P2P Loan CCJ - claimant now has 3rd party order freezing my account - help

[dx100uk]

You were told to open another account. you said you had no money to bother doing that...but you suddenly transfer £500 into it..to pay essentials??

 

Stop funding bank accounts that they can grab cash from!!

you caused this yourself... Sorry.

[HP Mum]

Dx - I had set up another account. 

 

My benefits don't cover even my essentials. 

I took advice from my pension advisor, he checked and said I had 1k available in pension fund - which was a wonderful surprise and bonus.   They organized that sum to go from the pension fund into the new account. 

 

The 500 I transferred into my normal account was the last of the 1k.  That's it - I have nothing else that can be taken from that pension fund. 

 

You may well be criticizing me but that's harsh.  I had direct debits still set up in my normal account - and that's why I transferred 500. 

I have direct debits due tomorrow - one of which is a higher quarterly payment - total debit value of 500. 

My next benefit isn't due for 1w. 

 

now I can't pay the direct debits and I have 0 for food. 

 

I am stressed and in a corner and probably not thinking right. 

Clearly I made a mistake by transferring my last 500. But "shouting" at me isnt gonna change my mistake. 

 

 I'm trying to keep calm.  

 

I have been doing my best to rise above the most awful circumstances over the last few years. I try not to dwell as a victim, I prefer to try find solutions.  To that end I cope. But most people in similar situation would not have survived the last few years. 

 

In my previous business existence I could earn £500 in a day.  That existence disappeared.  To now lose £500 feels like the end of the world.   I have budgeted.  But I did not expect my circumstances to still be unresolved after a few years.

[dx100uk]

if you'd dealt with moving the DD's too then the court would not of gotten the money.

turn any A/C that any court can seize money from into a dead account no DD's no income no movement.

pers i would have though with 'all that has gone on over the years' you'd have been a master at this game and told us a few things to help others....

 

think before you drink before you drive.

 

dx

 

 

 

 

[HP Mum]

Dx - u r correct. I should have but didn't. I am stupid.  I will now.

And I do intend to write it all down/ self-publish.

I do also try to help family and friends with stuff I've picked up - which is evident on some of my postings - and helps distract from my own issues

 

I still need to understand the implications of this order and what may come next?

Edited January 3, 2022 by HP Mum

[unclebulgaria67]

You need to contact whoever has obtained this money from the Bank, to ask for it back for the reasons you have given and if they won't repay this to you,  apply to the court to retreive this money.   Due to your finances, it should not cost you any hearing fee.  The Court staff may help you with this. 

 

The advice from your pensions advisor appears lacking, if they were aware of the situation you had with creditors.  Did they warn you, that as soon as the money was released, you might have to disclose this to creditors that had a Court judgement against you ?

 

 

[HP Mum]

It's an interim tpdo and the county court is holding the £s before the tpdo is made final...  

The bank is at fault for releasing funds from kids account. I can't discuss with them until tomorrow morning.  Will see what they say before I contact court.

 

Not really sure the pension guy did anything wrong?  In the sense the ccj is secured against an asset from which no £s will be released until different legal disputes are resolved/ asset sold?  The pension tax-free £s were sent to a different bank than the tpdo bank.   

 

I'm not really sure how a ccj works?  The debt is secured against a property.   With just benefits and this small pension sum into a different bank account - which was supposed to just pay essential life bills -  surely the ccj debt is "safe".

 

To whom should I declare I received 1k?   Those funds are gone now anyway. I don't have any other funds or assets from which any creditor can grab

Edited January 3, 2022 by dx100uk
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[dx100uk]

the bank are not at fault if your name is/has overall authority on any other A/C.

many financial scammers hid money that way and thats why, oh's it's my underage kids savings/trustee account for when they are of xxx age. i'll hide it there.

 

dx

 

 

 

[HP Mum]

I understand that dx.  But just for clarity if it's easily provable earned income by the kid then the court will have to return it?

[dx100uk]

 trouble is the cost of doing so.

 

as explained above you might get fee relief but even so any hearing would be months away.

always better to proactive before rather than try and be reactive after.

