Amusing discussion - PackLink Hermes - Parcel Lost - Value over £100. At the "getting the run about stage".

[red-ed]

Here is my first to PackLink

 

 

*********************

This is a very poor response.

 

First, it is clear there has been no investigation whatsoever. You have simply looked at the tracking and because the parcel has not moved for 72 hours it is assumed lost.  

 

Second, I was informed an investigation can take upon 30 days. You provided a long speal (see below) about searching large warehouse text etc. The Hermes response was barely a day, and it is clear they simply looked at the tracking and also assumed the parcel has been lost.  

 

Third, why was I not informed the parcel had been lost. It has been 16 days since the parcel stopped moving on tracking. 

 

Forth, why was an investigation not started after 72 hours, when we might have had a chance of finding the parcel. 

 

Lastly, according to the tracking the parcel was out for delivery. This means it was in the van with the delivery driver. The parcel was not delivered.  Why was the parcel not returned to the depot. Was it stolen ! Why did it mysteriously disappear? Why was there no supervision or oversight when the parcel turned RED on the tracking. 

 

The above describes an organisation that just does not care about the service it purports to provide. It also looks like, rather than performing a full and proper investigation, and making an effort remedy what was appalling service, Hermes and yourselves considers far easier to cough up £25 and try to hide behind your terms and conditions.  

 

In English law, you are required perform service with reasonable care and skill. English law also provides that you cannot limited my right to fair compensation if you are in breach on contract. 

 

The item was clearly mislaid by the Hermes delivery driver. Hermes has not provided service with "reasonable care and skill”.  This is a breach of contract (1). 

 

The investigation, which is also a service provided by Hermes, was a sham (lie). This is also a breach of contract (2). 

 

The £25 compensation limit is likely to be construed as unfair and struck out by a County Court Judge.  Moreover, it seems to have be used in lieu of an investigation which is misuse of contractual term.  i.e. A term that was drafted to limit financial liability not to limit service provided.  This is also a breach of contract (3). 

 

You now have two choices, 1. Bring this matter to a swift conclusion and pay the full xxx in compensation or 2. We take the legal route, and I make a claim for xxxx  plus court fees plus further compensation for hassle of having to take this matter to law.

 

The choice is yours - but please be aware, I will ask the judge when he considers compensation, to take account of the fact you ignored my very reasonable offer (choice 1) to end this dispute.

 

You 14 days to provide a satisfactory response.

 

Thank you 

 

......................

 

Here is my letter to Hermes

 

*************

Thank you for your response.

I have already contacted Packlink and they have been the opposite of helpful. I note that you are referring me back to PackLink and making no effort whatsoever to locate the lost parcel. Please see the attached email to PackLink.  

 

 

In fact, it looks like you are using the £25 compensation term in our contract in lieu of the provision of the contracted service.   You should also note from attached email that PackLink defined how you were expected investigate the loss of my parcel, and it is clear from recent correspondence there was no investigation whatsoever from either yourselves or Packlink.  

 

I therefore do not believe you are 100% dedicated to ensuring every parcel arrives safely. Quite frankly it looks like you do not care a jot what happened to my parcel. 

Please be aware that Packlink are based in Spain, and i will therefore be using the provisions in Contracts (Rights of Third Party) Act 1999 to hold Hermes responsible for all loses flowing from your breach (s) of contract. Please see clause 1 (1) (b) Contracts (Rights of Third Party) Act 1999. You should also note that Hermes has been expressly identified as a third party.  I will be doing this in England using the provisions provided the Consumer Rights Act 2015. In particular the reasonable care and skill requirement, and the use of terms in our contract that tries to limit my legal rights. 

I therefore urge you to work with Packlink to provide a satisfactory resolution to this dispute and to this promptly and efficiently. Any further procrastination or deliberate legal confusion on your or Packlink's part will be added to my to my claim for compensation.

