £5k = outside the SCC, so costs apply. However, if part of the £6k comes from the 8% APR + fees, I think that as long as the principal keeps it under £5k, it should still be SCC, where the rules for costs differ. It's been a while since I have dealt with a near or over the £5k, but it's what I remember, although I could be mistaken. (Brain not working well lately, so sorry )

[Bookworm]

Sorry, not going to re-read the whole 19 pages of your thread, but you mentioned right at the start that your claim was for £2450, so how did it comes to £6k now?