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My 6+ Year Claim Against HSBC


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Quick update:

 

Letter (prelim and LBA in one) just sent to the bank requesting refund of charges between 1996 and 2000. My initial intention was to go straight back to 1982, but there was a huge cost risk in this. After advice, the claim is for a more modest amout, and if it is settled then I have the option, and the personal precedent, of going back through the mists of time bit by bit...to 1982.

 

A slight change from plan was to request interest at 14.8% APR, the bank's authorised rate. The argument is the bank would have charged me at this rate, and therefore "mutuality " and "reciprocity" has been brought to bear on the claim...

 

Will keep people updated on progress, but as I have given them 14 days before I raise a claim, I expect this to move quickly...:)

 

Developments too on the "charges pending" thread - specifically that they will apply further charges on July 7th - a fortnight after they close my account. There has to be a contract issue somewhere in all of this...

 

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Blimey - expect one hell of a fight on this one.... either that or they are going to pay you off fast and dump you faster than a bad vindaloo.

.

Barclays - £268 - Moneyclaim

Capital One - £172 - Moneyclaim

Abbey (2nd claim) - Moneyclaim

---------------------------------------------------

 

HSBC - £2164.46- PAID IN FULL

MBNA - £471 - PAID IN FULL

NatWest - £307 - PAID IN FULL

Abbey Business - £314.15 - PAID IN FULL

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Blimey - expect one hell of a fight on this one.... either that or they are going to pay you off fast and dump you faster than a bad vindaloo.
My personal belief is that I will be the vindaloo - I think the "commercial reason" they are closing my account is that I will only ever cost them money. For them to defend in the small claims court, even if they win, will only cost them money they cannot recover...I hope they turn round, ask what I want to just go away, and then pay it...8)

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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I hope you are right. And the account, what do you intend to do there?

.

Barclays - £268 - Moneyclaim

Capital One - £172 - Moneyclaim

Abbey (2nd claim) - Moneyclaim

---------------------------------------------------

 

HSBC - £2164.46- PAID IN FULL

MBNA - £471 - PAID IN FULL

NatWest - £307 - PAID IN FULL

Abbey Business - £314.15 - PAID IN FULL

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They are closing it - there really is not a lot I can do about it. I believe in fairness, and I think they have finally realised that as a business, it would be a bad decision to allow the account to continue...fair play to the bank, even though it is too late for them...:):):)

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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I thought you may have planned an injunction against them doing so - just to make life more difficult for them.

 

Can't critisise you for not doing so though, you've provided us all with a magnificent result.

 

Cheers pal

.

Barclays - £268 - Moneyclaim

Capital One - £172 - Moneyclaim

Abbey (2nd claim) - Moneyclaim

---------------------------------------------------

 

HSBC - £2164.46- PAID IN FULL

MBNA - £471 - PAID IN FULL

NatWest - £307 - PAID IN FULL

Abbey Business - £314.15 - PAID IN FULL

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To be honest an injunction would be unlikely to succeed - the account history has been poor, and a "commercial decision" would be deemed fair. However, I did say that I would "consider" asking for an injunction...I think they were laughing when they read that sentence...

 

The real bummer is that I am still trying to get a parachute account open - latest twist to that saga is in getting a replacement driving licence. My old one was from an old address (not acceptable) and I just received a letter from DVLA..."you need to prove your identity...blah blah blah..."

 

Talk about going round in bleeding circles...aaarrrggghhh!!!

 

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Oh my - I'm going to have so much fun. Today, for the fourth day in a row, I received a call from someone claiming to be from HSBC. On each occasion they were determined to get me to reveal my security details, and they tried to argue Data Protection Act for this.

 

Spicey, being the awkward git that I am, countered with exactly the same DPA argument for NOT providing security details to someone calling from an unknown number, and claiming to be from HSBC. Each time I asked that they write instead, and today I received a letter.

 

The letter was quite simple, noticing that my overdraft limit had been breached, and confirming that bank charges had been applied to my account. In a nutshell, to avoid further bank charges HSBC wanted to discuss upping my overdraft...!...on an account that has been closed for FOUR days...!

 

Today's 'phone call was the last straw, and I resolved to put a stop to them. First was a call-centre monkey, followed by their supervisor, followed by the senior supervisor and finally the call-centre manager/ess. After finally revealing my date of birth (I knew it was HSBC all along) we got to the point of the call - my overdraft and what was I going to do about it.

 

I queried why a call was necessary for a closed account, and she was completely unaware of this. She then put me on hold whilst she called my branch, and then informed me that I would receive a call from my branch...in Essex. R...i...i...ight! My branch is in Kingston, so ten minutes was spent discussing why she lied to me.