[HP Mum]

 But...

it is actually the banks fault with this account.  They can see its not mine and had kid's income in. We just left the account as it was, rather than transferring it into a new account thinking it would be safer and without thinking there'd be a problem like this.  Also kid is officially an adult now.  

 

What do u mean - the cost of doing so?  My kid wants his £s back ! Kid can't be held liable for my debts

Edited January 3, 2022 by HP Mum

[Ombra4532]

hi I am not expert but it feels that you have ignored the claimant letters and claims. If you had negotiated with them they would give you the chance to negotiate a minimum amount to pay each month. This has lead to the claimant becoming very annoyed and making court orders to verify your financial situation.

 

These companies only spend money if there are money to make therefore they have proves that you have assets they can claim on. at this stage is up to the judge decision when your case goes to court based on the claimant request.

 

suggest you try to arrange monthly payment to repay the debts. If the amount you owe is more than 5 thousands they will bankrupt you and take your assets whether in dispute or not, your claimant will be patient they have done their search on your assets. If you go to court very likely you loose and have to pay costs thousands!!

 

best to make contact with the claimant and negotiate. Judges are never emotional about people that ignores their responsibilities.

 

hope I have not upset but there is no way out but negotiate.

Edited January 3, 2022 by dx100uk
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[HP Mum]

Thanks for the reply

They can't currently take the asset as the asset is protected due to separate legal disputes involving other entities.   I am not sure if they know this.

 

Also the amount owed is a lot.

But they are the 2nd charge - which is large mortgage size

 

Edited January 3, 2022 by HP Mum

[Ombra4532]

If you have a house or any property on your name they already know, there is a search system through the land registry. if the claimant does not know you will be questioned by the judge in court and you have to be honest or face prison if you lie and hide assets. Do not take courts and judges lightly. I hope all goes well for you. 

[HP Mum]

They know about the asset.  They got a ccj and secured it against the asset.

What they don't know is that the asset is subject to separate disputes.

I also did ask a lawyer to deal with this tpdo but they didn't do the work and won't if I have no funds !

Edited January 3, 2022 by HP Mum

[dx100uk]

1 hour ago, HP Mum said:

Also kid is officially an adult now.  

makes no odds. they were not when you set it up. you have an authoritative, i bet you still have  control over that money if you did not change the people with hold on it. , that means it can be sequestrated. (opps that's scotland - lucky you are not there you'd stand no chance they would take it by court order).

 

 

[HP Mum]

I understand what you say dx. Banks dictate that kids accounts are set up with a parent name.  In my kids case there was proper paid work.  That's evident by the companies paying into the account in kids name.

The funds belong to the kid

It is interesting that a different bank wrote to nominated parent to advise they were changing the account into an adult account for the kid- yet this bank didnt 

[HP Mum]

Just trying to understand options here

Can't afford lawyer.  Can't attend hearing

Is it possible to email evidence to court in advance of hearing?

[BazzaS]

Your woes have been going on for years.

You owe monies you can't repay. Your income is minimal (benefits).

 

Do you think that if (years ago!) you'd declared bankruptcy (especially if one of your creditors had paid for it!), you'd now be free of debt, free of the CCJ and able to move forward?

 

Have you sought debt advice, (including bankruptcy) rather than fighting repeated court actions / acquiring ccj(s)?.

 

Bankruptcy isn't the right way forward for everyone, but isn't the shame that it was once viewed with. For some scenarios it is the best option and allows people a fresh start.

Is there a reason why it wouldn't be an option for you (historically, or currently) to free you from the fear of further court action(s)?.

 

[HP Mum]

Yes there is a good reason.

It's very complicated; too much to go into here. I haven't been able to talk about what's going on.  Not even to close friends. 

 

A bare bones explanation is that I am stuck in a protracted 3 way battle involving one asset. Me going bk would adversely affect that.

 

I have successfully fought bk so far on the grounds that someone else's actions have paralyzed all of us. 

The last few years have been brutal. 

