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    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
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    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 162 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
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Welcome Car query...


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Hi all

 

We bought a car 3 year old from Welcome Car, Birmingham in August last year, having been assured by the salesperson that it had been subject to a multipoint check, was mot'd, safe to drive. blah blah

Anyway, after 8 weeks of driving it, the exhaust fell off, whilst going down a dual carriageway, at night, with my 8 month old daughter in her car seat next to me!!! After getting over the shock and several grey hairs later, it was towed to Kwik fit, who the next day did an inspection of the car....

The result was pretty shocking! The exhaust was completely corroded, the front and rear brake discs were corroded, all the pads were over 75% worn and the clutch which we thought was high, was actually slipping and Kwik Fit said it was unsafe to drive.

We got in touch with Welcome in Birmingham, they told us that it was "wear and tear"!! So, we had another inspection done which found exactly the same things wrong, so we stopped paying as we felt we shouldnt have to pay each month for a car that was unsafe to drive! To cut short a long tale of woe, hair pulling, recorded delivery letters, threats of court action and:-x lots of bad words, only last week did we receive a call from our local (Coventry) branch saying why hadnt we paid!!!

After explaining to them in no uncertain terms that the car was soon to be where the sun doesnt shine, the guy on the end of the phone went away and had a chat with his manager and they decided to fix the car! Everything...and it only took 5 months! :o 5 months where we hardly dared used the car and have had to use public transport!

Now, my husband wants to get rid of the car, he doesnt want repairs done, instead feels that we should be within our rights to just ditch the car back with them after all the aggro and go elsewhere. Does anyone know if we can do that?

Also, we have never had a copy of the so called multi point safety check that was done on the car and they seem to be dodging giving it to use, despite numerous requests. Is that normal?

And lastly, we traded in our pervious car with them for £1000, however, when it came to signing the paperwork, they put down that they had only given us £1 for our car and when I asked why this was, the reply was "oh, its to do with VAT". Whats that all about? My husband is convinced its some kind of fiddle!! Can anyone shed any light on it?

Thanks in advance!

Emma

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Unfortunately after this length of time they are entitled to offer a repair in the first instance. However if I were you I would make it clear that if you get any problems in the future (which are not down to wear and tear, which is not covered) you will be rescinding the contract for a partial refund. You won't get a full refund as you will have to allow for any use that you have had from the car, so it would very much depend on the time you have had it for.

Please note I'm not insured in this capacity, so if you need to, do get official legal advice.

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Don't think the goods were fit for the purpose in this case! Surely this is misrepresentation, possibly fraudulent(re. the point check). Have you consulted Trading Standards? You may be able to rescind the contract and also claim damages, possibly amounting to what you have already paid.

Woolwich won in court/default removed Barclaycard Settled Halifax settled

Capital 1Settled GE Money Settled

Egg Settled-court action re.default 4th hearing!

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sorry ...just to add a correction, you should have really acted as soon as you were aware of the faults and without delay, to take the route I suggested. Still would consult Trading Standards, they can be very helpful, depending on the branch;)

Woolwich won in court/default removed Barclaycard Settled Halifax settled

Capital 1Settled GE Money Settled

Egg Settled-court action re.default 4th hearing!

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In order to make a misrepresentation the trader must first make an obvious representation, which could possibly be a verbal or written statement regarding the condition of the car. It's possible that a multipoint check might suggest this, have a look at the paperwork on that. There would have to be a specific statement regarding the condition of the car.

 

However this might be quite tricky to argue, it might be easier to let them do the repair as they would normally be entitled to do, and to make it clear that if the repair is not satisfactory that you will be looking to rescind the contract.

Please note I'm not insured in this capacity, so if you need to, do get official legal advice.

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I had a car from Welcome Car Finance (Castle Donnington) back at the end of Sept 05, it was less than 2 years old and with approx 11k on the clock. By November 05 it had begun to lose power while driving, not starting and also cutting out while driving - at each time the engine fault light would come on. Upon contacting Welcome they advised me to take the car to the main dealer. They did a full diagnostic check (which i had to pay for!) and found nothing wrong. This continued for another couple of months until i had had enough. I spoke to Welcome Car who said it was not their problem and that i would need to take it up with my local office. Numerous phone calls to them got me nowhere to start of with except to point me back in the direction of Welcome Car. It was not until i contacted my works legal advice team that things started to move forward. Several letters were sent detailing the consumer credit act & others (my apologies for the lack of detail, all copy letters are at work). The end result was that the car spent a week in the garage while myself, and the garage fought Welcome for payment of the repairs. They had to replace the engine management unit & Accelerator pedal, and also found that a broken seal on the gearbox had leaked oil onto the clutch and knacked that up as well. All in all they had to pay out over £1k for repairs. Now, the car is back in the garage as the headgasket has gone! luckily I now have breakdown repair cover with the AA, so the are covering most of the cost for this!

In all, the car has had nearly £2k spent on repairs in 15 months and the car is below average mileage.

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Should also say that i had threaten them with misrepresentation as well, as i was told when signing up that the car would come with a warranty and had paperwork to this effect. Upon asking about this when the problems started i was told that the warranty was for 30 days only. This was never mentioned by the salesperson or on the paperwork

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what make of car is it?

with the mileage and age you state surley it would be under warrenty unless its an import

 

i am meaning the manufacturers 60k /3yr wty

 

It's a Fiat Stilo, and when it went into the garage i asked about any manufacturers warranty, but was told that as the car hadn't been serviced in line with manufacturers guidelines then the warranty was null and void, this was also confirmed when i rang Fiat helpline. It was the previous owner who had not had it serviced at the correct time.

