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Bank Charges - A suggestion


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sorry dave there are honest thieves??? contradiction in terms surely?

 

Not really - burglars are quite honest about what they are doing - stealing.

 

The banks are not quite so honest about it, if indeed, stealing is what they are doing! ;-)

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Advice & opinions of Dave, The Bank Action Group and The Consumer Action Group are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability.

Use your own judgment. Seek advice of a qualified insured professional if you have any doubts.

 

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Whilst I can't deny that is sound advise, the fact is you are quite correct that there are things the bank can do to prevent charges ... before afterwards as well.

 

When a customer has a regular income but something like a payday is late or a regular monthly payment doesn't get sent from the CSA, many customers go just a few pounds overdrawn (basically those lower income households struggling trying to make ends meet). A charge of £35 for a couple of quid for a couple of days can create another charge and another. Getting an authorised O/D often isn't available for high risk low income families, students, single parents, pensioners etc and these are amongst the worst hit by bank charges.

 

Very true...

 

However, i had an issue with my old bank - i specifically asked them not to pay anything unless i had the funds in my account.

 

They took notice and bounced payments totalling £40 and then immediatley charged me £60 for the privilidge. This putting me in my overdraft (which i was hoping to avoid) therefore meaning i cant pay bills the next month and yet magically they still take charges out then too... and so the cycle continues!

 

I think, i might just ask my company if i can be paid in cash each week, least then if i run out of money, its me thats controlling where its gone and not someone else!

 

PS... the lovely bank in question was NatWest!

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i would like to know how it is possible that i could incur an anauthorised overdraft charge of £28 for spending just a little amount over what i had , heres the thing - i dont even HAVE an overdraft

 

why should i have to pay for something that is clearly the banks fault... if i have no money in my account then it is their responsibility to make sure my card cuts off at 0 - 0 , thats when i have no money left, hence i cant afford anything else so why does it go over??

 

you dont go into a shop with 50p, go over and pick up a £1 loaf of bread , take it to the counter and say its okay mate i havent got the £1 , just 50p , i'll give you it later. you need to have the money - so the bank is purely at fault.

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That was my argument!!!

 

I used to bank with First Direct, sadly it was a joint account with my ex who would spend spend spend (and its meant to be us girlies who are shopaholics!!) They never ever (nor would they when asked) bounced a payment or stopped us from drawing out money. When i seperated from my ex and went back to Natwest i explained what had happened previously and spefically requested that if i didnt have clear funds, no payments were to be made. I am paid monthly so any charges could be paid a couple of days later when my wages had gone in. Was told it wasnt a problem and they would help me manage my money. Sadly, they didnt keep that promise.

 

I really am unhappy and very uneasy about the banks ability to take money out of my account as and when they see fit. I understand and aggree that if i cant afford to pay for something then they payment doest go through and will live with a small charge (tho, as everything these days is computerised, why should there be a charge??) but not to the point where the money they have taken out of my account leaves me unable to survive the month!

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sorry dave there are honest thieves??? contradiction in terms surely?

 

 

I think he just meant that at least those thieves are honest about what theyre doing... Theyre stealing, the banks are hiding behind law and the fact that no one has stood up to them previously.

03/10/06-Data Protection Act request sent via recorded delivery

06/10/06- Letter signed for. 15th Nov cut off date.

10/10/06- Statements come in tatty brown envelope.

Will be claiming for £1946.22

23/10/06- Preliminary request for £1946.22 sent recorded delivery.

24/10/06-Letter signed for. 7th Nov cut off.

08/11/06- Standard letter received wanting more time.

 

23/03/07- Time up for NatWest to say whether defending or not.

19/03/07- Acknowledgement of service and saying was going to defend came through.

04/04/07- Deadline for Natwests defence.

03/04/07- Defence filed came through.

05/05/07- Letter from Court to say claim stayed until 27/06/07

25/06/07- Letter from court, claim stayed until further notice.

