Baliff petition;Stop them getting a legal right to forced entry;Peter Bard

[Tryst]

The real abuse of the system will be due to overloading the system. Bailiffs know the courts don't have the manpower and will simply inundate the courts with applications. These applications will get a rubber stamped approval without doing any checks simply to reduce the workload.

 

I can see many mistakes being made by bailiffs, some resulting in serious injury or even death. I do not answer the door every time someone knocks because there are times when I just want to be alone. I don't feel like having friends around and just want to shut myself off from the world for a few hours.

 

If a bailiff decided to break in because there was no answer, he risks more than his job. I suffer from 'blind rage' and black out when I get really angry. At times when I decide to lock myself away, I can feel the anger rising inside and use computer games etc to vent it in a harmless way. Do not disturb in that situation is a warning, not a request. It may surprise you to know that nearly 25% of the population suffers from it in varying degrees.

[Oh Boy!]

No FRAN

 

It will still need to go before my Judge, if he will not give me a breaking in order then the private sure as hell will not get one. I have had these dicussions in team meetings with the judges already, THEY ALREADY KNOW THAT PRIVATE BAILIFFS ARE ROGUES, THE BUCK STOPS WITH THE JUDGE, IF IT ALL GOES WRONG.

[sosumi]

I'm hoping that this is good news :

Tighter regulations for bailiffs announced - Ministry of Justice

[tomtubby]

The following is a Press Release from the Ministry of Justice confirming that bailiffs will not be given the power to force entry!!

 

17 March 2009

 

Plans for a new code regulating the activities of bailiffs were announced by Justice Minister Bridget Prentice today.

 

To provide clarity for debtors and certainty for creditors, the following measures will be implemented in advance of full independent regulation:

• an online certificated bailiff register allowing debtors to check bailiffs' certification status
  
• an extension to the certification process to ensure that all bailiffs provide a Criminal Records Bureau check with their application
  
• minimum training requirements and competences for inclusion in the certification process.
  

These measures, which will commence later in the year, will contribute to the development of the more permanent solution of independent regulation in 2012.

However, following a comprehensive reassessment of the provisions in the Tribunals, Courts and Enforcement Act 2007 ordered by the Secretary of State for Justice, the government will not be extending bailiffs' powers of entry and the use of force by enforcement agents, and will not be commencing Charging Order reforms.

 

Justice Minister Bridget Prentice said:

 

'Last year Jack Straw asked me to look again at enforcement provisions contained in the TCE Act, to assess whether they remained appropriate.

 

'As a result the government is today introducing plans for a number of measures and which will prepare the ground for long term reform of the enforcement industry and a new code governing the activities of bailiffs.

 

'This will help debtors, creditors, bailiffs and the police understand what their rights and responsibilities are when debts are enforced. However, following the reassessment the government will not now be commencing provisions on Charging Orders or taking any action that would extend bailiffs powers of entry.'

[Oh Boy!]

TT thats the one, and I am more relieved than anyone else, that power was just too MUCH.

[JonCris]

sosumi[/left];2045398]I'm hoping that this is good news :

Tighter regulations for bailiffs announced - Ministry of Justice

 

That's great & should never have been considered in the 1st place but what we really want is for someone to enforce the existing law........to stop the cretins from forcing their way unlawfully into homes often with the able assistance of the local coppers:mad:

 

Also they have withdrawn the sharing of data with the private sector........... I see an election coming;)

[Oh Boy!]

tragically no more info on the on going DATA DISCLOSURE

[elsinore]

Well, well.

 

Regular readers of this thread will remember the fragrant Vera Baird who did her best to crush us underfoot by railroading the worst aspects of the Tribunal Courts and Enforcement Bill into law.

 

Just as I was thinking 'Up yours, Vera' and wondering what she is up to now, she provides us with a wonderful example of Foot in Gob:

 

Minister predicts 'green shoots' on day when unemployment reaches over two million - Telegraph

 

Els

[Francesco]

This is great news, a truimph for reason and humanity, or prevailing economic and electoral conditions.

 

I hope Peter Bard is around and aware of this bulletin, we all owe him so much.

 

F.

[sunflower99]

Great news! and show that very occaissonly common sense prevails!

