PPI and Statute of Limitations

[reidnet]

I have just sent my LBA to the above address.

 

Lets hope they even respond..... not like in my thread:

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/ppi/62046-martinix-lloyds-tsb-select.html

 

Hi Martin, Have answered on your thread too..

 

 

Just been a bit busy past few days or so.. Planning my next Move on GE Money etc ..lol

[Bicester1]

Hi

 

Keep up the pressure reidnet!

 

Finally got a reply from Lloyds this morning to my prelim. Interestingly they make no attempt to deny mis selling but simply argue that my claim is time barred! We all know how to deal with that one.

 

The other thread in their letter is to try to get me to go to the FSO. I think I will stick to the court route!

 

In reply to the earlier post concerning time limits the relevant thread is:

 

Limitation Act 1980 (-), [email protected], David Swarbrick, Solicitor, Wrigley Claydon

 

With regards to the question as to how I will prove I was told no insurance no loan I guess an affidavit will be needed!

 

Anyway LBA goes off Monday so we shall see!

 

[reidnet]

Good luck M8..

 

Will keep an eye on this one too..

 

Ian

[progenic7]

Hi Bicester1,

 

i have done alot of reading up on the law last couple of days and as far as PPI goes i think the main argument should be based on, Tortious Misrepresentation. This is the law:

 

Claims under the Act

The necessary elements for a claim under the Misrepresentation Act are a false statement of fact, which induced the representee to enter into a contract thereby causing him loss (hereafter referred to as 'tortious misrepresentation'). The representation need not have become a term of the contract. The Misrepresentation Act has, in practice, superseded the old common law concepts of 'mere' and fraudulent misrepresentation. Accordingly, it is the tortious misrepresentation claim which is primarily dealt with in this article.

The difference

There are three main differences between tortious and contractual misrepresentation. First in the method of calculating damages, secondly in the availability of rescission as a remedy and thirdly in the burden of proof. Each is dealt with in turn below.

 

Burden of Proof.

 

In a contractual claim the claimant would need to prove the contract, the term breached, the breach itself, the damage and causation. However, in a claim under the Misrepresentation Act the claimant need only prove that the representation was made and that it was false. The burden then passes, by virtue of s2(1) of the Misrepresentation Act, to the defendant to prove a reasonable belief in the truth of the representation. If the defendant is not able to discharge his evidential burden and make out the defence of reasonable belief, the claimant should succeed in its claim and recover those losses which he can show were caused by the misrepresentation. Therefore, it may be easier to prove a tortious misrepresentation claim than a contractual one. Accordingly, the tortious misrepresentation is pleaded as a safety net to the primary contractual claim.

Ofcourse in a PPI claiming case there is much more than just misrepresentation to bring to the court, however i feel this would probably be the linch pin of the claim because the burden of proof in entirley on them !

[reidnet]

I used the Misrep Act in my claim too, along with the fraud act2006.. Be interesting to see what they come back with.

 

Cant wait to see if GE made comments to the press, they have been in touch with GE over tomorrows story in the Glasgow Herald..

 

And the Scotsman are holding back their story to see the outcome of this one..

 

Ian

[davidp1948]

Hi guys, just found this thread which interests me as I'm pursuing Indirect Line for two cases of PPI miss-selling.

Thats a great template/letter Bicester I'll be using it myself - if I may.

Can you help expand on your comment about time barred "we all know how to deal with that one" Well I don't, so please enlighten me?

 

Also does anybody have any knowledge of the staff at Indirect Line being paid incentives to sell PPI, that would be great ammunition for me?

