Warm front Grant

[Nicky321]

My parents applied for a Warm Front Grant and were approved.

On Monday 20th Nov the plumber arrived with an apprentice and began work, they worked Monday and Tuesday they worked from 10am – 4pm, on Wednesday 11.30 – 1.30pm and were called to another job. Thursday they worked 9am – 4pm and Friday 9am – 7pm. The apprentice only accompanied the plumber on about 3 days and didn’t do much apart from supposedly observe and do labour work! On Saturday 25th November the plumber arrived with a colleague unannounced at approximately 12pm and worked until about 8pm. Monday 27th the plumber arrived at 10am and finished 7pm heating installation was complete. The plumber informed them that the electrician would be coming within a week to complete the timer switch for the boiler. Shortly after they noticed the bathroom radiator valve had not been sealed properly and this resulted in water escaping. On Monday 4th December my parents rang to notify them that now there was at least 3 leaks on different radiators and the person who he spoke to tried to put them through to the right department but it was busy and told them they would ring back….. They didn’t. My parents rang again and was told they had been very busy and unable to ring back, anyway a plumber was notified and came that afternoon to stop the leaks, and informed my parents that an electrician would be coming on Thursday 7th. The plumber rang his boss and told them that my parents were going to put in a complaint and he then passed on the number of his boss over to them. My parents rang this number and it went through to an answer phone and they left a message for him to contact them as soon as possible, this call was never returned. On the morning of the 7th, they received a phone call to say the electrician was off work ill and they would have to reschedule for Tuesday 12th December.

The plumber who came on 4th was amazed at the way my parents home had been left, there was black oily water marks, and solder left on the carpets, they had emptied the radiators over their paved front garden leaving the white and pink paving stones black! (which my parents have tried to clean to no avail). Carpets had been put back over debris caused by their drilling (they didn’t sweep up). The pipes in the lounge where left uncovered because they would have to order the pipe cover material, they had been left with no heat apart from a gas fire (which was no use as the workers constantly left all the doors open), and they were left without hot water for over 9 days.

It is now 18 days since this work was started and it is still not complete.

This has caused them considerable distress and inconvenience which they can do without, as they are pensioners and not in the best of health.

My questions? Is there a letter anywhere that I can copy to put in their complaint? Has anyone else had similar problems with these schemes?

[nat]

There was an article on BBC's Watchdog about this scheme annd the shoddy workmanship a couple of weeks ago. Here is the link to it which may be of some help BBC - Consumer - TV and radio - Warm Front

[laineynic]

Warm front are a shambles.

 

Workmen turn up to my home to do the Wall insulation - I had a lean to outside and they told me "can't go anywhere near that you'll have to remove it before we start.

 

I told them sorry but I can't remove it, it's attached to the house. They climbed back in the van and of they went. They sent a surveyor round and he said that they could of done it but the shed needed to be emptied.

 

They came back 4 weeks later unannouced, I had just come out of hospital after having a cyst removed from my kidney. I told them I hadn't empited the shed as I didn't know they were coming. They sadi that if I didn't empty the shed they would cancel the job and I would be back to square one.

 

They climbed back in there van whilst I emptied the shed. I was in agony.

They eventually got on with the job - one of the workmen knocked on the door and said I have to fit a vent in your living room. He then began drilling a hole right by my living room door for everyone to see. it was a eyesore. There were marks all over the carpet from there boots. Dust everywhere, my next door neighbour came round shouting at me because they had troden over her garden and covered her windows in foam. It looked like a snow storm. When my husband got home he was furious.

 

We rang the office and got an answering machine. We wrote a letter amd eventually we spoke to someone. Most apologetic about it all and claimed they had rung our home number written to tell us when they would be there. No way!!!

 

We then had a new bolier fitted - young lad turned up he looked about 14 - chewed gum all the time he was in my house. His mobile phone was fixed to his ear. Could't wait to get out of my house. Seemed like he needed to be somewhere in a hurry. certainly not at my house. He never even cleaned up after himself.

 

After a few weeks we noticed that there was a draft from behind the boiler so we rang Warm front and left a message and left a message. After 6 months of trying to get them to respond we called in a proper plumber. He told us that the boiler was not as big as the one they had removed and that there was a gap between the wall and the boiler. hence the draft. He said it was nothing to worry about but we should get the installer back to sort it out. So we tried.

 

We moved out of that house 2 months ago and left the problem with the new owners.

 

Home front would never ask them again bunch of cowboys.

 

Citi settled =£252

Monument settled = £253

Capital 1 settled = £295

GMAC ERC = £1811.13

Lloyds Tsb = Moneyclaim form sent for £1343 4th Dec 2006

[warmfrontfan]

Beware of WarmFront / Eaga plc / Iguana.