[reorete]

hi i reciedve this letter this morning can anyone advise me.... TAKE FORMAL NOTICE.despite previous applications you have failed to pay the outstanding penalty charge notice due to bury metropolitan borough council.therefore i have been issued your case so that i can call at your home this coming weekend with a removal contractor when i will remove your goods to the local auction house.i would prefer that you were in attendance when your goods are removed and should another day be more suitable i urge you to contact me on the number below immediately should you prefer to pay the balance outstanding i will require the full payment to be at this office in good time before i call. im very worried about this so any advise i would be gratefull for.the car was given to me last year by my kids dad.we dont live together and the fines not in my name its in my exs.i have the car i thought he was bein nice givin it to me to help me with our kids.ive mentioned these letters to him when he picks the kids up but hes uninterested in them

[felicity2009]

So, this is on the statute books already, taken through paliament on a Good Day to Bury Bad News, by a woman who was rewarded with promotion for it and the whole notion was promoted by some dimwit who was told just enough by his bosses to fool the odd committee but not enough to answer questions in depth.

 

The devil, as we know is in the detail, and 15 pages of this detail were censored.

 

I smell a very large rat. Orders came down for this one from upon very high indeed, and I don't mean the prime minister. Who the hell would have both Jack Straw and Vera whats-her-name in their pocket? Hm.. didn't I hear mention of the Privy Council somewhere? Never a bad place to start when looking for rats.

 

 

I wish I'd been aware of this before it passed, but I wasn't.

 

For the record, and for when this all blows up again, as it surely will, both the people who want to narrow the focus of the campaign and the people who want to broaden it are right. Its called 'targeting'.

 

I spent a long time in marketing

 

Poor people need to be aware they are going to be restrained and beaten up after one of those disasters that happens that makes them prioritise their bills or when the benefits agency stuffs up - for that you target the programs they watch the MPs they vote for, the newspapers they get. They have better things to worry about than what happens to the middle classes.

 

Middle classes same but in reverse. You aren't going to get very far going on about poor people, who many of them believe to be layabouts and scroungers. Don't even mention single mothers in any press release designed to target them. You have to point out this could happen to *them* if they ever had a parking ticket go to the wrong address etc.. Do they want their daughter pinned to the floor by a six foot bailiff because someone in the communal student household forgot to buy a TV license?

 

Its no good appealing to people's better instincts, you need to appeal to their sense of self-preservation.

 

That stealing Fido thing is excellent. You can unite every social group in the land with that one. I'm pleased they left it in. Its their undoing. Don't campaign too hard against it till a general civil rights movement finally decides on some specific goals, then hits critical mass.

 

[update]

 

I just had a nice long think.

 

The Human Rights Act is generally portrayed in the media as something drummed up by liberal do-gooders to protect 'terrorists'.

 

This is so very very far from the truth. It has its basis in the incredulous horror felt by those who liberated the concentration camps in Nazi Europe and the waste of a hundred and twenty million lives in the conflict worldwide. It has taken 50 years to get it on the statute books, Europe-wide but the process was set in motion by, I think, the Council of Europe.

 

Don't be distracted by thoughts of left wing vs. right wing politics. Its just a puppet show. There is another dimension to politics - anarchy vs. authoritarianism. Every government I remember has been more authoritarian than the last. 'Governments' are middle management for corporations - never forget that. The corporation who ran the filing system in the concentration camps is still in business - and no-one ever got fired for buying from it.

 

These people hate the Human Rights Act. It guarantees certain rights merely by the fact you are human.

 

It is a very special piece of legislation. It is not a statue or a precedent (well its a statute as well now) - it is whats known as a 'living instrument' - that is..

 

Statue is trumped by precedent ('precedent' tells the judge how to interpret the statute by looking at how previous judges interpreted it).

 

Statute and precedent are trumped by a living instrument. Nothing can overrule it.

 

Got that?

 

Nothing.

 

So, the wording of any law must now be interpreted to be in keeping with the Human Rights Act regardless of what precedent says. If no such interpretation is possible, the statute must be returned to parliament for revision. If this is not done we become the laughing stock of Europe. This is not just for new laws, it is old ones too.

 

Centuries of common law thrown out, and good riddance. It didn't protect us from the poll tax. We need something more robust.

