Another stolen Hermes item - Razer laptop

[sussexbloke77]

• Nice laptop (c. £750 worth) sold on eBay
• Bought inpost shipping via packlink which of course ends up with Hermes
• No extra cover taken - silly boy, but reading this place maybe not?
• Arrives on Sunday, package tampered with and devoid of laptop

 

I have

• Pics of packaging on arrival, clearly tampered with
• Video of unboxing, showing it is indeed empty
• Doorbellcam footage of the delivery .. you can tell it's empty by the way it's being handled and also the tampered tape
• A crime reference number, in fact they already attended in person - good eh?
• Spoken to Ebay, who shot me over to packlink
• started claims process with packlink - they'll pay me £25 no doubt and send me on my way

 

Next steps:

• Wait for the £25, ask for the full amount, get knocked back
• Submit formal complaint, wait 2 weeks
• Submit letter of claim, wait 2 weeks, then submit money claim stuff (been through small claims court, to actual court in the end, so familiar with the process broadly)

 

Gaps for me:

• Who does the complaint / letter of claim go to?  Hermes? Packlink?  Inpost?  All 3?
• I get the bit of law that says it's Hermes fault regardless of which country the others hide in (rights of 3rd parties) but which bit says I should get my cash back because a criminal working for them stole my laptop and I shouldn't have to insure against that?

 

Many thanks, fantastic place you have here!  Love a fight   Pic of tampered parcel attached, not really OK for me to post the doorbell footage is it?

 

 

Oh and forgot to ask ... in the meantime do I refund the buyer via eBay?  Am I weakening my position in any way by doing this?

Thanks!

 

 

 

pix.pdf

[BankFodder]

Refund the buyer immediately. It's not the buyers fault and it is your responsibility and if you want good feedback then you ought to show maximum cooperation and goodwill.

In terms of the rest, it looks as if you have got it all off pat.

You already seem to understand that you will be suing Hermes – so why would you want to send the letter of claim to packlink?

The only step you've missed out is that you should make a formal complaint to Hermes. Do that now. Don't set a deadline but after about 10 days if you haven't heard anything or you've been knocked back then come back here.

Let's see a draft of your letter of claim – and also let's see a draft of your particulars of claim.

You've obviously done lots of reading – but keep on going. As probably lots more nuggets to pick up before you launch into action.

Also make sure that you understand the steps involved in taking a small claim in the County Court

[sussexbloke77]

Quote

Refund the buyer immediately. It's not the buyers fault and it is your responsibility and if you want good feedback then you ought to show maximum cooperation and goodwill.

 

Will do .. at first I was a bit suspicious until I googled   

 

Quote

You already seem to understand that you will be suing Hermes – so why would you want to send the letter of claim to packlink?

 

Because of this thread post:

Quote

The only step you've missed out is that you should make a formal complaint to Hermes. Do that now. Don't set a deadline but after about 10 days if you haven't heard anything or you've been knocked back then come back here.

 

..in my next steps, bullet 2.  I wait for claim rejection first?  I guess I've already got reason to be salty even before they ask me to go away.

 

Massive thanks for responding so quickly!!!   I will follow your advice and post drafts shortly.

 

OT but didn't want to create another thread so quickly .. I had an issue with a parcel that went walkies in December last year, they strung me along for months and I got my £25 back in May and was so exhausted I gave up right away.  This was DPD but it was basically incompetence, they tracked it around the place and then said it had been lost .. big box of hifi equipment - not exactly playing cards.  Can I go for that too?  Or too much time passed? Or is lost in this way simply not the same as theft en-route?

 

Cheers!

Adam

[BankFodder]

Start a separate thread for the DPD parcel.

The most important thing is the basis upon which you accepted the £25.

[sussexbloke77]

So sorry for the delay, life has been nuts.  Had some back and forth with Hermes and Packlink send me £25+postage but nothing fruitful - time for letter of claim.

 

My draft below and feedback appreciated!

 

Quote

Dear Sir/Madam,

LETTER OF CLAIM

Parcel reference number 5602797507082178

On 23/07/2021 I used your service to send a parcel under the above reference number.  This was purchased via 3rd parties (inpost via eBay packlink) but I am pursuing Hermes as the party that provided the end service (Rights of 3rd parties act 1999).

While the parcel did arrive at its destination, the item posted was missing from the package - lost/stolen in transit is the assumption.  The packaging was damaged and video footage shows handling of said package that supports the notion that the item was already missing on delivery.  This was reported under crime reference number SP-101582-21-0101-00.

Value of item to me = £654 (£750 was the sale price, fees are deducted from this)
Postage cost = £5.65
Packlink compensation =  £5.65 + £25 (standard compensation)
Total loss to (amount of claim) = £629

Value of item was declared at time of purchase automatically - as it was purchased via eBay/Packlink.

Hermes informed me that I should pursue Packlink for compensation (support reference 210726-008850) and that Rights of 3rd parties act did not apply as '..we are not able to deal with any companies bookings under Hermes, for delivery/collection, these companies all wish to to deal with all their own customer.'  Which is fundamentally incorrect and misleading.