 

I then went on to ask why she thought my account was overdrawn. HSBC owe me over £4K in unlawful bank charges, so my account is in credit by thousands of pounds...additionally, the invoice I raised, for "manual intervention," is due to be settled today. "Can you tell me when these monies will be credited to my account...?"

 

I admit it, I am a complete and utter bar steward. She was completely flummoxed, none of the relevant information was to hand, and I kept her on the 'phone for 59 minutes and 36 seconds. I am suffering a severe overdose of smug satisfaction...which only leaves me with a letter to write.

 

To be continued...

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

 

Collage001.gif

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Like Your Style.

 

:D

 

 

HSBC WON three times!!!!! Read about my continuing battle (claim FOUR!) Link HERE

Capital One WON Link

HERE

GE capital (5 accounts) WON link HERE

Lloyds bank account WON second claim starting! link HERE

Budget insurance cough up WON link HERE

Principles WON link HERE

A&L (Mrs Crusher's account) claim link HERE

Barclays claim link HERE

 

Any advice given is on an informal basis only and without prejudice or liability. In in any doubt, consult a qualified lawyer.

IF YOU HAVE GOT YOUR MONEY BACK, PUT SOME BACK INTO THE SITE TO HELP KEEP IT OPEN!

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  • 2 weeks later...

I'm in a bit of a quandary here - I have already had a claim against HSBC, for penalty charges within the six year statute of limitations period. This claim had it's own thread, and has been and gone. I also have this thread, where I am going for a claim outside of the six year period, and my other thread where I regularly contest the bank charges pending.

 

Do I start a fourth thread, as I feel I should, because I am now attempting to get the closure of my account reversed? I believe I can do this, due to some trickery, tactical reliance on the terms and conditions, and an absolutely amazing oversight on the part of HSBC. I won't detail this oversight at present, suffice to say that if this works, I will share the methods with all HSBC customers who need to know.

 

However, the bank's position at present, is that the account is closed. Therefore I have started to receive letters geared towards finalising all alleged debts within the account, and putting an end to all activity. Here is my response to the first of these letters:

Dear Mr Shepherd,

 

Thank you for your letter of 03 July 2006.

 

I feel that I must express my concerns over the veracity of your assertions within the letter. Additionally, your letter is proof, if further proof were required, that HSBC operates an internal communications policy which clearly demonstrates that the left hand does not know what the right hand is doing.

 

In the first instance, your statement “Following your instruction to close the above HSBC account” is a complete and utter fabrication. At no point did I submit this instruction to HSBC, and to attest that I did is a gross slur on my personal character and reputation.

 

Furthermore, the manner of HSBC's closure of the aforementioned account is currently in dispute. As per the terms and conditions of the contract between HSBC and myself, HSBC has NO rights of enforcement over clause 12.4, and therefore has no right to close the account by attempting to enforce this clause. This issue is currently being dealt with by the HSBC legal department (DG Solicitors)

 

In the second instance, I would contest the sums that you allege are owed by myself to HSBC, and your “need” for a cheque to cover the alleged sums. In light of the unlawful closure of the account, I am not in possession of a chequebook with which to issue a cheque – a Catch 22 which should be apparent to you. Furthermore, I would not be prepared to issue a cheque in the alleged sum for the following reasons:

  • Any alleged sum owed by myself is currently in dispute, due to the unlawful nature of the penalty charges applied to my account
  • The alleged sum “outstanding balance together with interest and charges” is incorrect, insofar as there are no penalty charges pending or in arrears on the account. I have a letter of confirmation of this particular issue from DG Solicitors, and your assertion that penalty charges are due is further evidence of the abysmal communications policies employed by HSBC
  • There are currently one settlement-outstanding and two settlement-pending invoices due to HSBC, and in the total sum of £225. Again, these are being dealt with by DG Solicitors

In light of the above, and considering the nature of your letter, I would like to draw your attention to the following points. The alleged sums owed by myself are currently contested, and are formally in dispute. ANY attempt by HSBC to send the alleged debt to a debt recovery agency will be a clear breach of Section 10 of the Data Protection Act ( 1998 ). If you do not understand what this means, I respectfully suggest that you consult your legal department for further information.

 

In light of the content of this letter, it is clear that the errors of HSBC have required manual intervention by me, to bring these matters to your attention for a swift resolution. As such I invoke my absolute right to enforce the amended term of my contract with HSBC, pursuant to my letter of 28 April 2006.

