Me and my debts

[tifo]

Hi,

 

I'm making a start on my claims from the banks and card companies, but i have been reading many of the topics on this forum and am confused on a few issues. If anyone can let me know what they think it would be a great help.

 

I have debts being administered by DCA's as well as banks and am making minimal payments on most of them.

 

1. Should i stop my payments as i will send a CCA letter out requesting true copies of original agreements to all the DCA's?

 

2. As my debts keep being passed from one agency to another (over the course of months), can i ask under the Data Protection Act why the banks are doing this without informing me (i read somewhere they have to let me know every time they pass on my details and about me being a Data Subject and them a Data Controller)? In the past i have made large payments (at the beginning a few years ago before i became wise) and then the next week the debt is with someone else and i have had to start chasing my payment to see where it has gone.

 

3. NTL recently passed by debt to Wescott after not hearing anything for over 3 years (it was with another DCA at that time). What can i do about this as Wescott want payment (£220)?

 

Thanks.

[tifo]

Hi,

 

It has been stated by another member that when a debt is sold on to a DCA only the actual debt is sold and not the permission to process your data, which is your personal property. The DCA would then have to ask your permission before they can start using your information.

 

I, like many other people, was under the impression that i had give this permission to the bank to pass on my details as well as the debt (if i defaulted), in the agreement i signed.

 

If this is not the case then what can i (and others) do against DCA's that have my debts and i have been paying for a long time. Some have taken me to court and obtained a CCJ against me, as well as one gaining a charge on my property.

 

Can i use the Data Protection Act to my advantage as i have not given any of them my permission to process my information.

 

Can i then use this to have defaults and the debt removed because :

 

1. they did not have my permission to process any information about me.

 

2. they have not supplied a true signed copy of the agreement after a request under the CCA.

 

3. they have not provided me a default notice at the time they entered one at a CRA.

 

If anyone has advice or a sample letter i can use that would be very helpful.

[lookinforinfo]

I remember seeing that statement. I then scoured the Consumer Credit Act

to find the section that stated when a debt is assigned, the conditions that were included in the contract are passed on to the new creditor.

So your permission is included.

 

The original creditor does not need to ask permission to assign the debt, but

must inform the debtor of the change. And the debtor does have the right to object if he/she has not been given notice or the new creditor does not

have a good reputation in their dealings with debtors. Though to be honest, I have neven heard of anyone objecting, and I have been unable to locate

those rules the last time I looked. However I have seen them in the past.

[PriorityOne]

Hi,

 

It has been stated by another member that when a debt is sold on to a DCA only the actual debt is sold and not the permission to process your data, which is your personal property. The DCA would then have to ask your permission before they can start using your information.

 

 

 

I have also seen this tifo.... it's confusing. Going on what Lookinforinfo has said, you could maybe argue that you did not receive any notification that your data had been passed when the debt was sold. Are you sure that the debt was sold though ? Have you got a copy of the CCA with both yours and their signatures on it, along with all the terms and conditions ? Have you ever received a Deed of Assignment from anyone ? I have yet to read of anyone receiving a Deed of Assignment when they were supposed to... i.e. at the actual point in time when the debt was sold on.

 

Where data protection issues are concerned, folk seem to be in a stronger position when DCAs have either bought the debt and cannot produce the CCA paperwork, or are acting as agents for the original creditors.... because in both instances, they would be processing data unlawfully/illegally.

 

Hope this is making sense... 'coz I still have the 'flu

[tifo]

hi PriorityOne,

 

hope the flu gets better soon.

 

i have done CCA requests to all my DCA's this month, so am waiting. Had a few standard 'we will ask our client' replies, even when i know they have purchased the debt.

 

i have had a few assignment letters at the time it was passed onto the DCA man years ago, not the actual deed (which no-one ever gets).

 

but, the debts have been purchased by one company and are being managed by another (within the same group). No-one has asked my permission to pass on my personal info between them.

[PriorityOne]

hi PriorityOne,

 

hope the flu gets better soon.

 

Thank you...

 

 

the debts have been purchased by one company and are being managed by another (within the same group). No-one has asked my permission to pass on my personal info between them.

 

Are you sure they have been purchased... if the companies are in the same group ?

 

I am having a similar saga... been paying one company for years, but all the nasty letters demanding increased payments, threatening court action, etc. come from another that owns the one I have been paying ! The company I have been paying have defaulted on the CCA request, but I am waiting for the calendar month to go by before I do anything about it.

[PriorityOne]

Think I've got it !!

 

Under The Consumer Credit Act the original creditor does not need permission to pass your data on when the debt is sold... but

 

needs your permission to process your information under The Data Protection Act.

 

[andrew1]

Okay then ... what about this scenario:

 

Credit Card Co - (Creditor) sells your debt to DCA. We'll use Cabot as an example

 

Debt is bought by Kingshill No1 Limited. Kingshill No1 Ltd then have that authority as Lookinforinfo has pointed out to process your data, then a Company called Cabot Financial (Europe)Ltd writes to you telling you Kingshill No1 Ltd have bought the debt, that Cabot Financial (Europe)Ltd are the management company ( actually a seperate Limited Company within the Cabot Financial Group.Ltd - but a sister company to Kingshill No1 Ltd (it gets very complicated with all things cabot) and has a seperate Data Controller registered at Information Commissioners) and that ALL future correspondence and payments must be made to Cabot Financial (Europe)Ltd.

