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Plumber Issued Small Claims Against us.


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Hi

 

We recently had a bathroom refit, which included some tiling, along with a few other plumbing jobs around the house.  

The plumber organised the tiler.  

 

Unfortunately there are various issues with the job.  

The tiling was finished to a poor standard, both aesthetically and practically, and we believe it needs to be redone.  

There were some plumbing mistakes too.  

And a few of the smaller jobs were not completed.  

 

We’ve been going back and forth with the plumber since the new year but haven’t managed to reach a resolution.  

We don’t know where to go from here.  

I wondered if anyone would be happy to give some advice please?

 

Following my posts on Tuesday night (sorry about those!), here’s an overview of events.  

 

In October the plumber provided estimates / quotes (we’ve since noticed that he has used the terms interchangeably).  

He listed the jobs to be completed in two separate emails,

one covering the bathroom refit,

and the other covering the rest of the work.  

 

At the bottom of the bathroom refit email (not the other) it states:
“Price may vary if any unforeseen circumstances arise”.  


In both of the emails he attached what he called a quotation.


The attached documents were headed "Estimate".  

He did not list the work to be completed.  

Rather he just gave the prices, split into labour (£2560) and materials (£544).  

Those are the combined prices.  

 

At the bottom of each it states: 
“Quote valid for 28 days from sent date”
“All materials remain the property of **** until final payment is made in full” 
“Payment due on completion of the work”.
 

 

There were quite a few jobs and details we had discussed in his visit that were not covered in his initial quote emails.  I listed these in a subsequent email and we clarified together everything that was included in the quotes.  

 

When asked, he gave a timescale for completion of a week and a half to two weeks.  (Incidentally, he also later said his day rate is £240, which then doesn’t add up to the labour charge).  There was no other documentation. 

 

The plumber started the job on the 22/11/21.

Mid way through the job (01/12/21), the tiler tested positive for covid so there was a delay for 10 days.  

 

The tiler came back on the 13/12/21 and finished the next day.

 The plumber came back briefly on 20/12/21 to "commission the bathroom", but left without really doing much.  

We did not hear anything again until 06/01/22, when he texted saying he’d be back in touch to arrange to finish the final jobs. 

 

Over Christmas/New Year we'd started getting feedback about the quality of the job and started to become concerned.

 

10/01/22.  We emailed the plumber highlighting and listing our concerns with the job.  As the job had been going on for so long and we had started to have suspicions that he hadn't been straight with us, we were keen to try to settle the bill and get somebody else to complete the work.  We asked for an invoice, in the first instance with deductions for work he hadn't completed.  The idea was to use that invoice as a starting point, and to then negotiate a deduction for the work we felt had not been completed to standard.    


15/01/22.  Plumber sent an email with an attached invoice wrongly dated 24/10/21.  On the invoice, he hadn’t taken anything off for the uncompleted work.  He claimed he was offsetting this against additional work he had done on the job, that was not quoted for.  However, we feel some of these were fabricated.   


17/01/22.  We emailed him disputing the additional charges he had added to the invoice and re-iterated and elaborated on our concerns.  We requested a price reduction of £1,100 for all the tiling work, uncompleted plumbing and plumbing work that needed correcting.  Please note, this figure included an agreed reduction of £180 to fix a chip the tiler had caused to the bath.  

 

He declined the £1,100 price reduction and asked for his right of repair.  Several times we asked for arbitration/mediation etc but he refused to discuss it.  By this point we had seen he was happy to lie about certain aspects of the job, to suit his position.  

 

Various emails followed discussing concerns about the job.  The feedback we were getting on the job was that the tiler hadn’t even followed the basics and the work looked like it had been done by a handyman, wouldn’t be watertight, would not last and needed to be re-done completely.  The plumber would not accept the majority of this (especially with regards the tiling).  We offered to get somebody to come and assess the work properly, but the plumber kept insisting on his right of repair.  We also started contacting manufacturers where we thought materials had been used inappropriately, or to confirm certain mistakes.     

 

31/01/22.  The plumber came back to complete some of the unfinished work (not the tiling**) and repair a couple of leaks from his install.  Verbally and in writing we made it clear to the plumber that we did not want the tiler doing any further work in our property as we felt he did not have the necessary skill to complete the work to a satisfactory standard.  

 

The plumber also admitted at this point that the tiler wasn't a professional tiler but was actually a friend and more of a "handyman".  Whilst on-site, the plumber tried to charge extra labour and materials for completing the outstanding work.  We refused to pay extra saying that the work in question was part of the original quote.  He then refused to do the work.  