 

Therefore I duly submit an invoice for my time, pursuant to the amended clause, and in the sum of £75. Terms: to be settled within 28 days, by cheque, and made payable to Mr S Skull.

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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you are one cheeky son of a gun!

 

Well done fella for constructing such a fantastic letter, and I hope to read more of this thread very, very soon.

 

G.

.

Barclays - £268 - Moneyclaim

Capital One - £172 - Moneyclaim

Abbey (2nd claim) - Moneyclaim

---------------------------------------------------

 

HSBC - £2164.46- PAID IN FULL

MBNA - £471 - PAID IN FULL

NatWest - £307 - PAID IN FULL

Abbey Business - £314.15 - PAID IN FULL

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Wouldn't people love to know what I am up to here - enforcement of contract terms, absolute rights over amended terms...etc? All will become clear shortly...so tune in next time folks. :)

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

 

Collage001.gif

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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aww c'mon spice, when you gonna spill the beans?

HSBC- £4995, settled payment in full

if you found this post helpful, please click the scales (top right of post), ta ;)

 

if you're not sure what to do?, Read the FAQ's

Unsure about what to claim, or confused about overdraft interest? Charges explanation

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aww c'mon spice, when you gonna spill the beans?
When the tactic has been proven to work (or not, as the case may be...)

 

It is a different issue to most of the other things, and for me to encourage everyone to start trying something that may fail would be irresponsible on my part...

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back.

Spiceskull v HSBC.

Thank you Consumer Action Group.

Read my blog.

 

Collage001.gif

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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quite right, so is it after fridays deadline then?

HSBC- £4995, settled payment in full

if you found this post helpful, please click the scales (top right of post), ta ;)

 

if you're not sure what to do?, Read the FAQ's

Unsure about what to claim, or confused about overdraft interest? Charges explanation

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We'll see - it depends upon the nature of their response...

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back

Spiceskull v HSBC

Thank you Consumer Action Group

Read my blog

View a heated discussion about bank charges on the Times Educational Supplement bulletin boards

 

Collage001.gif

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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anything on this spiceskull?

.

Barclays - £268 - Moneyclaim

Capital One - £172 - Moneyclaim

Abbey (2nd claim) - Moneyclaim

---------------------------------------------------

 

HSBC - £2164.46- PAID IN FULL

MBNA - £471 - PAID IN FULL

NatWest - £307 - PAID IN FULL

Abbey Business - £314.15 - PAID IN FULL

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Now that you ask - there was no letter in the post...how disappointing.

 

Never mind, I now have a parachute account with NatWest (I got fed up waiting for Co-Op to move their butts,) and once my salary cheque has cleared I will be able to raise a claim against HSBC. Should be fun...

 

 

See the steps I took to get my bank charges back

Spiceskull v HSBC

Thank you Consumer Action Group

Read my blog

View a heated discussion about bank charges on the Times Educational Supplement bulletin boards

 

Collage001.gif

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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Fantastic letter, I bet they are going to read that one and think "oh no..here we go" :)

REFUNDED

Hubbys - HSBC £4,165 paid 18/8 after MCOL issued :)

HSBC - £651 paid 18/8 after MCOL issued :)

HSBC - £147 Prel 7/8, LBA 21/8, MCOL 6/9 £241

Hubby Halifax - Prel 29/7 £215, LBA 21/8, Offer rec. £110 22/8, MCOL 6/9 £298

Abbey - £2758 - Prel 26/6, LBA 10/7 - MCOL 26/7 £3,391, offer 25/8 £1,755.94, paid £3567.32 after Case manag hearing

Barclays - £675 Prel7/8, LBA 21/8, offer received £300 MCOL 6/9 £998 - Paid £1,012 before going to Court

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  • 2 weeks later...

Okay - it's only fair that I post another update.

 

My last letter to the bank was a "hit them with all barrels" letter. It requested a refund of charges between 1996-2000, that the charges were estimated as they could not provide any data, that contractual interest was charged, that my invoices be paid, that the closure of the account was unenforceable under the Ts&Cs...the list was very long...:o

 

Here is their reply, and to be honest, whilst it arrived one day after the deadline, it has taken a lot of mulling over. I will get them, but it is going to be a bloody-nosed and obnoxious fight - my timetable is really going to be as-and-when I can get round to it:

REQUEST FOR PAYMENT OF CHARGES AND RE-OPENING OF YOUR ACCOUNT

 

We refer to your letters of 4 and 6 July and deal with each in turn.

