Wise Parking 2xPCN's - car left in visitors carpark for 4days - Lewisham Hospital, London ***Cancelled by Hospital***

[lied]

Hi all, looking for some advice.

I turned up at A&E and had to get admitted, and subsequently ferried by ambulance to another hospital.

I followed the signs to the visitors car park but it turns out the area also had allocated parking, it was dark and I wasn't particularly in a state to pay attention to the red lines.

 

Long story short - the vehicle remained parked for several days. I received two PCN's issued three days apart. I appealed both via paymypcn.info and received a rejection email response back to both. I cannot appeal to the regulator theias.org the company suggested I further appeal to, because they cannot find the PCN's in their database.

 

I am not sure what my options are. I feel at least one of the two PCN's should be cancelled. Any advice would be appreciated.

 

Thanks, LiEd

[dx100uk]

please complete this twice:

 

and scan up everything in/out to date bothsides inc appeal etc to ONE MASS PDF ONLY.

read our upload guide carefully

 

next time do not ever appeal

 

dx

 

[FTMDave]

The IAS aren't a regulator, they are a corrupt kangaroo court.  For goodness sake don't appeal to them!  All that would do would be to out the driver and throw away legal protections.

 

Please let us have the info dx asked for in the sticky x 2.

[lied]

Thank you dx100uk and FTMDave.

 

I did appeal, they do have my email address. I now know better.

 

I physically was unable to move the vehicle and it remained parked at the same location between 15 March and 19 March.

 

Please see below two entries for one PCN each. Note - there was nothing on the windscreen except two stickers that said 'do not park here again'. The PCNs arrived by post. Both PCNs and appeal responses in the PDF titled 2_pcns_single_parking_user_liedin.pdf

 

Many thanks

=========================================================

PCN #1

1 The date of infringement? 16/03/2022

2 Have you yet appealed to the parking company yet? [Y/N?] Yes

 

Has there been a response? Appeal rejected. See attached PDF

 

Have you received a Notice To Keeper? (NTK) [must be received by you between 29-56 days] No. But it seems they are using the PCN as NTK too?

What date is on it? NA

Did the NTK provide photographic evidence? NA. However, when I go to appealmypcn and enter the PCN I can see additional images

3 Did the NTK mention Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA) [Y/N?] NA

4 If you appealed after receiving the NTK,

did the parking company give you any information regarding the further appeals process?

[it is well known that parking companies will reject any appeal whatever the circumstances] I sent one appeal. it was rejected with a standard response. No right of further appeals given.
 

5 Who is the parking company? Wise Parking
 

6. Where exactly [Carpark name and town] did you park? Lewisham Hospital, London. Visitors car park. You have to enter through a barrier which issues a card with entry time.

==============================================

PCN #2

1 The date of infringement? 18/03/2022

2 Have you yet appealed to the parking company yet? [Y/N?] Yes

 

Has there been a response? Appeal rejected. See attached PDF

 

Have you received a Notice To Keeper? (NTK) [must be received by you between 29-56 days] No

What date is on it? NA

Did the NTK provide photographic evidence? NA. However, when I go to appealmypcn and enter the PCN I can see additional images

3 Did the NTK mention Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (PoFA) [Y/N?] NA

4 If you appealed after receiving the NTK,

did the parking company give you any information regarding the further appeals process?

[it is well known that parking companies will reject any appeal whatever the circumstances] I sent one appeal. it was rejected with a standard response. No right of further appeals given.
 

5 Who is the parking company? Wise Parking
 

6. Where exactly [Carpark name and town] did you park? Lewisham Hospital, London. Visitors car park. You have to enter through a barrier which issues a card with entry time.

 

2_pcns_single_parking_user_liedin2.pdf

[FTMDave]

So if I've understood correctly you accidentally parked in the staff car park and then couldn't physically move the car because you were admitted to hospital.  Is that right?

 

In your first appeal did you indicate that you were the driver?

 

What evidence do you have that you have been refused the opportunity to appeal to the IAS?

[lied]

 

40 minutes ago, FTMDave said:

So if I've understood correctly you accidentally parked in the staff car park and then couldn't physically move the car because you were admitted to hospital.  Is that right?

That is correct. I have the medical paperwork to prove this

 

40 minutes ago, FTMDave said:

In your first appeal did you indicate that you were the driver?