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I was told by a member of BOS that there was no way i could over spend on my debit card therefore needant worry abt the prospect of debt i was told "if there isnt enough money in your account then it wouldnt get paid" therefore no debt,so i signed and now heres how the story ends im in debt all thanks to going to Asda and buying a few bits that came to £4.99 using my debit card i get hit with a £30 charge and £28 a/o just because there wasnt enough money in my account and because they took that from me there wasnt enough for a couple of dds and so it goes a downwards spiral so tell me how do u get out of this situation when u have been told by what should be a well informed member of staff that u wont get into debt using a debit card.

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Very true...

 

However, i had an issue with my old bank - i specifically asked them not to pay anything unless i had the funds in my account.

 

They took notice and bounced payments totalling £40 and then immediatley charged me £60 for the privilidge. This putting me in my overdraft (which i was hoping to avoid) therefore meaning i cant pay bills the next month and yet magically they still take charges out then too... and so the cycle continues!

 

I think, i might just ask my company if i can be paid in cash each week, least then if i run out of money, its me thats controlling where its gone and not someone else!

 

PS... the lovely bank in question was NatWest!

 

 

heres another idea open an account at another bank get ur wages paid there and there u go back in control of ur money :)

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All ready done!! Natwest arent impressed as they have still being applying charges and now want them paid ASAP...

 

I'm going to claim back all the charges imposed on my account so far - then they can have the money back (tho i suspect i wont owe them a penny by then!!!)

 

Funny, how they NOW want to help me and have been on the phone non stop to discuss my case....

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Alot of people hover around the zero mark. They live on £150.00 to £200.00 a week. If you have £80.00 in your account and you pay £40.00 for food and housekeeping, and then a direct debit comes out of your account for something, it is easy to go over your limit.

 

Poverty in the UK is a real issue. £14,000 is the median income (middle) for people in the UK. That means half of the population live on less that £14,000 a year.

 

In an ideal world people would be allowed to receive their income in cash (I remember the days :rolleyes:) which would make budgeting easier. Also the poor wouldn't have to use banks, which being commercial organisations, try to suck money out of them.

 

If you think about it, if you are a bank, why have the poor as customers? After all they are never going to be investing large amonts of money in you! So hit them with bank charges instead. As for the rich, they are able to keep substantial amounts of money in ther current accounts, so you can invest that money to make profit.

 

Rich or poor the banks make money out of us all.

 

I think the best thing would be for credit unions or the government to set up accounts for people to use, which would only allow them to have the money that they actually have (not overdraft facilities). And that would also allow people to pay for things electronically (with no charges). I know that some credit unions are are now offering bank account with debit card facilites, so some progress is being made.

 

If this facility is ever offered in my area I will certainly be signing up. :) For now I am happy with my basic bank account (I don't want an overdraft facility).

 

Debt culture is obviously also a huge problem in the UK. I remember my grand parents telling me you should never buy what you don't have the money to pay for today and if you wanted something you should save up.

 

I guess thinking changed when Thatcher dereglated banking and lending in the 1980's.

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FredT, you are so right, over the last 10 years high street banks have replaced human beings for contact, with robots on an assembly line. The have simply become captive victims of their own success in unlimited raids on customers' accounts.

 

The current universal anger and dislike of bank practices, shown by the Reclaim Movement, reveals the depth and breadth of animosity from customers both poor and rich. A wake-up call for banks, an universal disapproval for the attitude of bankers.

 

Despite their 6-figure legal employees bankers failed to realise that the present retribution would arrive sooner or later. Bankers making unlimited profits are revealed as functioning on limited brains. As they have been unable to regulate themselves, they have now to face the will of the people, formalised into the majesty of the law.

 

 

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Guest NATTIE

The only additional comment i want to make is that any bank stating that with a debit card you cannot go overdrawn in any shape size or description clearly has never heard of floor limits in shops. It is a fallacy to state that this is the case. At the same time it is a fallacy to believe that there is money in an account because the card is not declined.