 

Your letter dated 4 July

 

HSBC recently reimbursed you £XXXLOTS for certain charges (together with interest) applied to your account in the period March 2000 to March 2006. We wish to make it quite clear that, notwithstanding the suggestion in your 4 July letter, this should not be taken as any indication that HSBC accepted your claim. The payment was made on a without prejudice basis for commercial reasons, namely to avoid the management time and irrecoverable legal costs that would be incurred in defending your claim.

 

You are now seeking an additional £XXXLOTS which is your estimate of the charges that you claim were applied to your current account during the period June 1996 to March 2000. Notwithstanding the points made in your letter, we remain of the view that you have no legal claim for this amount for the reasons stated in our letter of 30 June. Even leaving aside the other legal objections to your claim, you must understand that there is no question of our client considering "reimbursing" you for charges which there is no evidence you paid.

 

In relation to your demand for payment of your "invoices", our client's position remains as set out in our letter of 30 June (not paying!). We address below your interpretation of HSBC's terms and conditions.

 

In relation to the telephone calls you have complained about we have had sight of transcripts of the calls made to you on 26 and 28 June. In both cases HSBC's representative simply asked you to confirm the month and year of your birth before continuing with the call. This is an entirely appropriate security procedure and we confirm that you would not have been in breach of s4.l of the terms and conditions by responding with this information.

 

In relation to your threat to ask the OFT to revoke HSBC's Consumer Credit Licence, this is a matter for you to communicate with the OFT as you consider appropriate. HSBC is confident that it is a fit and proper person to hold a licence.

 

Your letter of 6 July

 

We disagree with your assertion that our client's decision to close your account under clause 12.4 of HSBC's terms and conditions was unlawful or that clause 12.4 is an unfair term under the Regulations. Our client was entitled to close your account.

 

The FSA Briefing Note does not suggest otherwise. It contemplates that in certain circumstances a bank is entitled to close an account provided that such closure complies with the Banking Code. Section 7.5 of the Banking Code contemplates that a bank may close an account on 30 days notice or more quickly in certain circumstances. Banks are under no obligation to continue doing business with any particular customer (and nor is any customer obliged to continue banking with a particular bank). It is not unusual to close an account if the bank considers that the relationship with the customer has broken down irretrievably.

 

Our client believes that that is the position that it has reached with you and it is perfectly entitled under clause 12.4 to close your account. We would also make the point that it is somewhat surprising that you would wish to maintain the relationship with our client given your correspondence over the last few months (he he he).

 

We note your interpretation of the words on page 4 of the terms and conditions that "No one else apart from you will have any rights or be able to enforce these Terms." This is an entirely standard provision and its meaning is quite clear. It simply ensures that no other person, other than you, has any rights against our client under the contract. It plainly does not deprive our client of its rights to enforce the agreement.

 

Your apparent notice pursuant to s10 of the Data Protection Act is not accepted by HSBC. It does not accept that its continued processing of your data (a factually accurate record of your account) is unjustified. As we have said above HSBC had legitimate grounds to close your account.

Okay...battle lines for Spice v HSBC II have been drawn...bring them on!
  • Confused 1

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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They just like arguing the fine points...a bit like me really.

Alecto, Magaera et Tisiphone: Nemesis on Earth is come.

 

All advice and opinions given by Spiceskull are personal, and are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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My God HSBC really are full of it arent they?!

 

Some guy sweating it out in the HSBC legal office trying to fit as many loop-holes and get-out's as humanley possible into one letter...

 

Fight the good fight Spiceskull!!

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Some guy sweating it out in the HSBC legal office trying to fit as many loop-holes and get-out's as humanley possible into one letter...

 

I think that's half the fun of it for SS - receiving their replies for the perfectly valid, but bloody irritating (for HSBC!) questions he asks and points he makes!

Bank of Scotland: Claiming £699.47, SETTLED IN FULL at moneyclaim stage

Sisters NatWest - Claiming £1056 - SETTLED at AQ stage

Natwest CC - Claiming £804, SETTLED IN FULL at LBA stage

GF Natwest - claiming £749.33, moneyclaim filed - SETTLED IN FULL 04/08

MBNA: Claiming £150 - SETTLED IN FULL at LBA stage

HSBC: £1014 - SETTLED at LBA stage + pending charges removed

Sisters HSBC - £300 - SETTLED IN FULL at prelim stage

Yorkshire bank - claiming £496.68 - SETTLED IN FULL at court date stage.

Capital One - claiming £605.54 -SETTLED IN FULL

 

 

 

DON'T FORGET TO DONATE!

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Please note that this topic has not had any new posts for the last 4933 days.

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