 

You have 14 days to provide a satisfactory response. 

 

 

Next letter to Hermes 

 

 

*******************

 

Thank you for this and I note that you are unable to help with this matter.  I urge you to reconsider because your intransigence will only increase the hassle, costs and my claim for compensation. 

 

Thank you

 

 

Email to PackLink

 

Here is an extract from your email 19th January 2020.

 

"What happens next? After you complete the online form Packlink will initiate an investigation with the carrier to confirm the loss or damage. After the investigation is concluded if parcel is confirmed lost or damaged the dossier will be transferred to the claims department for the final approval".

 

You will note I submitted a claim form (for xx), and then submitted the same evidence again in my email 19th January 2020 (in answer to your email). I also refer you back to my COMPLAINT email 20th January 2020 (attached) which provides the legal basis for my claim. 

 

PLEASE CONFIRM THIS CLAIM HAS BEEN TRANSFERRED TO THE CLAIMS DEPARTMENT.  Please also make the claims department aware of my COMPLAINT email 20th January 2020 (attached).  Please also confirm that that a COMPLAINT has also been raised about the poor response, especially the fact that there has been no investigation whatsoever by Hermes. 

 

You now have 13 days to provide a satisfactory response or I will start legal action against Hermes with further reference.

 

Thank you 

 

I am getting the standard blocking and misinformation. It is deliberate and designed to put off customers claiming fair compensation for contract breaches. 

 

I believe it is a criminal offence to deliberately, and knowingly misrepresent the law in order to make gain or cause someone a loss or both. . From my research and reading it is clear Hermes service is very poor, and there is a huge number of customers who have been badly impacted, and they are seeking to mitigate their losses through intransigence, awkwardness, unfair contract terms (a legal wall), copy and paste emails, use of untrained foreign staff, and a whole host of underhand and illegal tactics.

 

If I had been dealt with fairly, and felt that Hermes and Packlink had made an effort to help me, I might have written off the loss, but they have been so annoying, I have decided to take them all the way, and share my approach with others, who struggle dealing with the misuse of our legal system to mitigate their losses from their own contractual breaches. 

 

Any comment, direction, advice and help gratefully received 

 

Thank you 

 

 

 

 

[BankFodder]

Thanks for all these letters – but the first thing you should know is that there is no point in getting into complicated protests and explanations to Packlink or Hermes. They don't pay attention to anything.

You can write your little heart out to them and maybe it will do you some good personally but it doesn't get you anywhere. In fact the more this kind of stuff that you write, the more they realise how ineffectual you are.

Secondly, this really too much of it for us to go through and tease out the facts.

So please could you simply summarise what has happened in a brief chronology. It shouldn't take you more than about eight lines and then we will probably ask you some questions and help you begin your claim and get your money back

[dx100uk]

it's consumer 'civil' law and not a 'criminal' illegal matter.

 

[red-ed]

 

@BankFodder

 

Thank you for this. I am sorry you don't have time read everything. I find your comment about my letters being ineffectual is rude and condescending and discourages us (consumers) sharing our experiences, ideas views on this forum.  Which i thought was the point of this forum.  

 

Concerning my letters, emails etc.  At the start of claim i like to fish, and also point out the relevant law.  The fishing helps and often i find process errors - which strengthens my legal claim.  Pointing out the legal basis and expected resolution of my claim early (and getting ignored), will help me increase the quantum. ie a failure to act reasonably. Which judges take very seriously. This is because both parties are expected to mitigate the others losses by working "reasonably" toward settling the dispute. 

 

For example:

Packlink wrote this - "Take into account that this type investigation requires the coordination of the different participants involved (driver, depot, warehouse, carrier's local offices), so it might be necessary to wait for a response from the different parties involved before being able to provide you with an answer" and said this can take up to 30 days. Hermes/Packlink responded in less than a day with standard copy and paste email.  Investigating the loss of a parcel is part of the service provided by Hermes/Packlink, and failure to do this with reasonable care skill is another breach of contract and strengthens my claim. 