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You won't be able to pursue them for misrepresentation unless they had told you that the warranty would run for longer than 30 days. If they just said "comes with a warranty" - well, it did, so that's not a misrepresentation.

 

Regardless of the warranty though, you will have your statutory rights (which will be either under the Sale of Goods Act if it's a cash sale or credit agreement, or the Supply of Goods (Implied Terms) Act against the finance company if it's HP, which I presume this is?).

 

In short, and either way, the goods must be of satisfactory quality and fit for normal purposes and if they are not, you are entitled to a repair.

 

This still applies to second hand cars, although it will not cover faults which are due to normal wear and tear.

Please note I'm not insured in this capacity, so if you need to, do get official legal advice.

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Hi, my wife got a car from welcome,arranged to have the car picked up by them as it was going back due to discrepencies in the contract it was put in storage for them to collect 10 months later i got a bill for over 900 pounds as they had not collected it i got told nothing they could do as the person that sorted it out no longer worked for them,still got the bill and the car, hope you have better luck getting it sorted than i or anybody else i have spken to about this company

 

BUSTALUGS:-x

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Hi, my wife got a car from welcome,arranged to have the car picked up by them as it was going back due to discrepencies in the contract it was put in storage for them to collect 10 months later i got a bill for over 900 pounds as they had not collected it i got told nothing they could do as the person that sorted it out no longer worked for them,still got the bill and the car, hope you have better luck getting it sorted than i or anybody else i have spken to about this company

 

BUSTALUGS:-x

forgot to add regarding 1000 pounds showing as 1p as far as i know it is a tax dodge as to being legal or not i am not sure as i had the same thing i am going to look into it and try to find out
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Thanks all for comments. Looking forward to hearing back about the 1p thing.

My husband took a day off work to take the car to the garage on Thurs (nearest approved Welcome ones is 25miles away), left the car there all day, called them at 4pm only to be told that Welcome had not actually authorised the repairs after all!!! So the car had been just sat there all day!

:-x Husband was furious, came back and called Welcome to tell them we want the agreement cancelled, our £1000 deposit back and wait to hear from our solicitor, Trading Standards and the FSA re the £1 thing.

Anyway, we had a call from them yesterday asking us to call them. I'm going to call them back later this morning when I get a quite moment.

Anyone have any suggestions as to which way we should actually go with this? Let them repair the car? Or end the agreement and haul them through court for damages, fraud and everything else we can throw at them?

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The court would look to see if you had given them a reasonable opportunity to repair the vehicle first, so make sure you would have evidence to prove that you have done this.

Please note I'm not insured in this capacity, so if you need to, do get official legal advice.

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Hi!

We have recorded delivery letter receipts that show when we first notified them and fax delivery reports and the garage would confirm that the car was in the shop last Thurs and when Welcome didnt authorise the repairs. Would that be sufficient?

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Did they know that the car was in the garage awaiting their authorisation? If you have proof that you agreed this date and arrangement with them, then this could be seen to count as a reasonable opportunity.

 

If this is the case you need to write to them to state that you have given them a reasonable opportunity to carry out a satisfactory repair and they have failed to do so, therefore you now wish to rescind the contract and hand back the car.

 

I assume you are on a HP agreement with them? If so, the law you will need to quote is the Supply of Goods (Implied Terms) Act. I will find the legislation for you shortly.

Please note I'm not insured in this capacity, so if you need to, do get official legal advice.

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From the Supply of Goods (Implied Terms) Act:

 

[10 Implied undertakings as to quality or fitness]

 

 

[(2) Where the creditor bails or hires goods under a hire purchase agreement in the course of a business, there is an implied term that the goods supplied under the agreement are of satisfactory quality.

 

(2A) For the purposes of this Act, goods are of satisfactory quality if they meet the standard that a reasonable person would regard as satisfactory, taking account of any description of the goods, the price (if relevant) and all the other relevant circumstances.

 

(2B) For the purposes of this Act, the quality of goods includes their state and condition and the following (among others) are in appropriate cases aspects of the quality of goods—

(a) fitness for all the purposes for which goods of the kind in question are commonly supplied,

(b) appearance and finish,

© freedom from minor defects,

(d) safety, and

(e) durability.

 

 

  • Confused 1

Please note I'm not insured in this capacity, so if you need to, do get official legal advice.

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Can any one help me i have a dilema. Got a car on finance, i signed the contracts on a friday, picked the car up on the monday after, drove it 15 miles ( if that ) went to work the next day, got a phone call saying i got an oil leak under my car. Got my next door neighbour who is a qualified mechanic to have a look, he told me to take the car back so i did on that day it was back at the garage by 11 o'clock Tuesday, they said they would repair it, the garage phoned me up a week later saying that they have done the work, went back with mechanic friend, he checked it over he said they hadn't changed the fan belts, they hadn't changed the oil filter and plugs, the engine it self was juddering when ticking over, he suggested it goes on a machine to check it out then he asked the man to reverse it back a little bit and in doing that he noticed a 3 inch by 6 inch flap of tire tred in the centre of the driver side wheel, they said they would repair it. So i spoked to the finance company and asked to cancel the agreement because the car wasn't road worthy, they said no. Then i didnt hear from them for 3 months, then thay sent me a letter saying their engineer said it was fit for purpose, so i told them before this that if their engineer said it was fixed i would have the car, but then a week later they phoned me up asking me if i was goin to pay £5000 for the car, i asked them where the car was and they had sold it so i refused to pay, is there any thing i can do?

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