Packlink informed I would not be entitled to further compensation as I chose not to pay an additional premium at time of postage.  I see this requirement as an unenforceable unfair term designed to exclude liability and to prevent me from taking a legal action.  Furtermore it is for Hermes (the end provider of service) to protect themselves against liability for their own negligence.

If I do not have reimbursement in full within 14 days then I shall issue a claim in the County Court to recover this money from you plus interest and without any further notice.

Yours faithfully

 

Many thanks again!!!

[BankFodder]

Presumably this is addressed to Hermes – correct?

[sussexbloke77]

Sorry, yes - Hermes

[BankFodder]

Quote

Dear Sir/Madam,

LETTER OF CLAIM

Parcel reference number 5602797507082178
 

On 23/07/2021 I used your service to send a parcel under the above reference number.  

While the parcel  did arrive at its destination, the item posted was missing from the package I am assuming that it has been stolen.

 

The theft has been reported to the police. Crime reference number  SP-101582-21-0101-00.

 

This was purchased via 3rd parties (inpost via eBay packlink) but I am pursuing yourselves as I am entitled to do under the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties Act ) 1999).

 

Value of item to me = £654 (£750 was the sale price, fees are deducted from this)
Postage cost = £5.65
Packlink compensation =  £5.65 + £25 (standard compensation)
Total loss to (amount of claim) = £629

 

You have so far declined to reimburse me and I am therefore informing you that I'm proposing to begin a county court claim against you within 14 days and without any further notice unless you reimburse me in full before that date.



Yours faithfully

 

[sussexbloke77]

Awesome, I always waffle.  Presumably I can keep the fact that they lied about 3rd party rights for the claim itself should it go to court?  Or is it just superfluous? 

 

Thanks!

[BankFodder]

If you have written evidence of it then it is extremely useful – but what they said is in fact evidence. It does not contribute to the fact of the case.

The facts of the case are and use simply that you sent the item, they lost it, they refuse to reimburse you.

When you prepare particulars of claim you plead facts. You don't plead evidence. Evidence is what you would adduce later on in order to prove the facts or to damage their credibility – in this case the latter.

[sussexbloke77]

In their email response to me they said, and I quote:

 

"In terms of your question regarding your 'Rights of third parties act 1999' we are not able to deal with any companies bookings under Hermes, for delivery/collection, these companies all wish to to deal with all their own customer."

 

Thanks for claification.  Particulars of claim are for the moneyclaim bit right?

 

 

 

 

[BankFodder]

Yes that's what particulars of claim are for.

I have to say that if you are asking that kind of question then you still have a lot of reading to do

[sussexbloke77]

Understood and appreciated, thank you

[Droony19]

I used [email protected] which got a response.

 

[sussexbloke77]

Sorry for the delay, I was emailing [email protected] and I was getting (slow) responses.  No use of course, but they did respond

[dx100uk]

thread tidied of unnecessary previous post quotes ...just type!!

[sussexbloke77]

Time to complete the moneyclaim part as there has been no response from Hermes.

 

Draft particulars of claim below

 

Quote

I used the defendant's courier service (albeit arranged via 3rd party but claiming against Hermes as per entitlement under rights of 3rd parties act) to deliver an item with value £654 (£750 less eBay fees) to a UK address.  Reference number 5602797507082178.  

 

The item was tampered with in transit and the contents (a laptop plus accessories) were stolen. 

 

The courier have refused to compensate as I did not pay for additional insurance.  Hermes requirement that the customer is responsible for insuring themselves against negligence/criminality of courier employees is unfair within the meaning of the Consumer Rights Act 2015. 

 

3rd party already refunded postage cost + £25 flat amount without my approval so I have excluded that from my claim amount.

 

I'm seeking £629 + interest + court fees of £70.

 

Let me know what you think, thank you!!

[BankFodder]

When does your letter of claim 14 day limit expire?

[sussexbloke77]

Today is 14th day ... 

[BankFodder]

Well I'm going to say that everything should have been ready by now. The whole claim should have been prepared and saved on the money claim website ready to click off.

 

I don't understand the costings in your particulars of claim. How much are you actually out of pocket?

[sussexbloke77]

"I'm seeking £629 + interest + court fees of £70."

 

...from my letter of claim to Hermes:

Value of item = £654 (£750 less eBay fees)

Postage = £5.65

Packink sent me £5.65 + £25

 

So my loss is £629 + interest + the £70 MCOL fee

 

Thanks!

 

[BankFodder]

What's the reference to the eBay fees?

[sussexbloke77]

Item sold for £750, but I only saw £654 of that after fees (what I actually lost out on).  I mention it becuase on eBay invoices etc.. the £750 is mentioned.  If it's not needed, I'll just declare the value as £654.

 

Thanks!

[BankFodder]

If it sold for £750 and you didn't get a reimbursement from eBay then that is how much you are out of pocket.

If you refunded the buyer, then why didn't eBay refund you the fees? I thought they normally do

[sussexbloke77]

I had my fees refunded.  I'm out of pocket £629