Gas heating system installed, gas meter left hanging off wall, 2 unsoldered joints above it! a DEATH TRAP.

if you know any vulnerable people receiving these installations, for God's sake check the work for them before switching on.

it has taken WF about a year to even get this far. the company seems to be run for the benefit of its managers, certainly the installers arent happy enough to do a good job.

i doubt this is an isolated incidence. if you experience anything like this, switch it off and report it to CORGI straight away, else 2008 could go with a bang for you...

[JOSH_IOU]

Subscribing ...

[tifo]

i've had this only last week. Absolutely wonderful job, polite guys, cleaned up everywhere and even did some extra plumbing work for nothing (must have been the chicken curry Mrs makes).

 

i chose my own boiler (didn't want the Ideal brand they install), extra few radiators, chose wireless controllers (first lot faulty, they came round and fitted new set), chose extra thermostats. Didn't need anything else as a new build house.

 

they still made good money out of me though from Eaga.

[SOD'EM]

Looks like my dad (who is a pensioner also) may have had a lucky escape.

 

He too has been accepted for a Warm Front grant, but when the surveyor came round. He said my dad would have to pay to get his lead pipes changed to copper before they will start. He cannot afford to do that so it may be a blessing in disguise.

 

It would have been nice to have central heating for him though as he only has a gas fire for a three bedroom house.

 

Never mind.

[fiddlestix]

Hello sod'em I have just found this site by chance, as I wanted to see if anyone was complaing about warm front. I was mortified to read about your dad having no proper heating, so felt the need to respond tho' a bit late. When this warm front scheme first started, I was not elligable for it, but a relation of mine was and I put him in the right direction. He, like your Dad only had heating in his front room, so he applied for the grant. The full central heating system was installed, plus loft insullation, plus wall insullation,( plus new windows, but they may have been a different gov.grant) I was so pleased for him that at last he had a few home comforts.... A few years later, - now 2008 I too was able to to apply for a grant up £2700, any work that the grant did not cover, I would have to pay the extra and it would be carried out within six weeks of them receiving that money. I was allocated a new combi boiler only. (my heating system and radiators are over 35 years old and only one radiator downstairs) I accepted that, thinking, well for one boiler plus parts I should be well within the gov.grant. No, I had a letter to say that warmfront wanted just under £600 before they would order the boiler and parts to do the work. I sent the cheque off and waited.... and waited.... and waited, my response to phone calls was excuses... excuses...excuses.. now more than 6 weeks later and after a lot of anxiety and hearing/reading negative feedbacks from other warmfront customers, I have cancelled.. I expect my cheque back shortly (and was also told that I could wait up to a month for it... company policy!) I hope your Dad gets the grant/heating he rightly deserves and I do hope that someone somewhere can stop this monopoly of champagne handouts to warmfront whilst they give a lemonade service to those who are entitled to a better deal.

[mnaseer]

Hi all..

 

I have been approved for a warm front grant an engineer came out had a look and said ok fine the boiler can be fitted where the previous one was (it was an old emersion heater).. around 2/3 months later I received a call to say someone was coming to fit on Monday which is today.. so I booked the day off and stayed in.. two chaps turned up had a little look and after scractching their heads stated that the boiler can not be fitted where It was supposed to due to regulation etc.. I have moved one of the kitchen units and they will be coming out tomorrow to fit it now... Can I ask is their any way to get a breakdown of what they do so I can assure they are not fleecing the tax payer, by spreading out the days! also can I ask what they do in terms of the old boiler and pipework as none of this has been mentioned.

 

Cheers

[vandermerwe]

Pity Warm Front don't employ Polish plumbers.

 

We had some oik come from 60 miles away only to tell me he couldn't touch our system as the boiler was "too big".

 

Pressed for further details he muttered something about BTUs. Asked what that was in kW he took out a calculator and announced '65 Kw'.

 

That would be almost sufficient to heat the local prison let alone a Victorian terraced house!

 

Clearly nothing there for us.

 

Vandermerwe

[MHBLimited]

I have had soooo manny people email me with Eaga/Warmfront complaints and wanting to know what to do i have been sending out these details:~

 

If your Boiler is being replaced upon the ‘Warm Front ‘scheme I don’t think you get a choice in what is installed and it's an Ideal!

This explains the high rate of breakdowns from Eaga customers.

If the boiler replacement is just through Eaga’s heating engineers you should be able to choose what you like.

 

The problem with Ideal boilers isn’t that they won’t work initially but they have a high percentage of faults after the first year.

