Care parking PCN - Driver walked off site - Appeal Failed - Chalon Way Multi Storey Chalon Way West, St Helens WA10 1BF

[brassnecked]

That term is automatically unfair, what if was an emergency had to use a public toilet and none on site  it does amount to trying to ban Reverse Trespass, there is also the way its policed, if attendant taking pictures, there are GDPR implications same if CCTV as it amounts to personal surveillance of individuals, also  ANPR cannot be used  for anything but Number Plates

[lookinforinfo]

The classic case is VCS v Ibbbotson in Scunthorpe 

http://nebula.wsimg.com/e3da92cb966c72de63ec1f98605c2954?AccessKeyId=4CB8F2392A09CF228A46&disposition=0&alloworigin=1

 

where leaving one's car on site while leaving the site oneself was judged that it was a case of trespass and only the land owner can sue for trespass.

[brassnecked]

With that looks like the PPC is stuffed the situation looks like its essentially same as Ibbottson.

[Motobrooks]

Trespass !!!! That’s interesting and thank you.Originally you are invited onto the land but that ends once you have used the clients business and becomes trespass if you leave the site, even if you have purchased and your car is not causing an obstruction. 

[brassnecked]

ASnd the Ibbotson case explains why that is a no no for a PPC to invoice on read the judgment in Ibbotson  linked by Lookedinforinfo at Post#31 especially what the judge said about WHO could sue, and its not the PPC and the losses in Trespass are not losses to the PPC so PPC has no Locus to ground any claim. It  looks to almost mirror Ibbottson.

[Motobrooks]

Yes.I have read the case,also the judge was most explicit on Genius pre-estimate of costs that business expenses cannot be applied 

[dx100uk]

On 20/03/2022 at 12:21, lookinforinfo said:

If you could please complete this we will be able to give you further help-

 

please fillout the above.

 

dx

 

[Motobrooks]

Called into the Range today and spoke to the manager.

He informed me that care parking is no longer managing the site owing to the amount of customer complaints.

He gave me his email address and said cc me in to another appeal so he could add his comments, mainly genuine customer, also that we used the cafe that day.

 

Do you think another appeal is worth doing.

 

He also said there is no evidence of anyone leaving the site as they could not use such photos as evidence without consequences.

[dx100uk]

yes

[Motobrooks]

Thanks.I was considering ending my second appeal with a paragraph drawing their attention to the case of VCS v Ibbotson and the findings of The district judge.

Therefore,refer this matter back to the Landowner and cease any further correspondence.Failure to do so will result in a complaint to the credit services association.I trust I have made myself clear.

would you consider this the right response!!!!!

[brassnecked]

Do that appeal definitely cc the Range manager in so he can comment, and  depending on what the other's say, put in an oblique reference that their premise and reason for invoicing is extremely simmilar yo VCS v Ibboyyttson, and it shows that Reverse Trespass as they contend is not in their remit as they have no Locus on Trespass.   I would wait for furtyher comments first as there maight be other alternatived to Ibbottson.

[Motobrooks]

Thanks, I will make reference to the Ibbotson case to set them thinking and leave out my threat at this moment in time !!!!!

[brassnecked]

Never threaten rebut with other evidence and what they omit to say.

[Motobrooks]

Hi

,reply from care parking, they don’t do multiple appeals, see last paragraph.Which is pay up, risk court action etc, also POPLA reference for appeal.

 

the comments from the manager explained the cafe situation.

I took the goods to the car whilst my wife ordered two coffees.

The terminal was faulty and they were only accepting cash payment.

 

I left the site to get cash but “the driver” was on site all the time.

The manager verified the fault and asked for them to review this again as it was the stores fault and not the customers.

 

I also made reference to the similarities of the VCS v Ibbotson case. I’m still in time for an appeal to POPLA , have never used them before, are you bound their decision?,

 

advice please.

[dx100uk]

Await the range reply

[Motobrooks]

 

 

I will forward their reply to the manager as they haven’t cc him in

[Motobrooks]

 

 

Hi,reply from care parking,

they don’t do multiple appeals, see last paragraph.

Which is pay up, risk court action etc, also POPLA reference for appeal.

 

the comments from the manager explained the cafe situation. 

I took the goods to the car whilst my wife ordered two coffees.

 

The terminal was faulty and they were only accepting cash payment.

I left the site to get cash but “the driver” was on site all the time.

 

The manager verified the fault and asked for them to review this again as it was the stores fault and not the customer s

.I also made reference to the similarities of the VCS v Ibbotson case

 

.I’m still in time for an appeal to POPLA , have never used them before, are you bound their decision?,

 

advice please.

Failed appealedit.pdf

[dx100uk]

no

[dx100uk]

reg number on 1st page of letter

and please put the pages in order!

 

dx

 

[Motobrooks]

Sorry, ain’t my strong point altering files.

[brassnecked]

 I have edited the pdf in Post #45 to remove VRM.

[Motobrooks]

Thank you, hopefully I’ll get the hang of it.

can I ask , as I never received “the first” letter were I would have had the chance to pay the reduced charge of £60.Have they not followed the code of practice?

[brassnecked]

Irrespective of that the Reverse Trespass and Ibbottson, might make a Judge to automatically void it as an unfair contract term, for reasons in Ibbottson and other real world issues like a legitimate reason to go off like draw cash etc, go to a toilet off site.

 

Sure Lookedinforinfo and FTMDave might add something.

[FTMDave]

To me the fleecers are doing what they always do, insisting they are always right and refusing every appeal they ever get.

 

This is even with the store manager backing up the OP.

 

They are just trying it on.  Personally I'd just ignore them & their threats unless you get a Letter of Claim.

[dx100uk]

yep

 

dx