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eBay Packlink new unopened iPad stolen by Hermes - help please


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Hi everyone, would really appreciate some help with my case.

 

On 30th October I sold a brand new unopened Apple iPad Pro 11’ 2nd gen 2020 on ebay. I used Hermes via packlink ebay to ship the item using signed for delivery.

This was securely packaged up in a Jiffy bag and collected by Hermes on 1st November. This was delivered to the buyer on November 5th.

 

The buyer then responded to me with photographic evidence of the packaging being tampered with, and the iPad was not inside. The item was also left in the porch and no signature was obtained, contrary to the service that was paid for. This was immediately reported to packlink the same day on 5th November.

 

After an investigation was carried out it was confirmed in writing to me by Packlink that that the package was subject to tampering and would be passed onto the claims department. Their claims department is subsequently stating that they will not reimburse me for my losses due to me not following ‘guidelines’ on packaging i.e. not posting the item in a box on November 11th.

 

I refuted this decision on the same day, and again on 14th November as no amount of cardboard would prevent a thief working at Hermes from slicing open packaging, taking it out, and re-sealing it with new clear tape as is what has happened. Packlink are also refusing the share with me any evidence of the package being signed for...presumably because they just left it in the porch! Today I also reported this as a theft to the police.

 

The buyer used 'item not as described' rather than not received, despite the messages in my ebay account clearly showing it's an item not received issue. Apparently ebay are only allowed one challenge to PayPal and have taken the money from me, saying I'm not covered by their money back guarantee protections because the issue has been logged with the payment provider, not ebay (I'm told).

 

Though I'm not sure what challenge they exactly put forward, given the claim of 'not as described' is clearly untrue.

 

Edited by dx100uk
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Spend a good bit of time reading up on the Hermes stories on the sub- forum. All of the questions you are asking have already been dealt with several times.

When you have a good understanding of the principles and the route that your claim will take then come back here and we will help you with the next step.

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Thanks - I did have a look before but have had a look at a few more since.

 

Definitely going after Hermes as a first point of call.

 

Sent a version of my original post via their web chat after following the clues to 'report damage to my home/vehicle' as per another post here. So sneaky they want to avoid you getting in touch at all in the first place.

 

Added in points around Consumer Rights meaning their 'post in a box' nonsense isn't enforceable by law and then told them I was going after them as under the Contracts (rights of third parties) act.

 

Now will have to wait for 10 days to get their standard response. Then guess can move on to the letter before action.

 

Am still chasing Packlink in the interim, will send them the crime reference number when I get it.

 

Will be interesting going through the Money Claims/Small Court process over Christmas!!

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Reading through the stories means more than simply having a look.

However, as you say, you will have to wait for a reply in about 10 days.

In the meantime keep on reading. Start drafting your letter of claim because that will be the next step.

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The reason you dont have a signature is because like everywhere else since February/ March 2020 they have not done signatures. Just pictures of the item left at your home or even inside your house. 

 

OFT debt collection guidance

 

Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

Essex girl in pc world looking 4 curtains 4 her pc,the assistant says u dont need curtains 4 a computer!!Essex girl says,''HELLOOO!! i,ve got WINDOWS!!'.

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Yeah I thought that, but I would have thought with the signature being something extra you have to pay for, they would have delivered to a neighbour or kept it until they could have it signed for by someone.

 

They have also not sent me the evidence of delivering it. Just adds more fuel to the fire that the person delivering didn't want to hand an empty envelope over to someone when it should have had an iPad in it.

 

 

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Not allowed to leave with neighbour as its a covid risk. Even if instructions given to say that. 

Well at least that is what l have been told by all the delivery companys l have had delivers from. 

You could challenge why they are charging for signatures when they are not doing them. 

OFT debt collection guidance

 

Please remember the only stupid question is the one you dont ask so dont worry about asking the stupid questions.

 

Essex girl in pc world looking 4 curtains 4 her pc,the assistant says u dont need curtains 4 a computer!!Essex girl says,''HELLOOO!! i,ve got WINDOWS!!'.

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Yes that's a good point, having a look they do have a disclaimer for that on the delivery page now.

 

I have now received the bog standard reply from Hermes saying that they won't do anything. Have adapted a letter before claim/action below. Any feedback welcome.

 

Am planning to email this over in response to their last email (or is it better to post to their legal department? or both?)

 


 

Quote

 

Dear Sir/Madam,

 

Parcel ID xxxxx

 

On 30/10/2021 I used your service to send a parcel under the above reference number.  