The 2 main Boilers manufactures in the UK that I would only recommend is the Vaillant and the Worchester (bosch).

 

If you are tied to the ideal boiler it could be worth kicking up a fuss at the moment and requesting an alternative.

Unfortunately, Eaga have a stranglehold over just about everything to do with home heating grants and are not doing a very good job.

 

I have included 2 email address that have been useful in the past when dealing with Eaga they are governing bodies and will be able to assist you.

 

Trading standards are always worth informing and can give legal advise toohttp://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/

Ofgem is the official regulator of gas and electric energy www.ofgem.gov.uk/

 

If you decide not to use Eaga than please give me a call at **EDIT** and we will arrange it for you.

However if your boiler replacement does go ahead we supply a Boiler Maintenance Cover named BoilerGuard.

Edited February 16, 2010 by citizenB
Removed telephone number, sorry not permitted

[PriorityOne]

I had a Warm Front Grant about 2 years ago now when on Benefits and have no compaints at all about the boiler (touch wood ).... so it seems a bit hit and miss as to who turns up to survey/fit it, etc.

 

Just as a point of interest though, I was some £600 over the Grant figure and the surveyor suggested that I contacted the council to make up the shortfall; apparently they have a department that deals with shortfalls on these Grants (he wasn't meant to tell me that though).

 

I 'phoned the department and someone came round to assess the paperwork I'd been given and so on. They then contacted Eaga/Iguana and asked for a full breakdown of how they'd reached their figure and because Eaga/Iguana were unable to provide a reasonable explanation.... they ended up reducing their figure by the £600 in order to keep the work in line with the maximum WF Grant figure I was given.

 

There was also some reluctance by Iguana to deal with the asbestos flue that they were going to leave open and exposed in my kitchen after the work had been done to fit the new boiler and flue in my garage. The council told them that leaving the flue open would be a serious H&S risk and ordered them to fill it at no extra cost.... because it was in fact part of the job.... which they came back to do a short while later.

 

So.... it looks like people are having to stand their ground for all kinds of reasons, but not necessarily for the same ones. My advice to anyone facing a shortfall though, is to approach your local council for assistance.

 

[citizenB]

MHB, sorry have had to edit out your telephone details. Not permitted as per site rules.

[cerberusalert]

The problem with Ideal boilers isn’t that they won’t work initially but they have a high percentage of faults after the first year.

I find that strange, I have had an Ideal Classic for the past 10 years & there has never been a fault other than me having to pressurize the expansion tank once and change the the inline tap on the filling loop. I doubt very much whether this is an exception to the norm because the local council used the exact same boiler when they refurbished 4000 properties and if there is a problem such as you mention, I would think it would be public knowledge locally.

[MHBLimited]

Don't get me wrong Ideal still make good boilers but compared to Vaillant and Worchester, Ideal Struggle to get in the top 20. this is information received by the consumer watchdog 'WHICH'.

 

Ideal is owned by Eaga who run the WarmFront Scheme which explains why they have a monopoly through the council projects.

 

The Ideal Boiler will do but it's not the best and could explain the high amount of complaints, recalls, and call outs, Shouldn't the council and goverment run scheme use the best products?

[cerberusalert]

If that's the case how come Ideal are the only company in its field to have achieved ‘World Class Manufacturer’ Accreditation in the prestigious IBM and London Business School UK manufacturing survey and is the leading supplier in the commercial & industrial boiler sector?

[MHBLimited]

Good point but the US have completely diffrent regulation to the UK and most Ideal boilers aren't even band A.

The europian boilers have much higher standards and are what ideal base their designs on.

[MHBLimited]

The Ideal classic is one of the best boiler they have ever made.

But the response that replaced it was bad with heat exchangers breaking and having no spare parts for it either.

[PriorityOne]

The Ideal classic is one of the best boiler they have ever made.

But the response that replaced it was bad with heat exchangers breaking and having no spare parts for it either.

 

Happy days ahead then.... ..... although mine's now in its 3rd year and no probs. so far. However, the wall timer that was fitted is "moody"..... and I've also just had to replace the heat exchange valve that regulates heat/hot water in the house.

 

Did expect more life from those parts, to be honest.... but hey ho.

[lss017]

I had a Warm Front Grant about 2 years ago now when on Benefits and have no compaints at all about the boiler (touch wood ).... so it seems a bit hit and miss as to who turns up to survey/fit it, etc.

 

Just as a point of interest though, I was some £600 over the Grant figure and the surveyor suggested that I contacted the council to make up the shortfall; apparently they have a department that deals with shortfalls on these Grants (he wasn't meant to tell me that though).