 

All the issues to be dealt with are very time-consuming. That - plus lockdown - has prevented earning ability.  But there will be a resolution.  Then I really hope my life can return to normal and I can earn decent money again.  In the meantime I am living off (less than) the bare minimum...

Once the battle is resolved I hope that the person that has issued the tpdo can get their £s.  And others too...

 

I need to face up to this tpdo and get the £s that aren't mine returned.  There's a hearing coming up and I would like to know if I can email the courts with my evidence as I can't attend.  Is that possible?   

 

I know its possible to email docs regarding a claim for a judge to review - and I have that email as I've used it before.  But I just don't know if it's possible to email docs to the court for a specific hearing instead of attendance? 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 13, 2022 by dx100uk
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[HP Mum]

Some good news.

 

attendance today as L-in-P was scary but beneficial.

Most £s returned, no need for 244 form due to high cost,

have to provide further evidence and doc of truth within 1w to prove level of 'broke-ness' to get tpdo discharged (or be guilty of contempt  ).

 

Not 100% sure the extent of what is needed??  

 

The tpdo was only for 1 bank.  Yet some transfers came from my parachute bank account - which would be shown in statements. 

Would I / should I show the parachute account now too?   

 

Money in that account was/is (and hopefully will be in the future) occasional cheque gifts from family to help out and was the account into which pension funds got paid.  There's only a small amount left in this account - and still £s that I would use for normal living expenses..  

 

Alternatively would all certified info from hmrc -  benefit, covid grants, pension and tax return - be enough as evidence of all the income received over the last tax year?   Benefits I continue to get monthly.  Seiss and pension £s all been used up.

 

Silly - sols costs are going to be more than are ever recoverable via the tpdo.

Edited January 13, 2022 by dx100uk
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[dx100uk]

surely the payments from the parachute account when totalled are far far smaller than compared to the individual totals from the other funding sources?

i cant really see how anyone would ever go thru things in such finest details if they were so small and be really bothered about them?

[HP Mum]

I have no idea what they are trying to achieve? Even judge was at wits end considering the bulk was returned and there's a CO - which they didn't disclose in their claim. 

 

Unless they hope to find links to other accounts with lots of money?  Which there isn't. 

 

Tbh i don't think they expected me to turn up and dispute it. The attending Sol was very unprepared and didn't seem to know any details

[HP Mum]

My court 1st in person/ statement and 2nd written evidence response to the tpdo claim was that the taken funds are needed for essential living costs.

 

Despite the court agreeing the bulk taken could be returned immediately (£s that weren't mine) the court has still not sent the written authority to the bank to release those funds.  The bank needs the Order and the Judge hasn't written it.

 

Despite claiming hardship and stating the other remaining funds are essential for life - a call to the Courts advised it could take 2w+ for judge to write up Order to return the £s - or not.  And a call to the bank said it could take 2-4w+ for them to release the funds - due to the time it could take for clerks to process the paperwork. Mad.

 

The Judge had suggested in court I use the funds they'd agreed to return to pay for the n244 app form for hardship to submit the further evidence within 2w.  Thankfully Judge waived using the form - or wouldn't have even been able to submit further hardship evidence - due to not enough funds in account.

 

What madness. The judge didn't understand the reimbursement process could take up to 6w.  And what a farce - that a defendant stating they are broke and in dire need of the taken funds to survive, then is made to wait for weeks and weeks...

 

As an aside - is it correct to assume that the further evidence submitted to prove hardship - i.e. bank statements and hmrc returns - is strictly confidential to the judge and to the claimant lawyers re that claim?  That due to GDPR the lawyers cannot disclose the submitted confidential docs to anyone else/ any other company?

 

Edited January 30, 2022 by HP Mum

[BazzaS]

Given how 'broke' you are, surely it wouldn't disadvantage you for other claimants to see that there really isn't any blood to get from this particular stone ... ?

(Not sure they could, if the judge ordered it to be in confidence, but even so, what harm?).

[HP Mum]

It's just a general question - is info disclosed in one claim subject to GDPR - as in confidential to claimant, defendant and court ?