 

Question yourself once you have your head around that: " who gave Kingshill No.1 Ltd permission to pass YOUR data onto another company"?

 

Then ask yourself, If I have been paying a company called Cabot Financial (Europe) Ltd, what rights do they have to take money off me?

 

They don't have a copy of an executed agreement and nor should they because they should NEVER have known about me.

 

We all go about CCAing Cabot Financial (Europe)Ltd, but they shouldn't have our data in the first place. Kingshill N0.1 Ltd own the debt and it is they who should have obtained the proof we owed money when they bought the debt.

 

The same must apply to many of these DCA's.

 

Just write to them and ask for all the money back you've paid them if they can't come up with the CCA request, Look into whether or not one of these companies have registered a default without the necessary proof of debt and claim what it has cost you to get additional finance at the higher rates of interest as a result, then report them to the Information Commissioner for breaches in the Data Protection Act and claim compensation.

 

Once you done that ........

[PriorityOne]

How on earth have you lot managed to trawl your way through this maze of companies ??!

[Guest The Terminator]

How on earth have you lot managed to trawl your way through this maze of companies ??!

 

By reaserching and spending lots of nights up into the early hours and sharing info.And if your The Terminator doing quite a bit of groundwork from the office.But don't tell anyone:D

[PriorityOne]

By reaserching and spending lots of nights up into the early hours and sharing info.And if your The Terminator doing quite a bit of groundwork from the office.But don't tell anyone:D

 

How did we ever cope without this site and you lot ?!

[tifo]

Debt is bought by Kingshill No1 Limited. Kingshill No1 Ltd then have that authority as Lookinforinfo has pointed out to process your data, then a Company called Cabot Financial (Europe)Ltd writes to you telling you Kingshill No1 Ltd have bought the debt, that Cabot Financial (Europe)Ltd are the management company ( actually a seperate Limited Company within the Cabot Financial Group.Ltd - but a sister company to Kingshill No1 Ltd (it gets very complicated with all things cabot) and has a seperate Data Controller registered at Information Commissioners) and that ALL future correspondence and payments must be made to Cabot Financial (Europe)Ltd.

 

Question yourself once you have your head around that: " who gave Kingshill No.1 Ltd permission to pass YOUR data onto another company"?

 

Then ask yourself, If I have been paying a company called Cabot Financial (Europe) Ltd, what rights do they have to take money off me?

 

They don't have a copy of an executed agreement and nor should they because they should NEVER have known about me.

 

We all go about CCAing Cabot Financial (Europe)Ltd, but they shouldn't have our data in the first place. Kingshill N0.1 Ltd own the debt and it is they who should have obtained the proof we owed money when they bought the debt.

 

The same must apply to many of these DCA's.

 

This is exactly how it happens.

 

I happen to have 2 accounts with Cabot Group (Kings Hill No 1 bought them, and then registered a default). But Cabot Financial (Europe) are managing this. Are you saying they cannot as i did not give permission to Kings Hill No 1 to pass on my information? What can i do about this (the Data Protection issue). I have CCA'd Cabot but if they happen to send me the agreement, the fact remains they have processed my info without asking me. And Kings Hill have passed this to them without asking. If they ever do ask me, what am i to say?

 

I have 2 accounts with Lowell Group and 3 accounts with Tessera Portfolio and it is the same case with them.

[andrew1]

This is exactly how it happens.

 

I happen to have 2 accounts with Cabot Group (Kings Hill No 1 bought them, and then registered a default). But Cabot Financial (Europe) are managing this. Are you saying they cannot as i did not give permission to Kings Hill No 1 to pass on my information? What can i do about this (the Data Protection issue). I have CCA'd Cabot but if they happen to send me the agreement, the fact remains they have processed my info without asking me. And Kings Hill have passed this to them without asking. If they ever do ask me, what am i to say?

 

I have 2 accounts with Lowell Group and 3 accounts with Tessera Portfolio and it is the same case with them.

 

tifo, you really must have a read of tberns thread (from the beginning) regarding cabot urgent help please. He/she is taking them to the cleaners over all of this. Kingshill should not pass on your details. Problem with Kingshill is that they have no staff other than the Directors and Co.sec. so they NEVER write to anyone. The way they project themselves publically you'd be mistaken for thinking that Cabot Group is some kind of conglomerate. It has recently been taken over by the Japanese, but it is made up of smaller entities ( some 15 different Limited Companies) which is where tbern and others research has paid off because they are passing the info about like confetti. Take a read and most of your questions will be answered..http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general-debt/36665-cabot-again-urgent-help.html

[tbern123]

tifo, you really must have a read of tberns thread (from the beginning) regarding cabot urgent help please. He/she

 

lol...

