Bristow & Sutor Bailiffs & CTAX Debt - had NOE+Visit - now threat to remove goods? can they take a car worth 10x more than the debt?

[The roadwarrior]

have council tax from previous yrs owed at 500 ish.....

question being   

what is situation regarding so called agents bailiffs ,  bristow and sutor..

.whatever they like

to label their action man suit with due to being afraid of real work and the need to wear a pretend uniform!!! 

and attempts to intimidate single mothers and old folks!! 

question is...

can they clamp and threaten to take a vehicle 10 x the value of  council tax owed   ??? 

when the amount owed is much smaller than the value of said vehicle,  vehicle used to get to work...

many thanks,

and keep up the  professional advice on hear  ...

... power in no s/...........

[honeybee13]

Hello, welcome to CAG.

 

Can you tell us a bit more about what's happened please, so we can give you considered advice?

 

Best, HB

[The roadwarrior]

ok ,

had a letter usual first letter,  owed 500 ish c tax...

.then a visit dropped of letter second stage i believe this is , 

 then third letter in post

usual procedure with their so called hard work costs involved and  added..... 

i know they target vehicles,  nothing occurred yet  ,,

all council tax related  from unknown figures around 2019   

my interest being on the value of car being more than is owed  .

can they take it and sell it .

what is the law on this matter...

and what happens to all the extra money from sale after the owed  amount is taken / assuming a vehicle can be taken...?

  again,

many thanks to you all, salt of the earth.......

[dx100uk]

short answer is if its your asset they could yes they could clamp it.

so keep it off the public highway... better still in a locked garage.

 

however, thats not the typical way things go if you deal with this properly

sadly you have come here with predetermined stereo types of who the bailiffs are and p'haps how to deal with this matter , and most probably ignored numerous letter from the council prior to the bailiffs turning up? like do you know when the liability order was attained by the council?

 

so you've had the notice of enforcement @£75 and you've also had a visit @£235, so you've all the fees now levied that they can on a CTAX debt £310?

 

is this correct please?

 

have you contacted the relevant council at all since leaving the property that the CTAX debt is all about?

 

dx

 

[The roadwarrior]

so  can they take it away,?   said vehicle that is ,...even though value is is more than said owed amount  and can they sell the vehicle or would it be impounded 

 

sadly the predetermined stereo types come from experience....i will be contacting the council 

[dx100uk]

bailiffs typically clamp it till you pay.

can you please answer my questions?

 

dx

[The roadwarrior]

yes , could you answer my original questions also ?  can they take sell or impound vehicle    thanks

 

i  do not no date of liability order

 

had all fees as above 

[dx100uk]

i have twice, they can clamp it if they can. but thats very rare where CTAX is involved nowadays

 

this is only a CTAX debt, its not like a magistrates court fine etc, whereby you might have had dealings with the seizure of a car before?

dont get confused.

 

is your car vulnerable? best to hide it a few streets away or lock it up.

 

busted and stupid can rather arm wave but if the car is safe from them, there is not a lot they can do bar hand the debt back to the council

there is no right of entry on a CTAX LO. once the fees are all charged thats just about as far as they normally go. it is only £500, or is it +£800 now with their fees added.

 

hence the letter rather than another time wasting visit whereby they cant extract any more money nor charge more fees.

 

whats the history please,

you ran away from an old CTAX debt from elsewhere ?

or this is past CTAX at your present home?

2yrs is a bit late for your current council to catch up on a historic 2019 LO

a bit of history can help us advise the correct way to approach the council concerned,

 

 

 

 

[The roadwarrior]

c tax is at present home   ..   ill try to reword my question ,

can they officially put it on a lorry to take away if they so decided,

,again i understand they ll clamp to intimidate payment..  ? 

i do usually when behind catch up with monthly c tax as explained to the council in previous letters to them, struggling to see where its owed but council sent letter saying owed 2019/ 2020   ,

what is the law regards taking a vehicle worth more than c /tax bill ?   

ive asked council for breakdown of where amount is owed by letter  ,

they replied with the c t /year,

im looking at wc scenario here thats all, .... 

do they often sell vehicles when ?

if taken and compounded etc     .........how common is it for vehicles to be taken and will it cost them.......

 

thanks

[dx100uk]

i will say again

they could clamp, but for ctax thats rare.

there are no examples of vehicles being towed, loaded on to flatbeds and impounded here over a CTAX debt, other debts like magistrate court fines and motoring offences yes. but not for a CTAX debt. so please can we move on and resolve the debt itself and find out if its legit.

is the debt £500 now total or with bailiff fees sits at £800ish ? as its very rare for a council to issue an LO for a £200 CTAX bill.

you say you've questioned the debt and the council have replied stating for 2019/20 period without a breakdown?

is this action something new and never before come up?

or you've had a running dispute since then about it?

if not this sounds like they have a historic debt section and are chasing old debts whereby the LO date could be interesting here if the current enforcement is outside of 12mts from the LO and enforcement has not been renewed....