We offered the plumber part payment for the work he had completed well.  

He did not want any payment and said to wait until the issues had been resolved. 

 

**Up to this point, the plumber had offered to come back and do the repairs to the tiling several times, but we had refused because: 

a) He wanted the original tiler to complete the repairs to the tiling, 
b) The fixes he was proposing failed to take on board our concerns and seemed to be bodges and we felt were very likely to leave us in a worse position, and 
c) We wanted a prior agreement in writing about what work he was actually going to do when in the property, as we no longer trusted him as he had lied several times about various things.

 

09/02/22.  The plumber again offered to come and complete the work, but this time he outlined - in writing - the repairs he would make.  He also used the word "I" throughout the email, which we took to mean he himself would be doing the work.  On this email he also sent a new, amended invoice which he now dated 12/01/22.  He still hadn’t made any deductions but was now arguing that the additional charges were due to different jobs than the ones he cited on the email of 15/01/22.

 

We arranged a date for the visit.  

We still had concerns that this would not fully address all of the issues with the tiling, but it was a better proposed fix than previous, and an acknowledgement that there was an issue (which in the past he had denied at times).  

 

He stipulated the condition that we pay him the full invoice before he leaves the property.  

We declined and said we would have the work assessed by an independent party afterwards, before making any payment.  

 

Due to us still having concerns that the repairs he was proposing would not bring the work up to standard, we also offered the alternative option of a price reduction of £500 for the tiling only.  We were willing to accept a lower price reduction in the interests of getting the matter resolved. 

 

The plumber insisted on his right of repair or said he would accept a price reduction of £100 for all matters (as he claimed this is what it would cost him to put all matter right).  We refused this offer.  

 

23/02/22.  The plumber arrived with the same tiler.  

We refused entry to the tiler, but discussed the job and proposed fixes with them both on the doorstep.  

 

The plumber changed his previously agreed proposal for the repairs to the tiling from what he said he would do in the email of 09/02/22.

 

 What he now described was a very poor bodge job only partially addressing some of the tiling issues.  We said we were not happy with this.  We also discussed our main concerns with the tiling job and we asked the plumber if he would accept any other persons' or organisations' opinion on the job or subsequent repairs to it.  He said he would only accept that of a judge.  We completely lost faith in him at this stage and because of this refused entry. 

 

After the visit the plumber emailed an account of the visit.  We emailed back with our amendments and additions of his account of the visit.  On this email he also said - for the first time - that he would like to accept our offer of a payment for the elements of the work we feel were completed well (the offer we made on the visit of 31/01/22).  He sent a further email clarifying that he would still be invoicing us for the full final cost.

 

28/02/22.  The plumber sent an email in which he now changed his account of what he had proposed during the visit regarding the repairs, saying that he did indeed offer us the previously. agreed fix.  We know he didn't, and believe we can demonstrate that he didn't.  He attached a new/further amended invoice and dated it 12/01/22.  

 

He added a late fee of 5% on the total cost, which amounted to £147.88.  He also charged for both his and the tiler's time ("loss of earnings") and travel costs for the visit on the 23/02/22 (totalling £264.48).  We would challenge both of these and can give details as to why if needed.  This all brought the total to £3369.86.  He said: “Please respond or pay the final invoice within 14 days. Otherwise I’ll have no choice but to look toward court proceedings to reclaim the money owed”.

 

12/03/22.  The plumber sent a further invoice with another 5% added, equating to an additional £168.49 and bringing the total to £3538.35.

 

14/03/22.  We emailed the plumber asking for more time to respond as we were seeking legal advice.  The plumber responded saying he would give us until Monday

 

21/03/22 to make payment or respond, before he takes things further. 

 

After the plumber’s visit of the 23/02/22 we explored the option of legal advice through our home insurance.   

 

The insurance company ran several financial checks on the plumber. 

He didn’t have traceable assets and they could not confirm he would have the finances to pay any costs awarded (should we have paid him under protest and made the claim ourselves).  As such they could not take on the case as our legal cover only covers the cost of making claims, not defending them.

 

Unfortunately more issues have now come to light about the tiling regarding the waterproofing underneath not being done correctly.  These issues also highlight the need for the tiling to be redone.  We haven’t raised this point with the plumber yet. 

