Backdoor Arrow/Drydens CCJ - old shopdirect CAT debt

[PrestonProblems]

I'm somewhat confused by a new letter. 

They sent a copy letter and copy of all payments and charges to this account from November 2008.

This debt they say is with Shop Direct(Choices) from April 1999.

The default date they advise was 4th November 2002. 

First interesting statement they make is due to the age of the account a copy of the Credit agreement is not available. 
The last token payment of £1 was on 25th September 2103. 

They insist that this account is subject to a CCJ, and they say their client(Arrow Global) are not obliged to provide a copy of the credit agreement as my liability has already been determined by the Court. They finish off by saying the file will be placed on hold for 21 days from date of their letter to await my repayment proposal.

If this CCJ was made in 2107 - why do I not know about it?

The statements show three charges against me all in the month of July 2017 - Legal costs of £80, Legal Fess of £70 and another legal cost of £22. 
This was the month they claim the CCJ was made. 

Finally, on the statement a charge of £110 was made against me for an attachment of earnings fee.

This was 2 years later on 19/10/2019.

I never had money taken from my payroll.

Just doesn't make sense. 

The gaps in between - I  have never received anything.

 

I notice the charges were originally made via Shoosmiths.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

[dx100uk]

backdoor CCJ to an old address because you moved and didn't update your debt owners.

go look at your credit file 

get the CCJ number

and on monday go ring northants bulk and ask for a copy of the CCJ and the claimform.

 

when did you last buy from the catalogue or pay toward it?

 

dx

 

[PrestonProblems]

Thank you dx

"when did you last buy from the catalogue or pay toward it?"

 

The last token payment of £1 was on 25th September 2103, one of those silly payment schemes you get suckered into dropping them 1 pound a month that actually keeps the debt alive.

My Credit Report is at 100% and there is no mention of a CCJ.

Best Regards
Preston

[dx100uk]

2103?  you mean 2013? so wasn't SB'd upon claimform issuance

 

are all your old addresses showing on your credit file?

 

have you moved since taking it out and not informed your debt owners?

 

 

[PrestonProblems]

Checked credit file

- no CCJ showing at all on Experian.

All my old addresses are in there.

Still trying to get through to Northants....

 

And just as an aside,

I sent a request for an original copy of the credit agreement, along with a payment of one pound. They sent it back stating that "due to the age of the account a copy of the Credit agreement is not available", they insist that this account is subject to a CCJ and they say their client(Arrow Global) is not obliged to provide a copy of the credit agreement as my liability has already been determined by the Court. 
This is an approach I haven't heard before.

 

This was the letter I sent them when they sent my initial pound back - they insisted that they did not need to provide the original agreement as a CCJ has been issued against the account. They DID provide a breakdown of the account originally in their first response.
 

Drydensfairfax Solicitors
PO Box 203
Huddersfield
HD8 1ER

MY ADDRESS

2/6/2021

Dear Sir/Madam
Account No: XXXXXXXXXX
Ref: XXXXXXXXXXXXX

You have contacted me about the account with the above reference number, which you claim I owe. I do not admit any liability for your claim.

I do not understand why you talk about returning my fee of one pound as the fee for asking for a copy of my agreement and statement of account under sections 77, 78 and 79 of the Consumer Credit Act is £1. There is no fee if I ask you for a statement of my account under section 77b of the Consumer Credit Act - which is not what I asked for.

Let me please clarify:

Please send me a copy of the above credit agreement and a full breakdown of the account including any interest or charges added.
I understand that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (sections 77-79), I am entitled to receive a copy of any credit agreement and a statement of account when I request it.
I enclose the payment of £1 which is the fee payable under the Consumer Credit Act 1974.
I understand a copy of any credit agreement along with a statement of account should be supplied within 12 working days.
I understand that, under the Consumer Credit Act 1974, creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they fail to comply with the request for a copy of the agreement and statement of account.
I look forward to hearing from you either by receiving the above information or by confirming in writing that you will not make any further contact about the above claim and confirm that this matter and that it is now closed..