Thanks davidp

[juanito12]

Hi

 

sorry to hijack, I am having the same trouble with Natwest, just got a letter from RBS chief executive telling me that they are declining my claim, also stating that a certificate of insurance was sent to me which clearly stated that I could have changed my mind about the insurances within 14 days. Then funny thing is that he has also disagreed with the figures I have come up with(Im claiming PPI on 3 loans) however, the breakdown he has given me on 1 of the loans is totally different to the 1 provided to me by Natwest South West Retail Customer Service Centre only 2 weeks prior. To add salt to injury, I got a reply on the 23 Feb to my original SAR from J Tudor, finally admitting that they have no details of my loan agreements as they have been destroyed by my Branch!!! I have very carefully studied all my bank statements have come up with accurate charges and 2 of them match those provided on the breakdown by the Chief Executive, the other 1 which does not still match the 1 provided by Natwest South West Retail so it looks as if they have even given me conflicting info. Cutting the story short I was wondering also if Natwest was being paid incentives to sell PPI in 2003, I am getting ready to put up a very big fight as they are continously in breach of the law, the Fraud Bill section 3 clearly states: failing to disclose information is an offence, if they haven't, how else has the Chief executive manage to get loan agreements which according to my SAR have been destroyed???

 

JJ

Any help would be greatly apreciated

[davidp1948]

Hi JJ. There is a link to THIS IS MONEY on another thread where they talk about NatBest paying commission on their PPI. I've tried cutting and pasting it without success.

So go to the thread started by me on 28th November 2006 titled "Royal Bank of Scotland - PPI and Horendous interset rate". Post #4 by paulwlton has the link and proof you're looking for.

Good luck

DP

[juanito12]

Hi Dp

 

Excellent, just found it, more ammunition, I am getting to love this game. Power to the workers I say.

 

Thank you ever so much

 

JJ

[MARTIN3030]

All PPI threads merged

[needrevenge]

Damn, i'm upset

 

Just about to clear a loan off with Imagine Finance (actual lender is Paragon) after 14 months of the 120 month loan term.

 

It was a joint loan with 10 year term for £35,500 (we were very vunerable at the time). This loan included 5 year cover PPI which cost (including interest) £8701.20 which covered my wife only for Disability, Redundance & Life. We have made no claims on the cover.

 

After reading the loan documents it clearly states that cover was optional and we have signed it. I cannot remember it being optional - I was under the impression one of us needed cover to get the loan (I cannot prove this and the signed loan agreement clearly states 'optional')

 

Have I just thrown £8700 down the pan or is there a slight chance of recovering all / some of this somehow. I would have liked to have though I would have been entitled to a partial refund as have settled loan 14 months into 60 months PPI cover period.

 

Just a note to say, the actual cost for the cover was £6216.05 and the rest was interest over the 120 month period. I note that there is nothing on the signed agreement that states that full premium is due even if cancelled early - does this make any difference

 

Craig

[progenic7]

Hi bicestor

 

i think that under the Misrep act, you can easily argue that due the Misrepresentation ie fraud or concealment were used and therefore you have a good case against any time barred claim from the defence. There is loads of case law on the subject of concealment and misrepresentation so it shouldnt be a hard task to prove. i am also in the same situation with a potential time barred PPI claim and i am currently working on my little "Paper" to back up my arguments.

 

Craig,

 

all is not lost mate, but it depends really on the situation you were in at the time, was this done over the phone (or by any distance selling ?) or was it done face to face ?

if you feel that the insurance was sold under the impression it was a necessity rather than an option then you have a case. How well you argue that is down to you of course.

[Gooders]

Guys,

 

Firstly apologies for the slight hijack!!! I am wondering when we talk about burden of proof if when I took out the loan I was told I would need PPI, the documents were faxed to me with that box already ticked. Would this not prove that Lloyds insisted that I take the PPI to get the loan?

 

I am in the middle of 2 claims for bank charges with Lloyds plus I have since extended the loan and not taken PPI and also battling the Honours Student Loans, so this will be next on my hit list! Not sure if I should rock the boat too much. I think the value of the PPI was £43 p/m and the loan was taken out in Oct 2001.

 

If I do decide to go for it, I will start my own thread (promise) but is there a spreadsheet to calculate interest? or is it a basic 8% ala small claims??

[reidnet]

Hi Gooders,

Firstly PPI should always be optional, with them sending the forms with the box already ticked in my opinion does not make the PPI optional. If you go after a refund on the PPI I would use the Contractual Rate Interest, eg the %APR that the loan was set at.