 

A side note...  All of his invoices state at the bottom:  
"Payment is due on date of invoice."
"Failure to pay within 28 days of invoice date will incur a 5% surcharge payment per month."
"All materials remain property of *** until full payment is made."

The 5% surcharge had not been mentioned anywhere prior to the invoices.

 

Another side note, not sure if it is relevant.  

He initially said the jobs would take one and a half to two weeks.  

His labour charge was £2560.  

We later found out his day rate is £240.  

Total amount of days spent on the job was around 6.5, not including the visits of 31/01/22 (where he didn't complete any work aside from fixing a leak caused by his install) and 23/02/2022 (where we refused entry).  

 

We anticipate the cost of re-tiling the bathroom to be in the region of £1,500 with materials.  We're in the process of getting quotes.  The cost of the repairs to the plumbing we're still looking into, but expect it to be a few hundred pounds. 


Sorry if I have given too much, not enough, or the wrong information.  Happy to answer any questions and provide further details as needed.  

 

Thanks a million in advance for any help.

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It's very long post and I haven't read all of it – but the first thing to say is that it is in the nature of any kind of building job that timescales are approximate and even quoted prices can change depending on what is suddenly discovered when tiling or floors et cetera are lifted up and the underneath is exposed.

You say that the work is defective – in your opinion.

 

You haven't paid the plumber anything so far.

 

He is threatening to bring a legal action.

One thing you can be certain of is that you won't need a solicitor here and it certainly wouldn't be worth your while. If you bought an action it would be under the small claims rules and that means that even if he wins, he would only be able to recover his court fee and very little else.


I think the first thing you are going to have to do is to get an independent assessment. This means that you will have to get somebody round who has a level of expertise and who can look at what was originally agreed and then look at the work which has been carried out in pursuit of that agreement and give you an opinion as to whether or not the contract has been satisfied in terms of the work which has been carried out.


Secondly that person should give an opinion as to the quality of the work and identify defects – and maybe even come up with approximate value of addressing those defects – but certainly explaining how those defects would be addressed – whether is simply a question of making good or undoing the work completely and redoing it.

Unfortunately you may incur a fee for an inspection and a written report – but if it turns out that you are right then I would say that the fee would be recoverable.

I think you should identify somebody who can come along and perform an independent inspection. Get a quote for the cost of their inspection and then write to your builder and let him know that this is what you are proposing to do and that the cost will be £XX and you are giving him an opportunity to comment or to object. Let him know that once you receive the report that you will disclose a copy to him.


After about seven days you should then proceed with the inspection.

 

You should also invite him to have the work inspected by his own independent assessor. You could tell him that this would be a necessary step anyway if he decides to bring a legal action. Make it clear to him that you would allow his own inspector onto your property – without him – on condition that you will be provided with a copy of his report.

I haven't managed to understand the entire story because it's so long – but that is my initial view


 

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Also I see that you say that there is a discrepancy between his day rate and his actual labour charge.

You are bound by whatever you agree to pay. If you agree to pay £2500 then even though his day rate may be only £250 per day and he only worked a few days, you are bound by the £2500.

I'm afraid that you aren't in a position to agree £2500 and then later on tell him that you have discovered that his normal day rate is less than that and so that is what you want to pay

 

You also seem to say that there should be some distinction between "estimate" and "quotation".

I'm afraid I don't think it is at all important in this case

 

Also his late fees are unenforceable – although if you have caused him some financial loss by not paying him then you might be liable for that but he would have to account for that.

Of course this is assuming that you have breached the contract but if he has not carried out the work to suitable standard then it is he who has breached the contract

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Many thanks for your response.  

 

Apologies for the length.  It’s hard to strike the balance between too much and too little information.  I read a few other recent similar threads to try and get an idea of what was needed, but presumably got carried away.

 

- Re Timescales being approximate. We accepted that the work would be completed later due to Covid.  We could also understand if work overran as it was taking longer than anticipated.  In our case, it was just that the plumber wasn't in a rush to come back to finish off.  Happy to accept if it's not relevant though.

 

- Independent assessment.  Totally understand the importance but we live in a rural area and have been finding it hard to get someone. Although happy to quote, they've not wanted to get involved in any court dispute as they've said it's not worth their hassle or time.  The Tile Association offer a service, but they charge £895+VAT and expenses.  It seems hard to justify this level of cost given the overall cost of the job.  Would the court accept such high costs? And that wouldn’t deal with the plumbing issues.  We’ll keep looking.  Does it have to be an actual house visit?  Are there any circumstances when an online assessment via photos/videos would be enough?