 

While the parcel did arrive at its destination,

The item posted was missing from the package, it appears to have been stolen. As acknowledged by packlink on 9th November, and I quote ‘After completing the investigation with the carrier [Hermes] the shipment has been confirmed as subject to tampering’.

Your own investigation concluded that it was stolen.

 

The theft has been reported to the police. Crime reference number 21000813740

 

This was purchased via 3rd parties (Hermes via eBay packlink) but I am pursuing yourselves as I am entitled to do under the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties Act ) 1999).

 

Value of item to me = £601.99 

Postage cost to me = £4.89

Total loss to (amount of claim) = £606.88

 

You have so far declined to reimburse me and I am therefore informing you that applying my third-party rights under the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 I'm proposing to begin a I shall issue a county court claim against you within in 14 days and without any further notice unless you reimburse me in full before that date.

If I have to take this route I will be seeking both interest and court fees in addition to my total loss.

 

 

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

 

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Edits in red

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Thank you, this was sent to them via email and I got the following reply below 2 days later. Essentially same as their original response to my initial email, but worded slightly more carefully now i've threatened legal action.

 

I will continue to wait for the days to expire and get going on the money claim website in the interim.

 

In the meantime Packlink have now told me they have issued me a refund for postage and £25 compensation which I have rejected. I will take this as part payment for the claim. Hopefully this won't affect my claim if there are any discrepancies between the letter before claim and the final claim letter.

 

eBay have also now tried to take money from me (after saying they had already taken it) but i have blocked them from doing so from the bank.

 

----

 

Hi 

Thank you for getting in touch regarding the recent parcel delivery reference XXX
 
I am very sorry to hear that the contents of the parcel you sent did not arrive with your customer, and I can imagine how disappointing this was for both you and your recipient.
  
Unfortunately, Hermes can only explore the possibility of compensation with the party who contracted us with the safe delivery of your parcel, which in this case was Packlink. I advise you to escalate this claim with them directly, as the shipping label was purchased through them.

You are within your legal right to take any action you think is required, however as previously advised we have not refused your right to claim but rather we have asked you to go through the service you booked your parcel through, as they will be able to assist you further regarding this.. I can completely understand your frustration and I sincerely apologise for the inconvenience this may be causing you.

If you need anything in the future, please contact your Hermes Customer Service Team and we’ll be happy to help.
 
Kind regards,



Hermes Customer Services
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you do not accept anything from packlink....they are not your defendant.

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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If they make a payment to you and it is unconditional – in other words it is not in full and final settlement then there is no problem accepting it and continuing with your claim against Hermes.

On the other hand, if the payment is made in settlement of any claims then absolutely, you should reject it.

 

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Ok, I have rejected it but they paid it in anyway - their note to me below for full context.

 

Just for clarity, should I adjust the claim amount I'm seeking from Hermes now to take into account the below payment? Or is that just up to me? I wouldn't want them to weasel out of it by saying I've already been paid some money by Packlink

 

---

 

The compensation claim for the tampering of the shipment xxx in favour of Steve C has been accepted as a goodwill gesture. Please kindly consult our Packaging instructions for future parcels as the packaging must comply with our guidelines. 

 

⚠️ CONCEPT AMOUNT PAID VIA 
Goods Compensation £25  PayPal 
Postage cost refund £ 3.80+VAT Same payment used to pay the label 


The compensation will be paid to the account you have indicated in your claim form as below.
 

Account PayPal  
Postage cost refund (credit card or PayPal) We will be using the same payment method used to pay for the label


With this settlement letter, all future legal obligations against us are satisfied.

The customer shall be deemed to notify to PACKLINK SHIPPING, S.L. if proceeds, the fact that lost shipment has been located and to refund the compensation paid by PACKLINK SHIPPING, S.L. In the event of such a breach, PACKLINK reserves the right to take legal proceedings against you, in order to recover the above concepts.
Thanks for the cooperation.

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Quote

Dear XXX

Reference number XXX

Thank you for the payment of £XX which you have unilaterally decided to pay into my account.

Just to confirm that it has been your own decision and that I am still intending to proceed against Hermes although I will adjust my claim to reflect the down payment that you have made against the larger debt.

Yours sincerely

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi team,

 

Monday is claim day. I am using the Money Claim Service to do so, and have filled out both the summary 'why you believe you're owed the money' and the particulars of claim 'claim details timeline'. Any feedback welcome.

 

thank you

 

 

Why you believe you’re owed the money:

On 30/10/2021 I used Hermes to send a parcel containing a new iPad Pro. Reference number XXX.

