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@radioworld - Dispute about 'damaged' distance selling return


Zamzara
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Ask them if this radio was opened and inspected before sending it to you, if so please fwd the video 

 

The 'free' speaker was damaged in transit to me and arrived in that condition I suggest you take this up with you courier.

 

The complete package was returned to you under my consumer rights which clearly states I can do so up to 14 days from receipt for a full refund.

 

To clarify the matter, I did not mark the radio, I did not damage the speaker.

 

Dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Hi

 

I have to agree.

 

Also ask them my question in post#24

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I advise to the best of my ability, but I am not a qualified professional, benefits lawyer nor Welfare Rights Adviser.

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I asked:

Please could you confirm that on original shipping:
 
Whether you filmed any equivalent video before packing the goods, or
Were these items packaged by the manufacturer but inspected by you?, or
Were these items packaged direct by the manufacturer and uninspected by you?

Reply today:

Tom, it was supposed to be return as new. It hasn’t been but abused. I’m still awaiting your actual answer to returning of the product, or buy back.

 

Post by me are intended as a discussion of the issues involved, as these are of general interest to me and others on the forum. Although it is hoped such discussion will be of use to readers, before exposing yourself to risk of loss you should not rely on any principles discussed without confirming the situation with a qualified person.

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Did some digging and found this photo of the arrival of my previous delivery from RW. (Not an image of this order)

 

 

Didn't take it any further then, as everything was ok isnide. But their courier is bashing things around.

Post by me are intended as a discussion of the issues involved, as these are of general interest to me and others on the forum. Although it is hoped such discussion will be of use to readers, before exposing yourself to risk of loss you should not rely on any principles discussed without confirming the situation with a qualified person.

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Which is why i said to write what i did to them and assert you consumer rights.

 

I did not mark or damage the icom radio, i did not mark or damage the free speaker, that was damaged by your courier and arrived to me in that condition.

 

i do not wish to engage in any 'buy back' scheme which is nothing to do with my consumer rights under our laws.

 

please honour my consumer rights and refund me my money in full.

 

you have 14 days before i escalate this further.

 

DX

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Yup, that's been said. I'll post the whole email exchange to date later.

Post by me are intended as a discussion of the issues involved, as these are of general interest to me and others on the forum. Although it is hoped such discussion will be of use to readers, before exposing yourself to risk of loss you should not rely on any principles discussed without confirming the situation with a qualified person.

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Full list of events and communications to date:
 

Package arrived 21st June in morning.

Opened after work on 21st.

Tested a bit as previously discussed.

 

Really, really careful with the radio and it never went near a hard surface, only a wood coffee table.

The only thing that's arguably 'damaged' was the tips of the power leads, which needed insulation stripping 5mm back, done in a different room nowhere near the radio.

 

Clipped off the 5mm of bare end from the power leads to restore as close as possible.

Boxed everything back up as well as I could, being very careful with the polystyrene around the radio.

 

22 June
Sorry for any inconvenience but I have decided to return order ....... (Icom 7300)

Please can you let me have return instructions.

 

Kind regards

Tom .....

 

What is the reason for return?

With best regards,
Sam Hayward

 

Hello,

 

It is simply a distance selling cancellation/ return. No faults with the item.

 

Many thanks

Tom


 

That’s fine, but following distance selling the item must come back to us brand new, and unused. Anything less would face a restocking fee.

With best regards,
Sam Hayward

 

Posted back Monday 27th special delivery

 

Phone call on Thursday - Sam Hayward,

barely allowed me to speak,

smarmy tone as if he’d caught me out using the radio and was going to set me straight,

 

wouldn’t even entertain possibility that I had not broken the speaker, said once it was used that was it and they would be sending it all back to me, or I could agree to a buyback at £800. Advised I did not accept this and advised him not to send it back. Video mentioned of unboxing, ‘We are really on top of our game with returns’ Said I would get advice and take further action if only refunded that amount.