 

To date we've had feedback on photos we've posted on an online pro-tilers forum.  It is their opinion about the work that has made us concerned. Would such feedback count in court?  We've also had manufacturers confirm that some of the materials aren't fit for purpose nor used appropriately.  Would that be taken into consideration?  Or would we still need more?

 

- Noted RE inviting him to have the work inspected by his own assessor.  Thanks for the suggestion.  Our concern there would be how “independent” his assessor would be?  He has demonstrated several times he is happy to lie.  

 

Should we offer (or just make without asking) a part payment towards the work we are happy with?  It's difficult to know exactly how much the repairs will cost at this stage, although we'd expect them to be in a region of £1,500. But if we have to pay for a report as well that's going to be additional costs... 


Thanks again

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I don't think an online assessment would be sufficient.
 

Are you able to set out a brief bullet pointed list of the defects that you have noticed so far.

I quite agree that the 900 quid or so for an inspection of the tiles is excessive.

If you have got written opinions from manufacturers in respect of the materials that were used, these would be very important. But also I think you need an independent inspection.

Tell us about these statements that you have received from the manufacturers. Are they in writing? What are they based on? Have they seen photos?

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Main issues with tiling:

- Some sloppy cuts on the tiles

 

- Tiles are wonky and are not square or plumb

 

- The job wasn't assessed or prepared properly beforehand, so they've used a bath trim to attempt to deal with walls being out of square. Tile trims are renown for being a poor solution.  All the pro tilers have said they should have discussed alternative options with us prior. 

 

- They've used a bath trim that wasn't designed for the purpose (confirmed by manufacturer in writing after seeing photo). 

 

- The tiling on the window sill isn't arranged properly so water will pool at the back (from shower over bath) instead of draining off. 

 

- They've used grout in the corners/around windows (movement joints).  This should have been siliconed to allow for structural movement  as grout is not flexible and will crack (confirmed by manufacturer in writing and also backed up by British Standards) 

 

- They've used the wrong silicone around the bath. It's not designed for bathroom use as it's not mould resistant (confirmed by manufacturer in writing)

 

- They did not fill the bath with water - to add appropriate weight - when siliconing around the edge, nor when tiling.  

 

- The tile adhesive was out of date.  

 

- We think the combined weight of the tiles, adhesive and grout exceeds the maximum for the substrate (plastered wall) as per British Standards.  We are awaiting details to calculate by how much.

 

- They said that they'd use a tanking product to waterproof the walls before tiling.  The manufacturer has said (in writing) the product they used is not a tanking product and also should not be used over old tile adhesive.  We have a photo showing lots of old tile adhesive still on the walls when the tiler was mid way through the job (i.e. after the product was used) so we could forward that to the manufacturer to see if they would be happy to comment further if you think it would be a good idea?

 

Main issues with plumbing:

 

- Did not put inhibitor (to prevent rust and corrosion) in the heating system when he refilled it.  He claims he did.

 

- He added a new connection to the loft cold water cistern, but did so at the wrong height, against building regs.  

 

- He used silicone inappropriately on the loft cistern connection, (confirmed by silicone manufacturer in writing, awaiting confirmation from cistern manufacturer) 

 

- He did not add isolation valves to our two toilet cisterns, which we have since learnt is is against building regs.  

 

There is also some incomplete plumbing work. 

 

Many thanks

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Okay that's a good list.

Have you got photographic evidence to support every point?

Have you presented this list to the plumber?

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Do you mean photos of each aspect listed?  If so, yes we either have photos or can easily take them.  

 

We've raised lots of the issues with him, but not all as we only recently found out about some.  We haven't provided photos to him because he has been to the house since "completion" and seen the aspects we have concerns about.  

 

Do you think we should put all the photos and the manufacturer's emails into a document to forward to the plumber?

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I certainly think that you should prepare a properly ordered file of the list of defects numbered and then the corresponding reference number on the back of each photograph

 

After that we can decide what to do

 

 

 

 

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Hi

 

Fortunately organisation, filing, etc are my strong points so I'm keeping files, spreadsheets and photos (as well as all correspondence) well ordered and structured on my PC.  Good suggestion to rename photos so they match the assigned numbered list of defects.  I'll do that - thanks.  

 

Just coming back to my question above - should we make a part payment now?  There are certainly aspects of the job that were done well and we're happy to make a partial payment to reflect that.  So long as there aren't any reasons not to.