 

Ian

[Gooders]

reidnet,

 

Thats kind of what I was thinking, think it sounds like a valid reason to claim! Anyway, the claim doesn't have to start right away, as I took the loan out in Oct 01 I take it I can leave it until Oct 07??

 

I did a calculation at 8% that was not compound and the interest took the value up to £3200.

 

If I use the borrowing rate.......not sure what that was now but I presume it MUST be in the agreement!! I am looking at another sizeable claim:)

 

Thanks for your help and if you can suggest a good preadsheet to use I would appreciate the advice........and of course start my own thread!

 

Gooders

[reidnet]

I would tend to strike while the Iron is hot sort to speak, PPI is under Serious Investigation by the FSA at the momment.

 

Ian

[Gooders]

Ian,

 

Thanks for the info. I will make a move on it asap. Not going to risk 3-4K!!!

[Gooders]

Ian & All,

 

just to let you know, LTSB have offered me full refund of £1939ish plus interest and will refund the £1 because they can't find the agreement!!!! please look at

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/lloyds-bank/65486-gooders-ltsb-others.html#post662028

 

for further details.

 

Am I getting what I am owed????

 

Any help greatly appreciated!

 

Gooders

[reidnet]

Well, as they cannot find the original agreement it is hard to tell if you are getting the full amount back. The interest should be calculated at the Agreement contractual rate if possible.

 

Ian

[davidp1948]

Did you request a copy of the executed agreement under the CCA section 77(1)/78(1)?

 

If so and they cannot provide a copy they are in breach of the act and cannot enforce the agreement without a court order. Furthermore they will commit a criminal act if they continue to withold a copy of the agreement.

 

There is a v.long thread dealing with the CCA 1974 and its worth a read if you get a moment ( or a few spare days!!). Here's the link.

 

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/general/33174-consumer-credit-act-agreements.html?highlight=consumer+credit+agreement

 

You can stop paying these guys any money twelve days after the request for a copy of the agreement if they fail to comply with your request as they will be in default of the agreement.

 

Will they go to court to enforce an agreement that they cannot produce?

I don't think so.

Regards

DP

[Gooders]

DP,

 

Unfortunately loan paid off so just chasing what I can claim back and yes the agreement was requested as per CCA advice from here.

 

Gooders

[tink69]

You guys are the best!!

 

I'm about to go into battle with Picture, took out a secured loan with them just over a year ago, have sold our house so got a settlement figure, found out only then that the checky sods had paid a 1 off payment for a PPI to the tune of £6,300, which takes picture's settlement figure over 6 grand more than we anticipated. Wouldn't have minded if we actually needed it but I had seperate life assurance which would have covered it and my husband has 2 life assurances which would have more than covered it, but as usual there was no mention of "do we have sufficient insurance to cover the unthinkable".

 

If you don't mind I will be using template letters I have found relating to PPIs.

 

Thanks again.xxx

[enoughisenough]

How about this for PPI abuse. My wife took out a PPI policy against her loan, and was later made redundant. At the time she was six months pregnant but the redundancy was nothing to do with it. She claimed in the BRanch using the branch telephone and was told her pregnancy invalidated the claim. Thought nothing more of it until recently. Then we went into the branch and were shown a record of the complaint. wrote complaining to LTSB. They've now contacted us saying there's no record even though we've seen it. Now pursuing through the FOS and thinking of contacting the FSA, MP and OFT. That should get their attention!

[enoughisenough]

Disappointed no posts lately. Come on guys. Most of us have been just as shafted by PPI as we have charges. Let's keep this thread going!

[peter534]

I agree, vast amounts of people must be effected by this.

 

I am gearing up to help my sister. She took out a loan in 2003 with Northern Rock, she took the loan out on my behalf, as i was so badly in debt, i couldn't even get a consolidation loan.

 

Once i had given her a few payments, it occured to me that her insurance was useless because even if she lost her job, i would still be making the payments, and if i lost my job she had no grounds to claim anyway because the loan was in her name.

 

She called to cancel the insurance, but was told that she would not be able to. All she could so was take out another loan with no insurance and pay off the old one.

 

Any ideas?