caught using MIL's freedom pass - 50+ uses **RESOLVED**

[Jeboz]

I changed it a bit as you advised.

Add a part that he didn't know it is a criminal offence to use someone's card.

Do you think it is a good thing to include? Because it is true.

Also I am gonna include payment for oyster, and his dbs needed for the job. 

 

Bazza, no I didn't ask the solicitors specifically for enhanced dbs so this 1yr is probably for basic. 

I am aiming to send the letter on Monday so waiting for your last advice pls. 

Also do I send it to the same email as the 1st letter???? because now I have only court address in the court letter...

Thanks in advance!

 

Dear sir or madam,

I am writing to you again and I want to say that I deeply regret my actions which were completely out of character and as a result of stupidity. What I did was wrong and I am sorry for wasting staff time and I feel very shameful for my behaviour! I was not aware that it is a criminal offence to use someone else's oyster.

As a sole income earner for my family a criminal record would be devastating for me as my employment relies upon a clean criminal history. I work two jobs in order to meet ends. I do dry cleaning and security job. For my security job I need a clean enhanced DBS and if I get a criminal record it means I will not be able to work which will make my financial situation even harder.

I am a hard working man, with two small children (2 and 5 year old). My wife is not working as she is looking after the kids. I am also trying to support my sister in Pakistan (and her 2 children) who became a widow last year at age of 33!

I have been paying for my travel since that day and I am attaching a proof of it. It has been hard year for me with the pandemic and all. I pride myself on my integrity and honesty and this is my first ever offence of any legal matter. And it is surely the last!
I am asking TFL for an Out of court settlement meeting  all reasonable admin costs and payment for the journeys made.

Once again I deeply apologise,  I am very stressed and anxious about the situation and I really hope that you can show some leniency in this matter and this can be settled without a criminal record.

Please find attached a proof of my security job and the DBS that is required. Also statement showing my travel payments.

Yours faithfully,

[dx100uk]

any news?

dx

[Jeboz]

Been rejected so going to court now.

[dx100uk]

You can still try for ooc even in person to their rep on the day before you go in

 

we've had 2 resolved like that.

 

Dx

[Jeboz]

Thanks,

Will definitely try this as well but not much hope left.

Will update in January 

[honeybee13]

I think it's important that you turn up and show the court how remorseful you are. As dx says, you can speak to the prosecutor on the day and try to negotiate an OOC agreement. We've always said to expect to hand over cash for this.

 

HB

[Jeboz]

Sorry, but what means to "hand over cash for this"???? Do you mean to give extra cash straight to the prosecutor? Or is this that all fines need to be paid on the time and in full, in cash? Or anything else? Thx

[honeybee13]

Well, our member Old-CodJA has always said to take cash, have a read around. You would expect a receipt of course. 

 

HB

[BazzaS]

It means “If they offer an out of court settlement, you’d be expected to pay it in one go, so you can’t offer instalments”

It’d be for all the costs : the avoided fares, their court costs and admin expenses.

 

It also means they might not be able to take a cheque (what if it ‘bounced’?).

 

So, the best way for them to know any settlement sum has been paid is to go with cash to do so.

 

Just make it clear it is for if they offer an out of court disposal, and that you’ll ask for a receipt - the last thing you want to do when you are accepting you previously acted dishonestly is to inadvertently make it look like you are offering a bribe in cash!

Edited December 8, 2021 by BazzaS

[dx100uk]

jezbo, you say you are going to court

so you've got the court letter?

 

scan it up please!

read our upload guide carefully

 

has it also got a list of charges to be taken into consideration?

 

we need to see it please

[Manxman in exile]

15 hours ago, honeybee13 said:

I think it's important that you turn up and show the court how remorseful you are. As dx says, you can speak to the prosecutor on the day and try to negotiate an OOC agreement. We've always said to expect to hand over cash for this.