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I agree, i think after this whole fiasco is over everyone should focus their attention on being able to get your money paid as cash (if they want) , we are at they mercy of banks and they know this - because of the BACS system we have now no option to follow suit - whats happening people, we are not in control , its OUR money , we should be able to get it how we want and a bank should be nothing more than a place to STORE that money , we control them - if everyone took their money out of the bank for just a day , they would fall

 

banks should not be huge multi billion dollar companies, fair enough they should receive a service charge for us using them to keep our money , but thats it, tey shouldnt be using OUR money to invest and make more money for themselves - like someone was saying about credit unions opening bank accounts for people, THIS is what a bank should be.

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Obviously as I am posting here it is clear that I work for a bank.

 

I have a suggestion to assist everyone in avoiding bank charges.

 

Don't exceed your overdraft limit. ;)

 

Or at least contact your bank before you do, there are things that we can do to prevent the charge... but not afterward.

 

Hi anonman.Can you tell me if you have ever heard of reviewing a overdraft? I am in yorkshire bank and as i am at my last stages of a refund.This is what the bank sent me We notice from our records that your account is due for a review.Contact our branch in the next 14 days If we dont hear from you your personal credit limit will be withdraw in full suffienct funds must be payed in to repay any debt balances outstanding on your account.Iam overdrawn but within my limmit.

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Obviously as I am posting here it is clear that I dont work for a bank.

 

I have a suggestion to assist banks in avoiding legal action over unlawful penalty charges and embarrassing visits from bailiffs.

 

Stay within the law or face the consequences, like all the others who consider legal action merely an occupational hazard. :wink:

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Maggie,

 

When you first obtained the overdraft agreement you would have a review date stipulated. Whilst you stayed below the O/D limit, since the overdraft was agreed has your income risen (O/D unnecessary) or fallen (O/D hair-raising)? Have you had any new bank charges?

 

Suggest you write immediately a letter to the Bank Ombudsman Service, asking what is their stance on banks victimising customers with agreed overdrafts, who also claim for return of unlawful charges. What action can BOS take?

 

Regardless of whether a BOS reply arrives in time, for you to write an impeccably polite letter to your bank manager, stating what a model customer you have been while running the overdraft, that your circumstance now no less than then, perfectly justifies renewing the overdraft for xx months.

 

However in view of alarming stories you have heard recently, you have written to the BOS, discussing your impending overdraft review, and seeking clarification on BOS terms for intervention if applicable. You are confident your esteemed and discreet bank manager would not care to be associated with ructions reported in the press. Nevertheless out of respect for the BOS you will carry a tape-recorder to your overdraft review interview, and will forward a transcript to the BOS if necessary. You again reaffirm your high regard for your bank manager.

 

The worst case scenario is that your bank calls in your overdraft in total, demanding immediate full repayment -- which their letter already hinted. In this they will be within the letter of the law. It is up to you to demonstrate a mailed fist inside a velvet glove -- two can play hard ball.

 

If you truly cannot stand termination of the overdraft, you could consider horsetrading in stead of a battle royal. If they want you to drop your reclaim as their price for renewing the O/D, you could always agree for now -- and reclaim same later when you no longer need the O/D. After all, reclaim eligibility is not going to go away, so long as you do not sign for any "full and final satisfaction" settlement under duress. GL, but stay half a step ahead of your BM.

 

 

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Maggie,

 

When you first obtained the overdraft agreement you would have a review date stipulated. Whilst you stayed below the O/D limit, since the overdraft was agreed has your income risen (O/D unnecessary) or fallen (O/D hair-raising)? Have you had any new bank charges?

 

Suggest you write immediately a letter to the Bank Ombudsman Service, asking what is their stance on banks victimising customers with agreed overdrafts, who also claim for return of unlawful charges. What action can BOS take?

 

Regardless of whether a BOS reply arrives in time, for you to write an impeccably polite letter to your bank manager, stating what a model customer you have been while running the overdraft, that your circumstance now no less than then, perfectly justifies renewing the overdraft for xx months.