 

Hold on let me just check something...

 

*cough*, yep tbern123 is a he...

 

in response to this thread, I call the ICO again today... They are still investigating the diclosure of personal data between Kings Hill and Cabot...

 

They apologised, they have a back log at the moment.... As soon as I hear anything I will post it here

[andrew1]

lol...

 

Hold on let me just check something...

 

*cough*, yep tbern123 is a he...

Sorry tbern, I just love keeping people in suspenders about genders - if only they knew!

 

in response to this thread, I call the Information Commissioners Office again today... They are still investigating the diclosure of personal data between Kings Hill and Cabot...

 

They apologised, they have a back log at the moment....

HA HA - I hear on the grapevine they've offered Bankfodder an office in there !

[tifo]

does anyone know how i work out the difference in the money i am paying on the interest now (7%) and what i could have got had it not been for defaults (4.99%)?

 

that's 2.1% extra per month, so how do i work this out as a figure over 4 years?

 

i need this figure for court when i take action on a few DCA's who have wrongly issued defaults (including Lowell who have issued 4).

 

thanks.

[tbern123]

does anyone know how i work out the difference in the money i am paying on the interest now (7%) and what i could have got had it not been for defaults (4.99%)?

 

that's 2.1% extra per month, so how do i work this out as a figure over 4 years?

 

i need this figure for court when i take action on a few DCA's who have wrongly issued defaults (including Lowell who have issued 4).

 

thanks.

 

I can do this for you when I get in tonight ........

 

is your mortgage interest only, repayment or part and part.

 

also need to know the balance. IS the interest rate, fixed, variable or a tracker.... excuse any mistakes I am doing this on my phone at work

[tbern123]

the simple way is to divide the balance of your mortgage by 100 and times that by the difference in interest.. that will give you the difference for one year. then just times that by 4.

 

I.e £70,000 mortgage / 100 = 700 x 2.1 = 1,470 x 4 = 5,880.

 

however without more info this will not be a true or exact figure

[tbern123]

the simple way is to divide the balance of your mortgage by 100 and times that by the difference in interest.. that will give you the difference for one year. then just times that by 4.

 

I.e £70,000 mortgage / 100 = 700 x 2.1 = 1,470 x 4 = 5,880.

 

however without more info this will not be a true or exact figure

 

sorry thinking about it, it is 2.01 not 2.1 i'll redo it when I get home

[tifo]

hi tbern,

 

thanks for the info ... its appreciated.

 

my mortgage is currently 6.75% with Abbey at £53,000 ish and is interest only at £304 pm (this has gone up by .25 last month but i start paying 7% from next month. I'm always 2 months behind for some reason, when the rate changes, it changes 2 months later for me.)

 

The lowest they've had it (i went in and asked) is 4.99% sometime during the last 3 years or so.

[tbern123]

hi tbern,

 

thanks for the info ... its appreciated.

 

my mortgage is currently 6.75% with Abbey at £53,000 ish and is interest only at £304 pm (this has gone up by .25 last month but i start paying 7% from next month. I'm always 2 months behind for some reason, when the rate changes, it changes 2 months later for me.)

 

The lowest they've had it (i went in and asked) is 4.99% sometime during the last 3 years or so.

 

Your Current Mortgage

 

Balance:£53,000

Interest Rate: 6.75%

Repayment Type: Interest Only

 

£53,000 / 100 = 530

530 x 6.75 = £3,577.50

So over 12 months you £3,577.50

£3,577.50 / 12 = £298.12

Monthly Repaymet = £298.12

 

New Mortgage

Balance: £53,000

Interest Rate: 7%

£53,000 / 100 = 530

530 x 7 = £3,710.00

So over 12 months you will pay £3,710.00 (£132.50) more per year

£3710.00 / 12 = £309.16

New Monthly Payment = £309.16

 

£309.16 - £298.12 = £11.04 extra per month

 

Balance:£53,000

Interest Rate: 4.99%

Repayment Type: Interest Only

 

£53,000 / 100 = 530

530 x 4.99 £2,644.70

So over 12 months you £2,644.70 (extra £1,065.30 per year)

£2,644.70 / 12 = 220.39

Monthly Repaymet = £220.39

 

309.18 - 220.39 = extra £88.79 per month

 

Looking at the information, I guess you are on their standard variable rate. The reason the raise in your interest rate is two months late is because, when the Bank of England increases their rate, banks immediate increase their rates for NEW customers. Rates for exisiting customers, usually rise with in two months. This is partly because they have to give you notice of any changes.

 

Hope that helps...

[tifo]

thanks ... much appreciated for the great help ...

 

will keep you informed on my battle with Cabot / Kings Hill as well as the Lowell Group.

[tbern123]

No probs..

 

 

Good luck with Cabot

[tifo]

thanks tbern,

 

actually, been in today and told the rate has gone up to 7.34%!

 

lady did confirm (again) that it had been as low as 4.99 over the last few years.

 

so that's now a difference of 2.35% which equals £324 at 7.34% and £220 at 4.99% = £104 per month over.