 

I 'phoned the department and someone came round to assess the paperwork I'd been given and so on. They then contacted Eaga/Iguana and asked for a full breakdown of how they'd reached their figure and because Eaga/Iguana were unable to provide a reasonable explanation.... they ended up reducing their figure by the £600 in order to keep the woin line with the maximum WF Grant figure I was given.

 

There was also some reluctance by Iguana to deal with the asbestos flue that they were going to leave open and exposed in my kitchen after the work had been done to fit the new boiler and flue in my garage. The council told them that leaving the flue open would be a serious H&S risk and ordered them to fill it at no extra cost.... because it was in fact part of the job.... which they came back to do a short while later.

 

So.... it looks like people are having to stand their ground for all kinds of reasons, but not necessarily for the same ones. My advice to anyone facing a shortfall though, is to approach your local council for assistance.

 

 

 

Hi

 

Just would like to add about Egar my mother had here heating system install many years ago by egar and it worked for years without any problems. So, I thought it was not until last year that I had cause to say at my mums for the evening and tried to have a hot shower. That was a laugh. It was a case of 30 seconds of hot water then cold the rest of the time. I asked how long this had been happening and she said a few months ofter is had been installed. Don't get me wrong when we visited her he heating was alway on and it was like a hot house. I just thought that she was cold all the time. So, I called EGAR and told them the problem and then they said that we would have to wait 6 months for a visit to put this right. Well, we waited and waited and waited and waited this was in April 09 fianlly Oct 09 we got a letter saying an engineer will be calling on the 10 November to assess the boiler etc. The came but this engineer was not an engineer just a cleck who fill out paperwork in there terms a breakdown report. They wrote no hot water but had heating. Then we got a call asking if we had complete the simple test to ckeck about the hot water. I told them that my mother is 80 years old had no cares and lives on her own can't see very well. So, how do you expect her to do that. In the end they said they would send out an plumer. They did what a was of time I got a lecture on how a boiler works and was told it was a sensor that was not working. An hour later the heat went off completely and so did the water. This was when the snow was on the ground in Janurary. Phone them right away explained they said they could not get anyone there until the following thursday. That was almost a week that an 80 year was without heating and water. I had to buy heaters and a very large kettle. Then a week later another plumer appeared this time he was wearing the EGAR uniform. He pulled the boiler to pices. I just show him shaking his head all the time. I asked him what was wrong. He looked very pale and said if this boiler had kept on working long then the hour it had who ever was in the house would have been blown up. The work that last plumer had done was with old parts form other boilers that should not have been used. had turned up the gas so that it was as its highest to make sure some water was heated. The guy was not pleased and asked if we kept the paperwork from the other plumer. We gave it to him he call there office and had a conversation. While on the phone he asked if there was some parts in stock. When he finished he said that he would be about an hour before he returned with some parts. Sure enough he did come back but could not get all the parts. It would be another day or two before the main part arrives would it be alright to come along and fit it. The following day he came back fitted the part turned down the gas etc and now for the first time in a few years my mother has a hot shower every night. The point I am trying to make is that EGAR do have some right cowboys working for them but get the main plumer/engineers and you get a briliant service.

[hmeah]

Hi,

 

Is it possible to choose a different boiler via the installation company or EAGA?

 

My father got the offer, the Warm front engineer came down and recommeded the whole system be changed, we then had another engineer come down from Glowarm, who said they will replace the currently boilder with a Ideal Icos HE15 boiler. having read the reviews and stories on the interest I hear this is not a good one, how do i arrange for another one to be installed, i don't mind putting some money towards it to ensure my dad gets a decent boiler that will not let him down when needed the most!

 

also, the warm front people recommended that I get a radiator install in the hallway as the old one is missing, nothing of this is now mentioned in the engineers report.

 

what to do? should i speak to the installation company (glowarm) or warm front?

 

please advise...

[tifo]

Is it possible to choose a different boiler via the installation company or EAGA?

 

Hi, Yes it is. Ask them to give a list of which ones you can choose. They should have Ideal, Baxi and Vaillant and any of the last two are good.

 

You are the one paying them and you need to get what you want and not what they want to give you. They will listen to you otherwise they lose the grant money.

[Jake Maverick]

Getting beyond desperate here. I've written several detailed emails on it to other 'watchdogs' in the hope of getting soemthing done about it, but to no avail. I'll try and give you some brief highlights below but i you want the more detailed ones please just ask!

 

 

 

I think part of the problem here is that I am not the house 'owner'.