[Homer67]

To save DX repeating his expert advice a fourth time the answer is yes, if they clamp your car to try and enforce payment they will eventually take it away. It does not matter that it's worth more than the debt to them.

 

Follow the advice you have been given and deal with this before it gets to that stage.

Edited December 3, 2021 by Homer67
typo

[The roadwarrior]

it started at 500 owed yes ,then went to around 800 after added bailiff costs ,

 

it is a new action yes, as far as i was aware id payed previous years and its and not come up before ,accept letter from council recently couple mths before these actions, at the moment about an previous yrs amount being owed.. i e the  said amount as above   ..

 

should i ask for the liability order date from  council ?

 

 

what are the usual procedures when vehicles "are" taken then  vary rarely  in those circumstances just trying to paint a picture here,

 

 

avatar    ....i am dealing with it ,this is why im here !    my arcs are covered,  i have  very genuine interests as the procedures here i e /clamping and removal of vehicles including values of goods taken by bailiffs that are more than the value of actual c.tax bill with added costs,and the afterwards usual procedure  by bailiffs regards c /tax issues after impounding a car and  what happens next usually...as i have no knowledge here and didnt think they could take goods more than the total value of owed amount ...

 

.if it is actually owed that is.

 

 

thanks very much all

Edited December 3, 2021 by The roadwarrior

[dx100uk]

there are no examples here of a car ever being clamped, then seized and impounded on a CTAX debt whereby its on private land or i'e a driveway. it could happen on a public road.

 

i would be writing to the council yes asking the date of the LO as you should have been informed the court case was happening, with a chance to resolve it 1st.

 

you might also wish to use this:

 

 

[The roadwarrior]

.........thank you very much for your advice and time on this     .

[dx100uk]

No bother.do that breathing space

 

Use the 60 days wisely and plan your attack carefully and properly, if you do this right then you could possibly get bailiffs fees removed.

 

The other thing to check is that the enforcement is current and has been renewed if the lo was more than 12mts ago. Many times youll find enforcement is has not been re requested.. Wink wink.

[The roadwarrior]

i will update this thread when i receive  a reply from  the council after i ask for the L O  date issue ...................   

[Bailiff Advice]

Just to clarify the position regarding the question as to whether a bailiff is legally permitted to seize a vehicle that is far in excess of the amount of debt requested.

 

In this case, the council tax debt at the time of the Notice of Enforcement was £500. Unfortunately, instead of contacting the company to enter into a payment arrangement,  the matter was left and had resulted in a bailiff making a personal visit and the debt has now increased to around £750. From your initial post, your car could be worth approx £5,000. 

 

Vehicles are of course a preferred asset to seize. However, the legal position is that if the bailiff is able to gain 'peaceful entry' into your home and by doing so, is able to seize sufficient goods to clear the debt and bailiff fees, then he should not touch the car. If however, he is unable to gain entry....OR....there are not sufficient goods in the property to cover the debt.....then he is legally permitted to remove (and sell the vehicle). 

 

You need to be aware that a £5,000 car would likely raise significantly less than this when sold. Enforcement agents sales are generally auction sales (usually online). Because it would not be likely that the vehicle is sold with a V5C (Log Book) or service history, this would affect its sales price. From any sale, the enforcement company would need to deduct approx 14 days of storage fees (this could be up to £40 PER DAY). Auctioneers fees would also be deducted. 

 

 

 

 

[The roadwarrior]

i do not and will not enter any payment arrangement with a bailiff company ....

especially for an amount from the council  that may not be valid yet !

i will not communicate with these types of people  

the hard  work and suffering involved .dropping an envelope through a letterbox .. for said fees  well !!      no comment  on that  

if everyone stopped blindly paying dca s tommorow..............................

thanks for advice

[dx100uk]

a bailiff is NOT a DCA.

a DCA can NEVER be a BAILIFF.

stop confusing the rules and powers for each or lumping them in the same barrel.

a bailiff does have powers to demand fees and if letters and visits were correct, then you will have to pay the fees

Even if you pay the council directly, bailiff fees are added to their balance and , if legitimate, will be taken first before any CTAX balance gets paid.

[The roadwarrior]

this i know   

firstly i ll be asking for liability order date  

[Bailiff Advice]

Its best to request this information from the council. 

If the council have instructed the enforcement company to council a specific amount, then the bailiff is legally within his right to collect that sum...and add their fees as outlined in legislation (£75 Compliance Fee and £235 Enforcement fee). 

Until the council instruct their agent to cease enforcement, then your vehicle is at risk. 

Edited January 8, 2022 by dx100uk
unnecessary previous post quote removed

[The roadwarrior]

ok ,    here is  the latest update,,

i have received letter from council regarding liability order for outstanding c/tax, i e the date concerning the above matters, the date is july 2019

all advice is greatly  appreciated........

[dx100uk]

Scan the letter up to pdf read upload guide

[The roadwarrior]

i have no  scanner  im afraid,

[dx100uk]

You dont need one, as i said read our upload guide