Dear Sam,

Following your telephone call, I remind you of the requirements of the distance selling regulations*, which are that a full refund must be issued within 14 days less properly applicable deductions can be justified.

It is not at Radioworld's discretion whether to offer a 'buy back'. You are not permitted to return the item to me again under the DSR.

An applicable deduction can only be made if the item's value has been reduced, and this was due to its being used or tested more than might be reasonably permitted in a shop, and this has simply not happened. Inspecting unboxing and turning on the item is permitted. 

I did not use the speaker at all, but I did notice that the foot on it was broken on arrival so this not something I am responsible for and there is no plausible way I could have caused it. I did not consider the speaker further as I considered it an unwanted free gift and it is irrelevant to the decision to return the radio. 

Without prejudice to my right to claim the full purchase price, I will as a gesture of goodwill accept a deduction of £25 to reflect the inconvenience of  processing the return and your outward postage cost. I would have been willing to discuss a credit or exchange for a non-HF radio but following your call this unfortunately seems inappropriate now. Please make a refund of £1280.94 within 14 days.

 Thank you
Tom

[* this was a mistake, should have said Consumer Contracts (etc) Regulations 2013]

 

Tom, I have replied to the statements below. Also, I’m ready to send the video of the unboxing of your radio via WhatsApp. All we need you to do is to download it, and view the video.

An applicable deduction can only be made…. You are correct, the item you sent back has been used and the value Reduced, and the condition is NOT SHOP NEW CONDITION. Opened up, scratches on the front panel, damaged to packaging on polystyrene inserts on the radio, and boxes have been ripped open on the SP38 speaker AND bag around the speaker was back inside the IC7300 with no care whatsoever.

I did not use the speaker at all, but I did notice that the foot on it was broken on arrival… Very hard to believe when it’s missing its packaging and one of the feet are broken.

Without prejudice to my right to claim the full purchase price, I will as a gesture of goodwill accept a deduction of £25…. We will allow 1 of 2 things, to purchase the equipment back from you at £800.00 or, return it to you. This equipment is BEYOND acceptable and wouldn’t bowed well if looked at as you said ‘independently’. 

 

3rd July
Dear RadioWorld Ltd,

 I am writing to notify cancellation of Order number .... under The Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013.

 Although my view is that my previous correspondence already amounted to such a cancellation, for the avoidance of any doubt, this email serves as a statement of cancellation under regulation 32(2) and 32(3) of those regulations.

Yours faithfully
Tom ....

As discussed Tom, in the way we have received this back… you haven’t held your end on the consumer rights regs either. You cannot expected to buy, abuse and then return items without any form of questions asked. I have asked you to send me a WhatsApp message, then you can pass the video onto anyone who you like to challenge the issues here.

With best regards,
Sam Hayward
 

'Unboxing' video received on Whatsapp on Monday 4th July

 

6th July

Tom, what is the situation with this radio. Do you want us to return it to you, or are we buying the radio back?

With best regards,
Sam Hayward

 

Dear Sam,

I informed you of my position on the company's liability to refund in full in my first email. I am withdrawing the option to deduct £25 and require a full refund of the contract price. You still have a further 6 days to make this payment.

Please could you confirm that on original shipping:

Whether you filmed any equivalent video before packing the goods, or
Were these items packaged by the manufacturer but inspected by you?, or
Were these items packaged direct by the manufacturer and uninspected by you?

Could you also please confirm whether the company is a member of any alternative dispute resolution scheme?

(For the avoidance of doubt I did not cause any damage. The speaker arrived to me with a loose piece of plastic in the box. I have not seen any evidence of any damage to the radio.)

Thank you
Tom

[initially drafted some questions about the video but deleted for now]

 

Tom, it was supposed to be return as new. It hasn’t been but abused. I’m still awaiting your actual answer to returning of the product, or buy back.