 

Many thanks

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Certainly, it would be a good idea to be straight dealing with this trader.

If you feel that there is work which has been correctly carried out and you are satisfied with the quality then it will look good for you in court and also it will reduce the cost of bringing an action if you settle that part of the bill.

You need to be careful about making the payment and make it clear to him that the payment is made specifically in relation to X, Y, Z which you consider have been carried out to a reasonable standard but that you are continuing to withhold payments in respect of A, B, C because the work was defective – and then you should specify the way in which the work is defective.

Make sure it is all carefully documented.

At the same time, when you have listed out the defects for which you are not prepared to pay, invite him to comment.

Even if he fails to respond – that will help you because it will show that you have tried to reach out and be cooperative and that he has simply been stubborn and unreasonable

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Posted (edited)

OK great, thanks for explaining.  

 

Just want to check please that we also hold back payment for what we estimate will be additional costs to put the work right?  So based on an example of a £3,000 total figure:


- We’re happy paying for X,Y, Z that was carried out to a reasonable standard.  For example £1,500.  
- We’re withholding payment for A, B, C because the work was defective.  For example £1,500.  
- We’re also withholding L, M, N for the additional costs to undo the defective work and re-purchase the necessary materials to redo it.  For example £500. 
- We therefore make an initial payment of £1,000.  
 

Returning to your earlier recommendation to get independent assessments.  Who counts as an independent assessor?  Would another tiler be sufficient?  Or does it have to be someone who works as an assessor?  If the latter, I think we will struggle to find one besides the £1000+ option mentioned above, and so don’t know how to proceed. 

 

I came across this yesterday:  “Many disputes can be resolved without expert advice or evidence. If it is necessary to obtain expert evidence, particularly in low value claims, the parties should consider using a single expert, jointly instructed by the parties, with the costs shared equally.”

 

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/pd_pre-action_conduct

 

Is that irrelevant to our situation and in the real world?  
 

Many thanks

Edited by cabbies crick
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Of course a proper independent assessor would be nice – but this point I don't think it's necessary. He hasn't actually issued any claim so simply a decent professional that you are not associated with and who is prepared to give a written report – maybe with a few photographs highlighting particular problems.

When you write to him, I suggest that you write a very non-conflictual letter. Expressing goodwill. Expressing the willing to pay and expressing a desire to sort it out properly.
This is partly for his sake to try and diffuse his sense of indignity – but also if it goes to court, to show how reasonably indecently you behave throughout. Especially in the face of any evident defects.
Make it clear in your letter that you have no problem paying for satisfactory work and you want to pay because you realise that he is a small business and he needs money and because of that you are trying to identify the particular issues and the problem and reduce the extent of your disagreement.

I wouldn't use the words – we are withholding….

It sounds a bit strong-arm. I think you should keep it as positive sounding as possible so that you are very happy with X work and Y work and z work however there are other elements of the job which concern you and you'd like to discuss those and you invite his comments.
I don't you need to refer to the money you are withholding. That will be obvious.

Make it clear to him that the money you are paying is not subject to any conditions such as full and final settlement. Make it clear that you are happy to pay for that element of the contract.


 

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  • 3 weeks later...
Posted (edited)

Good evening.  A few updates on the above case.  

 

- 21/03. We wrote to the plumber addressing the points he had raised in his latest emails.  We re-stated our position and concerns.  We gave him details of some new issues that we have recently become aware of. We shared the feedback we had received from professional tilers on a forum.  We made a first payment, of £1,000.  We asked again whether he would consider ADR, whether he was a member of a Trades Association etc.  We proposed to get three quotes to redo the tiling, average them, and deduct the price form the money owed.  We invited his suggestions RE the plumbing work mistakes and the incomplete work.

 

- 22/03.  Following our request, he said he was looking into an ADR scheme "today" to see if it was suitable.

 

- 25/03. We forwarded emails from manufacturers to date evidencing wrong use of products etc.  We asked whether he had found any suitable ADR schemes.   We asked whether he had any further thoughts RE our proposals for the re-tiling and to address the plumbing. 

 

- 31/03. He did not respond nor send any further emails nor update us RE ADR.  Instead, we received an "A money claim has been made against you" email.  

 

SInce then I've been trying to get my head around the Money Claims Service - which seems different to the similarly named Money Claim Online (MCOL) - and plan to call the helpline tomorrow so I understand the process better, and what happens when within the process.  Hopefully things will be clearer then.