 

While the parcel did arrive at its destination, the iPad Pro was missing from the package as it was stolen in transit. As acknowledged by Packlink on 9th November, and I quote

 

‘After completing the investigation with the carrier [Hermes] the shipment has been confirmed as subject to tampering’. The theft has been reported to the police. Crime reference number xxxx

 

This was purchased via 3rd parties (Hermes via eBay packlink) but I am pursuing Hermes as I am entitled to do under the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties Act ) 1999). To date Hermes has refused to reimburse me the value of the missing item despite repeated requests to do so.

Claim details

Timeline of what happened

Change 

timeline of what happened

30/10/2021

I purchased a Hermes delivery service to send a new iPad Pro with the reference number: XXXXXXXXX. This service was purchased via eBay Packlink.

Change 

30/10/2021

01/11/2021

A Hermes courier collected the package from my home address.

Change 

01/11/2021

05/11/2021

The parcel was delivered, but the iPad Pro had been stolen in transit. This was reported to Packlink on the same day along with photographic evidence of the tampering of the package.

Change 

05/11/2021

08/11/2021

I received an email from Packlink stating the following: "After completing the investigation with the carrier [Hermes] the shipment has been confirmed as subject to tampering"

Change 

08/11/2021

21/11/2021

I logged the theft with police, who subsequently provided me with crime reference number: XXXXXX

Change 

21/11/2021

21/11/2021

I contacted Hermes directly in order to make a claim for the value of the item under The Contract (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999. Hermes declined to reimburse me.

Change 

21/11/2021

27/11/2021

I responded with a letter before claim, clearly stating that I would issue a county court claim against Hermes in 14 days and without any further notice unless they reimbursed me in full before that date. I also warned that I would be seeking both interest and court fees in addition to my total loss. Hermes again declined to reimburse me.

Change 

27/11/2021

13/01/2021

14 days have elapsed without any further communications or payments from Hermes, so I submitted this claim.

Change


 

Edited by dx100uk
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I've added the reference number – in red because I think it ought to be stated at the outset.

They are crazy even bothering to defend this.

When it goes to mediation I suggest that you give up nothing – not a single penny and insist on the interest.

There is 100% no way they can win this and you should not give an inch.

 

If they tell you they are prepared to go to court then go along with it. Go to court. It is impossible that they will win.

Make sure you recover all the interest. This has been going on since January and it is disgraceful

It's outrageous that they are wasting the time of the courts – which is funded by the taxpayer on this.

Hermes is a dishonest and abusive company. If they think this is defamatory then they know where to find me.

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

They will have acknowledge service with an intention to defend all.....which then extends the claim by a further 14 days....33 days from date of submission

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group The National Consumer Service

 

If you want advice on your Topic please PM me a link to your thread

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi everyone, hope you had a good Christmas.

 

Plot twist - Packlink have now said they will refund the money for the item. I had been continuing to pester them on the side after hearing someone else had some success on here. But I had stopped after submitting the claim.

 

Good news overall,  though now I have paid the £70 Money Claim fee. Any advice on getting this back - presumably from Hermes as part of the process? Or will they now say that they are not liable as I have received the money from elsewhere - costing me £70 in the process?

 

Any advice appreciated!

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Please check back for a reply tomorrow

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Hi there, happy new year! Just wondering if you had any updated advice for me - your help is much appreciated. For full context their email that frames the return of money to me is below.

 

If I've lost the money for the claim then that's frustrating, but still not the end of the world. I had read on here that it pays to be persistent with packlink so at there very least this shows they do pay up. Though I don't know if launching the claim kicked Hermes into gear to sorting this them.

 

----

 

We would like to inform you that your case has been reviewed and accepted for full compensation as a goodwill gesture. 25GBP has already been paid and the the rest of the item value 601.99 GBP will be paid on the 30/12/2021

The compensation claim for loss/damage of the shipment in favour of xxx has been accepted. 

 

⚠️ CONCEPT AMOUNT PAID VIA 
Goods Compensation £601.99  PayPal 
Postage cost refund £ 3.80  Has been refunded 

 

 

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Sorry I'm not sure what you are asking here.

I understand from what you've posted that they have now agreed to refund you in full – is this correct?

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Absolutely you should get your £70 back.

Just continue and when it eventually comes to the mediation, point out that you had reimbursement of most of it but because you were driven to sue them, there is now £70 outstanding and if they won't pay it then you will go to judgement.

Keep an eye on your account and when you get the money back, then also write to Packlink and thank them for the money but tell them that the matter hasn't been sorted out and that the claim still stands and you will be enforcing judgement against Hermes for the outstanding balance if necessary.

Tell them that if they want to save money in future then they ought to do things more quickly

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