 

That, I think, is what is behind Jack Straw's sudden conversion to sainthood.

 

They've been doing business as usual in parliament, always figuring theres some fix. Find a slow news day, slip in a 'loophole' closure where it won't be noticed, put it up for discussion at 1am then - lie, lie, lie then lie some more.

 

Legalised home invasions and beatings are on the statute book already. But they can't use them! Oops a minor flaw in the plan - the Human Rights Act.

 

And thats whats stopped them. A process put in motion by our grandfathers.

 

You can't provoke the population beyond endurance, cause a bunch of civil unrest, use it as an excuse to bring in your Fourth Reich ("its a matter of internal security") while certain inalienable human rights that cost 120 million dead bodies are still in effect.

 

A concerted attack on the HRA is therefore coming.

 

Expect more 'pedophiles hiding behind HRA' 'terrorist sheltering under HRA' type headlines.

 

The idea, of course - being to make the population start screaming to have fewer rights!

 

 

Felicity

Edited April 23, 2009 by felicity2009

[JonCris]

felic it was passed on the same day Tone left Parliament to all that appalling hand clapping & it was Vera Baird - a former civil rights barrister what done it - ironic or what - shows how naked ambition defeats the conscience

[felicity2009]

Yes, her and that other dimwit are whats known as 'useful idiots' in the trade. And thats a technical term, not a personal attack.

 

Its standard operating proceedure.

 

You get someone a bit dim, promote them beyond their ability, then they have to follow even illegal orders without question because they do not know which questions to ask.

 

Should the merde hit the air conditioning device they can be sacrified without undue interruption to One's Plans.

 

For the American equivalent see Alberto Gonzalez. He tried firing any district attorney likely to prosecute vote rigging. Damn near ended up on a 'quail hunt' with Cheney if I'm any judge..

 

I'm thinking Vera was also chosen because it was thought she might know how to get around the Human Rights Act.

 

Which would mean they anticipated the problem already.

 

Now it is on the back burner awaiting a solution.

 

 

[update]

 

I think I found the specific spanner in the works.

 

YL v. Birmingham city council.

 

You can get round the HRA act if you are a private company contracted by the council. However if you have special powers defined by statute, you are then a public authority.

 

So you can either be..

 

a) a private thug with no special powers and thus prone to being hit over the head by people who dislike being assualted or

 

b) a state sponsored thug with special powers who has to behave themselves or get hit over the head with a writ.

 

 

 

Hahahaha.

 

I like law.

 

 

Felicity

Edited April 23, 2009 by felicity2009

[JonCris]

felic I can see your going to be a valuable member of the team:D Any chance you can give the full citation or even a link to that case

[felicity2009]

Thanks If you need me and I'm gone (I do that for months) PM me and I'll be notified.

 

I still haven't worked out the link-posting rules so google the thing in bold.. Its a very long judgement. If you go through even one page of it you'll get the gist, but reading it all wouldn't be a bad idea. It was about someone booted out of her care home. She lost, but the reasons she did so are relevant because they go to the very heart of what is or is not a 'public authority' and it seems to me any bailiff granted special statutory powers would be one no matter who is paying them

 

 

Judgments - YL (by her litigation friend the Official Solicitor) (FC) (Appellant) v. Birmingham City Council and others (Respondents)

 

 

Theres a quote from Jack Straw in it.

 

In case the point above is not quite clear, a public authority and its agents have to bear in mind human rights at all times. I think the fuss caused by Peter and others in this forum has helped remind certain individuals of this little fact.

 

Having considered the matter - the fact that even bailiffs didn't want these powers - no-one did - and yet the idea went ahead anyway - and just look at the organisation that went into it - BBC propaganda going out for it just when it was being debated? Its proponent bribed with promotion to Solicitor General? Tabling it for when a prime minister left office?

 

Who the hell has that sort of clout?

 

There are some big guns behind this, make no mistake. I think the Plan was to create an unnaccountable private police force, and what that signifies worries me deeply.

 

And yet again, I'm grateful for the blood sacrifice of previous generations that continues to protect us.

 

It won't protect us forever. Technology will be the next battleground. Even the dumbest policeman knows now that if he murders someone in public, it'll be online before he can spit. We need similar stuff in and around the home. Concealed self-contained high-definintion video cameras with sound. Motion activated.