 

In the meantime, what would be a massive help from anyone on the forum would be help with:

 

- Late Fees/Interest.  He has added his 5% late fees from the first time he sent an invoice (mid-January) up to the claim date.  This amounts to a little over £300.  From the claim date to settlement/judgment he is charging interest at £5.40 a day.  I don't think any of this is right, but that hasn't stopped us panicking!  What if he can charge this?  Is there any way to find out for sure, because if he can, the final late fee/interest could be huge. 

 

- His Letter of Action.  I'm not sure which of his emails this was or whether he did it correctly.  Is that worth looking into now or is it not relevant?  

 

Any help would be most appreciated.  It has been a stressful weekend!

 

Many thanks

Edited by cabbies crick
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Please will you post up his letter of claim and also the claim form that she received in PDF format

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Many thanks for the Usain Bolt reply.  Just checking the guidance on uploading and redacting, then will get on the case.  Can I just check please... 

 

Should I upload all 6 pages of the Claim Form.  And, so long as I redact names, references, etc. I can't get in trouble for uploading the official claim form (I'm sure you wouldn't ask me to if I could!  But my stress and worry levels are high so I had to ask).

 

And it's ok to upload emails from the plumber - no breach of confidentiality etc?

 

Many thanks  

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only need the 1st page of the claimform with the particulars of claim.

 

on all things like the form or emails...you only need to redact HER info or anything like ref/claim numbers or  email AD etc that can ID HER to THEM if they were to read here. (complying with OUR and YOUR GDPR rules - privacy/anon on an open forum)

everyone elses details are fair game 

 

ONE MASS PDF IS OK.

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Thanks for confirming and explaining.  Not majorly relevant, but I'm a him and so is the plumber.  Not sure where the "her" came into it.  Homophone maybe?  Anyhow....  So I don't have to redact the plumbers name, address, phone number, email address, etc?  Can I if I feel better not to include his details?    

 

To be perfectly honest, I'm not sure if we have had the Particulars of Claim yet or not.  That's part of my aforementioned confusion!  So not sure how much to upload.  If it helps:

 

- Page 1 is claimant and defendant details.  

- Page 2 has a one sentence "Reason for Claim".  Followed by "TImeline of What Happened"

- Page 3 Timeline continues

- Page 4 Timeline continues

- Page 5 Timeline ends.  Claim Amount Details.  Total Amount.  Statement of Truth.

- Page 6 Digital signature and date

 

Many thanks

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i was going by bf's post saying 'her', are you both listed as defendants on the court claim?

 

redact the defendants stuff then - is there only one person listed?

 

this sounds like the new online claim system not mcol.

 

pages 3-5 then.

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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No, it's just me on the court claim.  So one claimant (plumber) and one defendant (me).

 

And yes, it is the new system - the one in beta.  That's what's made it a bit tricky because so much of the on line info, guides etc relate to MCOL.  And it took me a fair time to even work out  that MCOL and the new system are different.  Doesn't help that they have such similar names - what a daft decision that was imho.

 

I'll do page 2 as well seeing as that has the reason for claim and the beginning of the timeline.  Will sort it in the morning. 

 

Many thanks for the help

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So so sorry for the delay in posting the docs.  Working on them now.  Just wanted to check, is it ok when redacting first names leave the initial of the name?

 

Ta

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you redact anything the claimant can ID you by not THEIR details

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Thanks for the quick reply.

 

Is there any possibility I can also redact THEIR details?  Just feel uncomfortable posting up their details.  But if it's essential....

 

Also, what about third parties?  He references the tiler he subcontracted to on quite a few occasions, albeit by first name only.

 

Thanks again

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We tend to name and shame else there is little point in using a open forum as it helps no one bar you .

 

This guy could be a serial scammer for all we know and hiding his name prevents the internet from searching for him or telling you the truth about him if he already has a bad name 

 

Why protect this type of trader?

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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OK, fair play, that makes total sense.  So does that include everything - his name, address, email address, etc?  And it's totally safe to do so?  I do apologise as I'm sure you're asked that question all the time.  But for those of who have never been in this position - and fear potential repercussions - it's quite a nerve wracking thing to do!  

 

Also not sure about third parties, like the tiler as mentioned above, but he also names customer service reps in the shop that served him.  

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  • dx100uk changed the title to Plumber Issued Small Claims Against us.

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