 

However in view of alarming stories you have heard recently, you have written to the BOS, discussing your impending overdraft review, and seeking clarification on BOS terms for intervention if applicable. You are confident your esteemed and discreet bank manager would not care to be associated with ructions reported in the press. Nevertheless out of respect for the BOS you will carry a tape-recorder to your overdraft review interview, and will forward a transcript to the BOS if necessary. You again reaffirm your high regard for your bank manager.

 

The worst case scenario is that your bank calls in your overdraft in total, demanding immediate full repayment -- which their letter already hinted. In this they will be within the letter of the law. It is up to you to demonstrate a mailed fist inside a velvet glove -- two can play hard ball.

 

If you truly cannot stand termination of the overdraft, you could consider horsetrading in stead of a battle royal. If they want you to drop your reclaim as their price for renewing the O/D, you could always agree for now -- and reclaim same later when you no longer need the O/D. After all, reclaim eligibility is not going to go away, so long as you do not sign for any "full and final satisfaction" settlement under duress. GL, but stay half a step ahead of your BM.

 

Thank you for reply.To be honest i cant write letters.Thats why i rely on this site.Because somewheree there are templates.so its already done for you.If you know where i can find a temlate i would be greatful. maggie

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Maggie,

 

A letter to the BOS is not a legal document and there is no letter template. It does not matter how you phrase it, just write as you speak. The Ombudsman also has a mum and an auntie, maybe even a dizzie blonde girlfriend who does not like writing letters. He is there to defend the common man and woman against the legal battalions from the banks.

 

He already knows the story, so just 4 sentences will do. He already slapped the Alliance and Leicester on the wrist and fined them £125 for retaliation (closing claimant's account). Upon repeat offences these regulators have powers and influence which banks have not dreamt of.

 

Just write to BOS from the heart, personn to person. The important thing is not the eloquence of your letter, but to let your BM know you have organised reinforcements behind you. As you are scared of him, let him be scared of you.

 

In this game of brinksmanship it is a question who will blink first. I do not know the size of your O/D and the scale of trouble it will trigger if suddenly called in -- a case for carefully weighing the pros and cons. No disgrace in a tactical retreat, the best commanders do it all the time. But if the size of reclaimed charges is about the same as the O/D, then no point retreating, as the expected win will wipe out the O/D any way, it becomes irrelevant whether the bank calls it in. They will cop odious publicity for nothing.

 

 

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Maggie,

 

A letter to the BOS is not a legal document and there is no letter template. It does not matter how you phrase it, just write as you speak. The Ombudsman also has a mum and an auntie, maybe even a dizzie blonde girlfriend who does not like writing letters. He is there to defend the common man and woman against the legal battalions from the banks.

 

He already knows the story, so just 4 sentences will do. He already slapped the Alliance and Leicester on the wrist and fined them £125 for retaliation (closing claimant's account). Upon repeat offences these regulators have powers and influence which banks have not dreamt of.

 

Just write to BOS from the heart, personn to person. The important thing is not the eloquence of your letter, but to let your BM know you have organised reinforcements behind you. As you are scared of him, let him be scared of you.

 

In this game of brinksmanship it is a question who will blink first. I do not know the size of your O/D and the scale of trouble it will trigger if suddenly called in -- a case for carefully weighing the pros and cons. No disgrace in a tactical retreat, the best commanders do it all the time. But if the size of reclaimed charges is about the same as the O/D, then no point retreating, as the expected win will wipe out the O/D any way, it becomes irrelevant whether the bank calls it in. They will cop odious publicity for nothing.

My overdraft is £600.Bank owe me £2495.

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  • 1 month later...

Its funny really. They claim they can help. I begged and pleaded with them last year as my charges were working around a viscous cycle.