 With best regards,
Sam Hayward

 

Post by me are intended as a discussion of the issues involved, as these are of general interest to me and others on the forum. Although it is hoped such discussion will be of use to readers, before exposing yourself to risk of loss you should not rely on any principles discussed without confirming the situation with a qualified person.

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Under CRA 2015 (not 2013) They cant charge a restocking fee if you tell a retailer of an online product that you wish to return the product within 14 days of it being in your physical hands. you dont have to have any reason.

 

it doesn't matter that you have used the radio

it doesn't matter that the packaging is slightly damaged re poly blocks and a bag not used,

who said it didnt come like that 

same for the speaker.

 

sadly but being super critical here you have gone in half baked here not confirming your rights etc first.

 

1 hour ago, Zamzara said:

following distance selling the item must come back to us brand new, and unused

WRONG.

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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That's fair. I realised I hadn't been careful enough when I got a belligerent phone call, instead of either a full refund or a polite note proposing £15 or so would be deducted for replacing the power lead. But on the flip side, if I'd argued about it before returning it, they'd still be telling me I can't and probably still be claiming I broke the speaker foot, so I'd be in substantially  the same position.

 

Going back to the main issue I need outside advice on - is it a consensus that my valuation of applicable deductions in the range £0 - £15 is closer than theirs of £500?

Post by me are intended as a discussion of the issues involved, as these are of general interest to me and others on the forum. Although it is hoped such discussion will be of use to readers, before exposing yourself to risk of loss you should not rely on any principles discussed without confirming the situation with a qualified person.

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Should be no deductions.

You did not cause either 'damage'.

 

Have you asked you bank about doing a chargeback?

 

Dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, dx100uk said:

Under CRA 2015 (not 2013) They cant charge a restocking fee if you tell a retailer of an online product that you wish to return the product within 14 days of it being in your physical hands. you dont have to have any reason...

 

 

Serious question:  what provision of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 says anything about what a consumer is or is not entitled to if they elect to cancel an online or distance sale?  The right to cancel an online or distance sale is contained in The Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013, isn't it, and not the CRA 2015?

 

And more specifically, isn't it s34(8) of the Consumer Contracts etc Regulations 2013 that prevents the retailer charging a restocking fee for a distance sale cancellation?   The Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013 (legislation.gov.uk)

 

 

14 hours ago, dx100uk said:

 

... sadly but being super critical here you have gone in half baked here not confirming your rights etc first...

 

 

 

Agreed.  But isn't that why it's important for the OP to be confident that they can refer to the correct legislation that gives them those rights?

 

 

 

Edited by Manxman in exile
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I always get those mixed up 

The op should not be put in this situation by this retailer at all 

 

Dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Chargeback - yes, I will apply once the 14 days are up.

Post by me are intended as a discussion of the issues involved, as these are of general interest to me and others on the forum. Although it is hoped such discussion will be of use to readers, before exposing yourself to risk of loss you should not rely on any principles discussed without confirming the situation with a qualified person.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Progress update. Chargeback was applied for on day 15. I referred the bank to the events as described here, the communications transcript, and the video.
 

Response today from bank:

 

We have an update on your dispute with WWW.RADIOWO . Your unique reference number for this case is xxxxxxx.

Update on your payment refund

We just wanted to let you know that we're temporarily refunding the payment(s) that was made to WWW.RADIOWO for the amount of £1305.94 while we investigate further. This will show as a refund on your next statement.

What happens next

WWW.RADIOWO may give more details about the disputed payment(s). This could lead to the temporary refund(s) paid to your account being reversed. We may need to contact you again at a later date should we require any further information.

If you do not hear from us by 03 October 2022, the refund will remain in your account.

Post by me are intended as a discussion of the issues involved, as these are of general interest to me and others on the forum. Although it is hoped such discussion will be of use to readers, before exposing yourself to risk of loss you should not rely on any principles discussed without confirming the situation with a qualified person.

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