Chip & PIN Weakness Revealed

[JimmyTheOne]

Watchdog BBC1 Tonight:

 

Details from chip-and-pin cards could be stolen while shoppers make purchases, scientists discovered in an investigation for BBC One's Watchdog.

 

 

Maybe this explains whats been happening at retailers and petrol stations the length and breadth of the country over the last four months.

 

From Eastbourne to Hull

 

Watchdog producer Alan Holland said: 'This shows the system is not infallible.' Sandra Quinn, spokeswoman for Apacs, which represents the banks on card fraud, said: 'There is no evidence to suggest this has actually happened in the UK at all.

 

Article here.

 

Get yourself a Chip & Signature Card.

[Guest NATTIE]

Jimmy, not sure if cambridge university employees normally commit fraud but they have spotted a weakness in the system that needs to be rectified immediately.

[soma]

Has anyone had any success in asking for a chip and signature card, as it would seem to me to offer better protection than chip and pin, plus you don't have to remember any pin numbers.

 

Chip & Pin - Pin used fraudulently - you are responsible

Chip & Signature - Signature used fraudulently - bank is responsible

 

How exactly does chip & pin help customers?

[JimmyTheOne]

You don't ask for a Chip & Signature Card you tell your card issuer you need one. If they ask why you can't manage a PIN you tell them the truth - you can't remember all those numbers, you've seen Watchdog and you wont write your PIN down.

 

If they spin you a line about having to be disababled or blind to have a C&S card then tell them to put this in writing to you. It is wrong.

 

I only use one 4 fig number and I'm b@@gred if I could remember more for seldom used credit cards. Card Watch advice is don't use the same PIN for each card. I'm only following their advice.

 

If they insist then play them at their own game. Use their card keep entering the wrong PIN (which you can't remember) and they'll soon send you a Chip & Signature card.

[buzby]

No - you don't need to leap through hurdles. My bank (RBS) asked why I wanted Chip & Sig and I said I refused to accept that anyone entering my PIN was evidence that I had approved the transaction. I required they bank retain the same level of security with my money, and permit a signature to prove the legitimacy of the transactioin to the highest level. I got my card in 4 days.

[buzby]

Has anyone had any success in asking for a chip and signature card, as it would seem to me to offer better protection than chip and pin, plus you don't have to remember any pin numbers.

 

I asked, and I got - however there IS a caveat.

 

My Maestro Debit Card (which I previously used to get money from the bank ATM) changed radically after the issue of C&S. There's nothing special about the card, it is the same as C&P, HOWEVER no PIN code is entered on the chip OR the mag stripe, as the field is left blank.

 

Try and use an ATM, and the card will be spat out because; "No PIN Stored". What a crock! The PIN COULD still be present on the mag stripe as before, but they assume if you can;t cope with the Chip, no PIN will be provided. As to how you get cash, I do it over the bank counter - where they don;t ask for a PIN, but a signature, and at any supermarket offerin Cashback. It's a slight pain, but one I'm prepared to endure.

[meagain]

I maintain highly non-standard hours (as evidenced from the fact that I am posting here at 3:45am), and can't go to Chip & Sig unless I know I can use an ATM. I am not paying £1 for access to my money at the local Spar, where I will also need to make a minimum purchase of £10. Suggestions?

[JimmyTheOne]

meagain: Tip: Why not get a Banks Own Savings Card (These can be used in any ATM) but not in shops or overseas. Transfer money (as required) to your account on-line whenever you need it.

 

Any card that has a Visa/MasterCard/Europay etc logo - Bin your PIN and continue to sign by way of Chip & Signature.

 

Just a suggestion that may meet YOUR needs.

 

Click here for liability issue stories where PINs were used and victims bore the cost of the fraud

 

MIllions Lost to Petrol PIN Thief (Click here) - Check your statements

 

Here's an update on the Petrol Station Frauds - there's now an estimated 2,500 victims.

 

Hope this helps.

[buzby]

The RBS stated they cannot have 2 cards active on one account, but if a Joint account, one card can be Sig and the other PIN. The other alternative, is a savings account linked to the current, which then allows ATM transactions from either, and no Chip.

[anon1]

Jimmy, you are wrong about a savings account card, I;m afraid

[JimmyTheOne]

Jimmy, you are wrong about a savings account card, I;m afraid

 

No I'm not, I've been using mine in the above scenario for the last 18 months.

 

The savings card as Buzby correctly states has no Chip, and there's no plans at present to Chip this type of card.

 

Lloyds TSB (This morning). "If you insist on Chip & Signature Cards we will provide them."

[anon1]

we agree to disagree because, chip and pin and chip and signature cards have a chip on them, so they can be used, cards with Solo and Maestro can still be used as debit cards.

[JimmyTheOne]

Sorry, probably my fault. I think we are misunderstanding each other.

 

I'm saying that Banks Own savings cards without a logo (other than link) can be used to withdraw money at most ATMs in the UK only, or over the counter in branch with a signature.

 

You can't use banks own savings cards in shops.

 

Hope this claifies.