 

I'm just off to find myself one.

 

 

 

Felicity

Edited April 23, 2009 by felicity2009

[JonCris]

Thanks Felic I remember the case but thinking it wasn't particularly relevant I have just read it for the 1st time - I agree their Lordships make it clear a private agency given statutory powers will be subject to the HRA - wonderful should scare the hell out of them when they become aware of the risks they may be running even now - as even though it's not yet enacted it's now statute so will/does apply

[intellilaw]

Have you tried an online petition? I am slightly confused as to what this petition is about. Is it to stop them changing the law so that bailiffs can force entry or has the law recently been changed and you want it changed back? My head isn't working how it should today!! I have howeever printed a copy of your petition ad once i understand it will get signatures. Where do i send it to? I can scan it and email it if needed.

[intellilaw]

Oh and is this to refuse entry to county court bailiffs or for those employed by debt collectors??

[jonny england]

If this doe's become law I can see one big rebellion happening on a scale that hasn't been seen since the Poll Tax in 1991.As the lord said "An Englishman's home is his castle".If I ever have to defend my home and pocessions from intruders and break the law then so be it.

ahhhh mate dont start me off with english mans home IM WITH YOU ON THAT 1 MY FREIND

[gustavius rex]

I have started a new thread today under Bailiff Enforcement with police a horror story which will show you how the bailiffs operate and GAIN ACCESS. Something got to be done and soon as I am sure all what has and will be done by our courts and judiciary is ensuring the safety and wellfare of the DCA's. Mostly done by the lords as amendments for a fe paying client. We, the people are cash cows and treated with disdain as is proven by recent events. We must take back our rights and stop being treated like lesser persons. I will support and act as requested and required if we can get together and stop what is going on.

[coppullcaveman1]

Somebody has been taking back-handers to get that through, then again politicians are decent upright citizens and public servants so probably not , A political campaign is looking like the only way to make any serious changes, I`ll vote for you !

[gustavius rex]

A political campaign is fine as long as you have somewhere to go. Right now we are a bit short of alternatives as there's absolutely nowhere to go. The labour has taken over from the conservatives and the conservatives have taken over from the liberals and the liberals are Vincent Cable ( with a bit of help from Mr Clegg). So, where do you go? The rest of them are complete lunies or abject rasist ****, why, if you are a relatively normal person, fed up with an antiquated and corrupt system and political parties, you have nowhere to go! lf you sit down and think this expense scandal over a bit, you will find that it is not the expense bit that is such a problem, but, what they claimed for. Duckpond houses, moats, paper clips, non-existant morgages, flat screen tv's and so on. ln other words, complete and utter disregard for ethics and moral values. The fact is, they all consider us stupid and only there as cash machines. Only and only when we as a people are regarded with the respect we are entitled too as their employers will the system change.

Gustavius

[conar686]

A political campaign is fine as long as you have somewhere to go. Right now we are a bit short of alternatives as there's absolutely nowhere to go. The labour has taken over from the conservatives and the conservatives have taken over from the liberals and the liberals are Vincent Cable ( with a bit of help from Mr Clegg). So, where do you go? The rest of them are complete lunies or abject rasist ****, why, if you are a relatively normal person, fed up with an antiquated and corrupt system and political parties, you have nowhere to go! lf you sit down and think this expense scandal over a bit, you will find that it is not the expense bit that is such a problem, but, what they claimed for. Duckpond houses, moats, paper clips, non-existant morgages, flat screen tv's and so on. ln other words, complete and utter disregard for ethics and moral values. The fact is, they all consider us stupid and only there as cash machines. Only and only when we as a people are regarded with the respect we are entitled too as their employers will the system change.

Gustavius

 

Don't sit on the fence Gus

[gustavius rex]

Don't sit on the fence Gus

 

 

l've been accused of a lot and blamed for even more, but, fence sitting is not one of them. l'm simply too old, too tired, too luttered and too dis-illusioned to want to start the fight all over again. Too much has gone wrong and there's too much to do, why, l will gladly hand the battle over to you younger and hopefully more angry guys to fight. But, should it continue like it is going right now, well then l'll be forced out of retirement and take up arms again. Old soldiers do not die, they just fade away (when their job is done that is).

Gus