 

They offered me no help, both before and afterwards they refused to help the situation. When my wages were paid in weekly (minimum wage + basic tax rate) they gave me no living allowance, and I actually had nothing for 6 weeks. Within those six weeks I relied upon the goodwill of customers + colleagues to make sure that nothing untoward happened to me (within those 6 weeks I lost 2 stone in weight, and went back on pre scripted med's)

 

As for Abbey, the treatment I received off them was worse than expected of a P.o.W camp. I have never been humiliated like that before. I would like them to live on the wage I am on £5.54p/h + my loan repayments and have their tax rate set to BR while the usual utilities are outgoing. I'd give them a month before the situation is reversed.

 

While it is simple (in theory) to avoid charges, it isn't simple to re-arrange all my outgoings every month, as my pay is every 4 week, instead of a set date pcm. If anyone is not understanding of a situation like this (Abbey) then they are nothing more than sadistic and inhuman.

 

Without blowing my own trumpet, I am doing well. I can manage my month on under £350 while paying the bills, loan, and car. While working an under-rated day job and establishing a business during the night. For over 80+ hours a week I am at work to improve on my financial well-being and achieve my long term business goals.

 

To have the sheer arrogance of some individuals, stating the blinding obvious. Is proof that its the idiots in life that get further than the honest smart working intellects. I would rather file for voluntary insolvency for the benefit of maintaining my principals, ethics and idea's than be a mindless middle management brown-nose. Give me a pen & paper and I will draft out what fair trade and ethics means to the honest person, not what it means to a money hungry corporation.

 

 

I am sick of the implied justifications these banks are trying to pass off to warrant the need for excessive charging. I am sick of the customer led service on the context of releasing your legal rights. I am disgusted that I pay more in “LEGAL” fines than a person in court would do for shoplifting or even drink driving. I am not a criminal, sheep nor fool. Should I expect to be treating like one? The last time I checked this was the UK and I was protected by my rights.

 

 

The banks don't help, not in my instance anyway. They chose to appear friendly at first but, they are truly only after one thing. My charges = their money. No matter which way you look at it, they are a business and the majority of businesses look at the 'money is power' philosophy. The more money they have the next competitor they will buy out.

 

 

 

 

 

 

*and breathe (not a single swear word either ******* marvellous) – rant over – apologies.

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Hi all,This is my first post :) .Like Scott i phoned my bank at first, to ask them to waiv one of three charges so i could get back on my feet and back in credit.I was told the charges are 'justified' so they wouldnt be refunding them.Ive now sent off a letter asking for a lot more charges back.Phoning seems to be a waste of time.

 

Id just like to add this,as far as getting wages paid in cash etc.People who are on benefits, now have to have a bank account to get their money paid to them and it is people on benefits/low incomes that are most at risk from excessive charges.Last month i had £200 in charges,i only get £392 p/m in benefit(my only source of income),thats more than half my monthly income in charges,tell me how im supposed to live?.Whilst i acknowlege i may have mismanaged my money,things are gonna snowball with more charges,more stress etc.I can fully understand why people HAVE committed suicide in the past,over financial difficulties.So to the guy that says "Dont go over your overdraft" try explaining that to those peoples families and children.

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Hi Lonsi and welcome to CAG! :)

 

First- Dont worry about a thing- you WILL get ALL the money that these parasites have unlawfully taken from you.

 

Not only that, you WILL get all the interest back that that they have unlawfully taken from you as well.

 

The fact you may have mismanaged your money is neither here nor there, so no need to even mention it.

 

This is all down the the greed of the Banks, everyone on here knows that. You are amongst friends here.:)

 

Which bank are you with?

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Lonsi, Have you seen this, Don't know too much about it but it can't do any harm in your situation http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/42170-right-appropriation-stop-bank.html

Barclays - 2 Accounts - WON

Capital 1 - WON with CI

LTSB - WON

LTSB pre 6 years - N1 for non compliance filed

Barclays pre 6 years - Prelim sent

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Lonsi, Have you seen this, Don't know too much about it but it can't do any harm in your situation http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/bank-templates-library/42170-right-appropriation-stop-bank.html

 

 

 

Thats interesting,but ive not heard of this or do i really understand what its about.Anyone care to explain it a little?

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