 

 

My father is disabled, both parents suffering from cancer. Short version is they received a grant to have the central heating boiler replaced. They completely wrecked the house, did a lot of other damage and the cntral heating still not working nearly a year later now. They also refused to put the floorboards baack down or rebuild the airing cupboard....minor point but my father would have been trapped downstairs for the last ten months if I was not here to rectify the problem. So cold over the winter he was in danger of dying, seriously.

 

 

They also put mortar down the sink, totally blocking it up- I have partially fixed it (sinks are just about usable now) but will be a very expensive job to fix properly as i believe the consevatory now needs demolishing and the drains digging out. I believe it was deliberate.

 

 

 

It's possible they nicked stuff as well, but with charging about the house, throwing computers and other equipment about and knocking the TV over, hell of a lot of incidental damage. It was my TV, but virtualy 'new' to me....I was also threatened with a blow torch and a wrench, possibly provoked by the fact that I asked one of them to STOP going into bedrooms without permission. That psyscopath also kicked the dog as well (in the head, when he thought I wasn't looking), couple of times...just for enjoyments sake....the kind of weirdo that likes to pull wings off flies and boil frogss alive.....he shouldn't even be allowed to go near people! It took over six months before the company involved agreed to send anybody out at all. None of them have had a particularly helpful attitude and a couple did more minor damage to the property, again for no discernible reason 'cept to annoy us (like writing/ scribbling on the walls and jump about on one leg repeatedly kicking the stair lift and the dog?). Although apparently a large company they seem to have employed a whole bunch of inexperienced/ immature young people fresh out of training....if the surveyor had actually done the survey he would have known that it was a one pipe system here and we would not have had half of the problems....that is fraud I think, conning the govt agency involved into paying the grant, then trying to bill them for many thousands more to 'rectify' the damage they have caused...obviously the grant peopel are not interested in doing anything about that (I know all about the backhanders, I used to work in the back office at different other govt agencies)! I think we're talking in the region of 20K just to knock down, dig out the drains and rebuild the conservatory again.

 

 

 

I had just finished redecorating/ renovated the entire house....so i was not happy when my parents ssuddenly decided to repalce the heating few months after i finished....now every room needs decorating again. In addition to that damage to furniture and virtually braand new leather sofas which my gran bought them shortly before she passed last year it has also cost them well over two thousands pounds haing the boiler running at maximum for nearly a year- probably more with all the electric heaters on! With the sinks backking up it's also wrecked the kitchen cupbaaordunder the sink. My parents aren't inclined to try and do anything about it, I'm ashamed of them for that and many other reasons....and I can do owt as my name isn't on the deeds and other reasons. Now in danger of losing their house because of it.......and I 've had many weeks hard labour putting the house back to a liveable state. I'm not disabled but I do have 'problems'- so heavy, sustained reasonably hard manual labour is a problem....trouble walking for a while.

 

 

 

Private company subcontractor that keps changing their name every few months, done on a grant from govt. So immunity from prosecution....

 

 

Latest news is that apparently another company has become involved (I suspect it's the same one) and have now managed to bully my parents into doing what they had threatened to do previously. Namely white plastic/ industrial style columns in each and every room, to hide all the new pipework they're going to put in. There had been thaat threat previously but only in the hallwaay and it was also agreed that they wdn't use the white plastic truncting (despite the threats of being stabbed in the eye with the pen) and they wd leave the boxing for me to do in wood, at my own expense of course. Now it seems when they implement this threat i will not only all have to be ripped out aat some point, but redone in the existing boxing in and i'm also going to have a lot more deccorating and ceiling replastering to do....refusing to even comment on the conservatory problem and other damage!

 

It's disgusting that they can get away with ripping off taxpayers money whilst ripping off two old disabled people in the processs and completely trashing their house. It's already cost them well in excess of £2K and me probably a similar amount in time and expenses. I'm trying to get one of the consumer TV watchdog type programmes involved now....but I have no wish to appear on TV. Afraid we don't have any money...so even if I could get 'legally' involved suing isn't an option.

 

I am also a 'target' so suspect that cameras and other monitroing devices at least have also been fitted to the house. You ever wonder how g-men get those cameras in under RIPA without the victims knowing?

 

I think I'm going to end up going to prison over it, seriously...I'm at my wins end and if they wanna get violent again I will **** **** ****! Can't even get a proper name out of one....parents only really got themselves to blame for some of it, 'cept they blame me for some bizarre reason.....I mean who in their right mind would 'let' heavily armed lunatics into their home without knowing who they are? i.e. name and identification? They're like pigyobs...only way to get a name out of one is to kill one in self defence, what do you have to do to one to make them admit they're employed as a poolice officer or see some ID?

 

seriously I am curious, does anybody know?