VCS/ELMS PCN PAPLOC now claimform - No Stopping - John Lennon Liverpool Airport

[Flamjam]

Hi again, 

 

with the CPR31:14 request, for my case would it just be 3 things I’m requesting?

1. Contract between vcs and landowner 

2. proof of planning permission for signage

3. Copies of NTD/NTK & other correspondence 

 

thanks 

[dx100uk]

send it as is

they never reply anyway.

 

dx

 

[Flamjam]

Hi again, 

 

quick update, 

 

today I have received an evidence pack in the post from ELMS LEGAL

[dx100uk]

scan everything yo one mass PDF please 

read our upload guide carefully

[Flamjam]

ive attached the evidence pack, hopefully ive done it correct

 

CPR Return .pdf

[dx100uk]

ive removed lots of duplicates in the pdf

check its all there please.

 

[Flamjam]

It’s all there, and thanks for removing duplicates

[dx100uk]

a long way ahead

if you look at JLA no stopping claimform threads that are at the WS stage, you will see that contract has been ripped apart already.

 

[Flamjam]

Thanks, I’ll have a read through them, I have until 3rd December to file my defence.

[dx100uk]

std 3-5 line generic non give away defence ......post it here 1st.

 

[Flamjam]

Defence :

 

1. No keeper liability as this is not “relevant land” under the POFA 2012 and I the defendant puts it to strict proof that VCS show as to who was the driver at the time.

2. No contract was ever offered by VCS, land is subject to own byelaws and signage is prohibitive so there can be no monies due as a result of either a contractual charge or as a result of a breach of contract.

 

is that enough?

[FTMDave]

No!

 

Not because what you've written is wrong - it isn't - but because it's best to keep Simple Simon in the dark about how you are going to bat off his claim.

 

Look at

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/393251-received-a-court-claim-from-a-private-parking-speculative-invoice-how-to-deal-with-it-hereupdated-jun-2021/

 

and then scroll down to

 

Q2) How should I defend?

 

Adapt the defence there.

 

The more you read up on VCS "no stopping" airport threads here the more you'll educate yourself on what needs to be done.

[Flamjam]

1.  It is admitted that Defendant is the recorded keeper of xxxxxxx

 

2.   As held by the Upper Tax Tribunal in Vehicle Control Services Limited v HMRC [2012] UKUT 129 (TCC), any contract requires offer and acceptance.  The Claimant was only contracted to provide car park management services and is not capable of entering into a contract with the Defendant on its own account, as the car park is owned by and the terms of entry set by the landowner.  Accordingly, it is denied that the Claimant has authority to bring this claim.  The proper claimant is the landowner

 

3.  It is denied that the Defendant breached any terms and conditions set on private land.

 

4.  It is denied that the Defendant entered into a contract with the Claimant, or broke any such contract.

 

5.  The Particulars of Claim is denied in its entirety.  It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief at all.

 

do I need to be more specific about the PoC or leave that for WS?

[honeybee13]

That looks like a good start, Flamjam. I expect the forum regulars will be along to advise later.

 

HB

[FTMDave]

That's fine Flamjam.

 

Well done on reading up and understanding the legal arguments against Simon (post 39).  That will stand you in good stead later on when you prepare your WS.

[Flamjam]

Hi again all, 

 

quick update..

 

last week I received the N180 directions questionnaire forms to be completed by 23rd December.. 

Also today I received a letter from VCS advising me that ELMS Legal are no longer acting on their behalf, also offering me a chance to settle for £185 within 14 days

 

1. Do I complete the forms and send via email or post?

2. What do I do with the letter from VCS? 
Thanks

[dx100uk]

in 2 weeks youve not even bothered too nor have been self helping?....You only need read just about any other pcn claimform thread....

 

On 30/11/2021 at 00:48, FTMDave said:

 

The more you read up on VCS "no stopping" airport threads here the more you'll educate yourself on what needs to be done.

 

 

[Andyorch]

 

[Flamjam]

Hi again all, 

 

quick update.

received letter today stating my claim hearing will be on 11 May 2022 at 10:00am. Partied shall by 4pm on the 23 February 2022 file at court and serve on each other. Claimant has until 4pm on 13 April 2022 to pay trial fee.

 

I’ll get my WS drafted and uploaded shortly

[Flamjam]

hi all, 

 

Ive uploaded a quick draft of my WS, could you please have quick scan over it, and advise of any changes needed, i've not added any exhibits yet

 

Thanks

WS VCS-min.pdf

[FTMDave]

I'm at work at the moment but promise to have a look over it late this evening.

 

Have you checked if Simple Simon has paid the hearing fee?  If not, give the court a quick ring.

[Flamjam]

44 minutes ago, FTMDave said:

 

Have you checked if Simple Simon has paid the hearing fee?  If not, give the court a quick ring.

Thanks, and fee not due to be paid until 13 April 

[FTMDave]

Doh!

 

Why had I read it as 13 February?

[FTMDave]

What you've written is great, you've researched excellently.

 

Personally I would tweak it and put headings for the various sections so the judge will see instantly the legal arguments you're making.  That can be done a bit later.

 

What I think is more of a problem is that you jump from one legal argument to another and back again.  The arguments should be grouped

 

1-4 , leave as they are

5, concerns keeper liability

5.1, 5.2, 6, concerns prohibition

5.3, concerns bye-laws

7, 7.1, 7.2, 7.3, 7.4, 7.5, concern locus standi

From 8 to the end is fine.

 

Please do some of this moving around and then we can tweak further.

[brassnecked]

Yes rearranging as per FTMDaves suggestion is logical, it stops the Judge having to go backwards and forwards through the WS like a grasshopper, puts it all nice and linear.