 

***********

 

Lastly, i am interested to hear from others re the use of unfair contractual terms to discourage and put off valid contractual claims. Worse the fact they deliberately train their staff to believe this is law, and they happily mislead customers.  I have experienced this with Apple, Amazon, Hermes etc, etc. and it is getting worse, because helps to swell the companies profits. For consumers, it simply adds insult to injury.  

 

I also believe misrepresenting the law to deprive others may be a criminal offence. If that is case, and others are getting as fed up as me as having take delinquent companies to law, to recover compensation, there may be an opportunity to get regulators involved.  For example ASA might be interested - because they are effectively trying to make you pay to cover yourself against the their breach of contracts. 

 

Now if you want to help, please do so, otherwise let others contribute

 

Thank you

 

  

 

Edited January 23, 2022 by dx100uk
unnecessary previous post quote removed

[BankFodder]

I'm very sorry you feel that way.

Maybe you would be better off visiting some of the Facebook groups where they do discuss this kind of thing.
Here are links to a couple of them.

 

Log in to Facebook

WWW.FACEBOOK.COM

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Log in to Facebook to start sharing and connecting with your friends, family and people you know.

 

 

 

Log in to Facebook

WWW.FACEBOOK.COM

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Log in to Facebook to start sharing and connecting with your friends, family and people you know.

 

Also, you could petition the government to take this in hand and introduce some proper statutory regulation.
Here's a link:

 

Petition Parliament and the government - GOV.UK

WWW.GOV.UK

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Create a new petition, or search and sign other people's petitions to the UK Parliament and government

 

 

And of course you could always turn to Citizens Advice, who are well-intentioned:

 

Citizens Advice

WWW.CITIZENSADVICE.ORG.UK

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Online free advice from Citizens Advice to help you find a way forward, whatever the problem. Our research enables us to campaign on issues...

 

But if you want to get something done and get your money back, then you should produce the chronology that I suggested and then we will start to help you

[red-ed]

I do not need your help with my claim. I am very familiar with law and legal process. If I need specific legal advice I will consult a solicitor. 

 

I have posted because this is called a "forum". It is where we (Consumers) share views and experiences and opinions etc. I am particularly interested to hear how others feel about the increased use of unfair contractual terms to mislead staff and consumers, and more importantly what can done be to discourage and reduce this unfair practice. Hermes seem to have taken this to whole new level.  The links you provided above add nothing to discussion, and as such, are unhelpful. 

 

I see that you try to guide others through the legal process, and provide advice on law. You seem to have process and expect people contributing to the forum to follow a strict process and follow your advice to the letter if they want receive your advice and guidance.  You are quite rude if people do not do what you expect.  

 

First,  please advise if you are legally qualified to provide such advice., Second, if it is the intention of the CAG to operate this as "forum" or a process based web site that dispenses legal advice.  Lastly, please confirm if you are acting moderator or a legal advisor.  

 

Thank you

 

 

 

Edited January 23, 2022 by red-ed

[BankFodder]

21 minutes ago, red-ed said:

... If I need specific legal advice I will consult a solicitor. ...

 

 

 

This is probably a good idea for you. Good luck.

[red-ed]

1 hour ago, BankFodder said:

 

This is probably a good idea for you. Good luck.

 

First,  please advise if you are legally qualified to provide such advice., Second, if it is the intention of the CAG to operate this as "forum" or a process based web site that dispenses legal advice.  Lastly, please confirm if you are acting moderator or a legal advisor.  

 

I guess from your silence re. the above questions that you are not qualified to provide legal advice. I also suggest that you confine your role to moderation rather than making rude comments toward new forum contributors. 

 

Thank you 

[honeybee13]

We don't claim to give legal advice, red-ed. This is a self help forum run by volunteers.

 

HB