 

HB

 

5 hours ago, Jeboz said:

Sorry, but what means to "hand over cash for this"???? Do you mean to give extra cash straight to the prosecutor? Or is this that all fines need to be paid on the time and in full, in cash? Or anything else? Thx

 

@honeybee13  I'm sure I understand what you meant by your suggestion, but bearing in mind that english may not be the OP's first language, it is perhaps possible that they might completely misunderstand your suggestion and end up in more trouble!   

[honeybee13]

You could be right that it wasn't totally clear but dx clarified shortly afterwards. There are also examples of other threads on the forum, which the OP should have been looking at.

 

Apologies for any confusion.

 

HB

[Jeboz]

Thank you all for the "cash" explanations Not a native English speaker here, yes and it may become confusing But after the 1st person that explained it all made sense and clear now. I thought it was like this but as this is something completely new experience for me I wanted to be 100% sure what we are talking about.

 

Now about the court letter I have uploaded that long ago...I think November  

 

Now, also 1 more question just come to my mind. My husband requires STANDARD dbs for his security job. So it doesn't say ENHANCED. In case of criminal conviction how this is gonna affect it? Is it same 11 years as you mentioned before?

[dx100uk]

Sorry yes was on a small screen.

 

Funny how it says settle at the earliest, but wont allow ooc?

 

Dx

[Jeboz]

Happy new year everyone!

 

Thank you all for your help and guidance. Today was the court date and unfortunately he couldn't sort it OOC with the prosecutor. They fned him £600+ which is about 50% of the original total because they accept his apology.

 

He has now 7 days to pay.

I am not yet sure about the criminal record but will update if I have more information. 

 

Once again, thank you so much! 

[dx100uk]

not as bad an outcome as could have been then, bearing in mind it was +100 uses.

 

we have seen these not result in a criminal record too, he might have succeeded there too.

 

can he remember what the judge actually said?

if he said just pay the sum, without mentioning a record, then he might well be ok.

 

glad to have helped

 

dx

[Jeboz]

Yes, we also think it went well taking into consideration that he really did so much wrong. He did show how remorseful he is.

 

The judge said to him to pay in 7 days and they gave him a paper with the reference number for payment. 

 

When my husband asked about the criminal record they said to him that IT will show In the letter that he will receive in the next few days.

So we still don't have it.  Will update.

[munchcake]

Hi, could you please explain what the process of court was like for your husband? Did he try to ask for an out of court when he arrived or did he just go straight in and plead his case? 

[Jeboz]

He went there, it was very busy at the court.

 

His case was for 2pm but then it went on at around 4.

 

He spoke to the prosecutor to ask for OOC agreement but this was not accepted.

 

Then inside the Court they asked him questions about why he did it, he apologised and explained his situation and then the court gave him a letter with the amount he has to pay.

 

Hope that helps.

[munchcake]

 thank you for letting me know that sounds scary

[Jeboz]

Hello all,

We received the letter from the court.  I can't really understand what is the criminal conviction and if there is any. Is it usually showing in the letter? Thanks

 

notice of fine and collection order.pdf

[BazzaS]

The Criminal conviction (since this is a Magistrates' Court criminal case) is stated, as : (The offense of) "Enter a compulsory ticket area on the Transport for London regional railway network without a valid ticket."

 

This is a Byelaw offense [under Byelaw 17(1)  ],

https://content.tfl.gov.uk/railway-byelaws.pdf

so it remains to be seen if it 'recordable' (that is showing as a criminal conviction on:

a DBS check (standard disclosure) , and if not if it will show on an enhanced (eDBS) check.

 

If you aren't sure it won't show : better to disclose it e.g. for employment , as it is a minor offence, than risk being found not to have disclosed it.

 

For the purposes of any visa or residency applications (UK or abroad, such as the USA), better to disclose it, as it is a minor offence, than risk the more major offence of being seen to provide false information. So, I wouldn't risk traveling to the USA on an ESTA for example ..... safer to apply for and get a visa than risk being found to have made a false ESTA declaration.

Edited January 14, 2022 by BazzaS

[Jeboz]

Thank you!