Yes. On appealmypcn.info the online form has a drop down and one of the options is whether I am the driver

 

42 minutes ago, FTMDave said:

What evidence do you have that you have been refused the opportunity to appeal to the IAS?

I can appeal to the IAS. However, when I enter the PCN on theias.org website I get a message saying Your PCN or Registration Number has not been recognised. Please try again. So I cannot appeal to the IAS online but an appeal by post may be an option. However, I note your advice in your earlier post regarding this.

Thank you.

[lookinforinfo]

Lied, on both PCNs was it you that put n/a on the Observation time boxes. If so could you please post them up to see if the PCNs are valid.

 

It's a shame that you identified yourself as the driver  since if the PCNs are not valid they would not be able to pursue you as the keeper and they cannot assume you were the driver. Hopefully it will not be fatal in your case but if there is a next time and you feel like appealing please do so as the keeper never the driver.. And for safety's sake rarely as the keeper as you can still reveal yourself to be the driver thus losing some of the protection provided by the Act.

 

Just about the only way you win an appeal with IAS is to put a gun to the adjudicators head and make him an offer he can't refuse so save yourself a stamp. 

[FTMDave]

There is no-one on CAG who hasn't made mistakes in legal disputes.  That's inevitable when you come up against something for the first time.  The important thing is to learn from the mistakes for the future.

 

We don't have any other threads for Wise Parking, they seem new and anything but, er, wise.  To use the Protection of Freedoms Act to establish keeper liability they were supposed to leave windscreen tickets and then send you the PCNs 29-56 days later.  They did none of this.  But you outed yourself as the driver anyway.

 

We say never to appeal because there is this danger of throwing away this legal protection and in any case the fleecers never ever accept appeals, as you've seen.

 

I would suggest -

 

1.  Get on to PALS at the hospital and complain and explain what happened.  You were in an emergency situation.  Demand they get the PCNs withdrawn.  I think the contact details are here  https://www.lewishamandgreenwich.nhs.uk/lewisham-hospital-contacts/

 

2.  Without waiting, as PALS can be useless, get a separate complaint off to the CEO  https://www.lewishamandgreenwich.nhs.uk/download.cfm?ver=5756

 

3.  Don't appeal to the IAS who are the worst bunch of corrupt spivs possible, but do keep screenshots of their site refusing to accept your appeal.  If this case goes on & on you can use the fact you were denied use of the appeal process to your advantage.

 

In any case there has always been a legal term, I think Frustration of Contract, to cover the impossibility of carrying out the contract - you were in hospital!  The new government code of practise (law since 2019, good detective work by forum regular Lookinforinfo) also covers emergency situations.

[lied]

Just wanted to provide a quick update - sorry should have responded sooner but I wanted to wait for an update based on your advice.

 

On 29/03/2022 at 13:29, FTMDave said:

I would suggest -

 

1.  Get on to PALS at the hospital and complain and explain what happened.  You were in an emergency situation.  Demand they get the PCNs withdrawn.  I think the contact details are here  https://www.lewishamandgreenwich.nhs.uk/lewisham-hospital-contacts/

 

2.  Without waiting, as PALS can be useless, get a separate complaint off to the CEO  https://www.lewishamandgreenwich.nhs.uk/download.cfm?ver=5756

I followed both #1 and #2 above. It worked!!

PALS responded within 24 hours and included their on-site security team.

After validation of my case by the security team, yesterday they Wise Parking to rescind the PCNs. I received a follow up email from the security team and PALS confirming I no longer to pay.
I did not receive a reply from the CEOs mailbox.

 

If it weren't for the advice on here I would be out of pocket right now. I also learnt a few valuable lessons for which I am very grateful! Thank you.

 

I am guessing I need to take no further action and keep the emails safe from the hospital in case Wise decide they want to be difficult?

[dx100uk]

Correct

Well done you won!!

 

Please consider a donation

We are free 

our advice is free.

Our time is free.

But our webhosting etc is not.

 

Dx

 

 

 

[FTMDave]

Well done on your victory! 

[honeybee13]

Excellent news, thank you for letting us know.

 

HB

 

 

[brassnecked]

great stuff common sense ruled.

[lied]

On 01/04/2022 at 10:38, dx100uk said:

Please consider a donation

A small token of appreciation sent. Thank you again

[dx100uk]