Yours faithfully,

[dx100uk]

Std practice for All CCa requests sent to the Arrows group, and yes, they are not obliged to provide it as the CCJ judgement trumps it's requirements.

however, 

On 02/07/2021 at 22:58, dx100uk said:

have you moved since taking it out and not informed your debt owners?

 

get the info from Northants bulk lets see where the claimform was served too. as well ask that question please. if they don't have a copy to send

[PrestonProblems]

I'm going to have to do a bit more digging, I think you are correct - i'm missing an address on my credit file. The CCJ isn't showing so I don't know the claim number, and without it I can't get any information out of Northants.... Give me a day or two pls.

[dx100uk]

though as much....

 

 

[PrestonProblems]

The lady I spoke to at NCC made a couple of interesting points- told her Experian have my address details wrong but she said any CCJ would usually find it’s way to my credit report. She feels if there’s nothing on my credit report it’s highly unlikely that I would have an outstanding CCJ. 
I'm going to have to get the claim number from Drydens themselves....

[dx100uk]

go add the missing address to your experian portal

then it will most probably update itself over night

 

my neighbour did that and it found 3 he never knew about!

[PrestonProblems]

Will do - thank you!
Next letter going in to Drydens:
 

[Your address]

[Their address]

[Date]

Dear Sir or Madam

 

Account No/Reference No: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

 

You have contacted me regarding the account with the above reference number, which you claim is owed by myself. I have no knowledge of any such debt being owed to Arrow Global Guernsey Limited.

 

You state that a CCJ was issued against me. I have no knowledge of any CCJ issued against me, my credit report does not show any trace of a CCJ and I have never received any written notification of a CCJ - I dispute this allegation strongly. 

Please send me all details of the alleged CCJ along with your proof that this was issue against me personally.

 

I have familiarised myself with the Financial Conduct Authority (FCA) Consumer Credit sourcebook which states the following rules.

 

"A firm must not ignore or disregard a customer's claim that a debt has been settled or is disputed and must not continue to make demands for payment without providing clear justification and/or evidence as to why the customer's claim is not valid." 7.5.3

 

"A firm must suspend any steps it takes or its agent takes in the recovery of a debt from a customer where the customer disputes the debt on valid grounds or what may be valid grounds." 7.14.1

 

"Where a customer disputes a debt on valid grounds or what may be valid grounds, the firm must investigate the dispute and provide details of the debt to the customer in a timely manner." 7.14.3

 

In not ceasing collection activity whilst investigating a reasonably queried or disputed debt you are using deceptive and / or unfair methods.

 

Furthermore, ignoring and/or disregarding claims that debts have been settled or are disputed and continuing to make unjustified demands for payment amounts to psychological harassment.

 

I also believe that, looking at the last payment date on the debt that you infer to be mine and the fact that you cannot provide a true copy of a CCA agreement - that this debt is unenforceable. You have a duty to state this in all your communication according to CONC 13.1, which you clearly have not done.

 

CONC 13.1.6 (4) says that when someone has made a request for a copy of their CCA agreement and it cannot be found, all future requests for payment from a creditor should make it clear that the debt is unenforceable.

 

13.1.1 (1) applies to a firm with respect to consumer credit lending and a firm with respect to consumer hiring;

 

13.1.2 (1) The FCA takes the view that sections 77, 78 and 79 of the CCA should be read in a way that allows the borrower or hirer to obtain the information needed in order to be properly informed without imposing unnecessary burden on firms.

 

13.1.2 (3) Firms should take steps to ensure that information is preserved and kept available to be used to give information to a borrower or hirer.

 

13.1.3 (4) In accordance with the sections referred to in (1) the firm must 'give' a copy of the executed agreement and any other document referred to in it and the required statement.

 

13.1.4 (1) The copy of the executed agreement should be a 'true copy' of the original.

 

Failure to comply with the provisions means that the agreement becomes unenforceable while the failure to comply persists, and the courts have no discretion to allow enforcement.

 

In such cases, a firm should in no way, either by act or omission, mislead a customer as to the enforceability of the agreement. In particular, a firm should not in such cases either threaten court action or other enforcement of the debt or imply that the debt is enforceable when it is not. The firm should, in any request for payment or communication relating to a payment (other than a statement issued in accordance with the CCA or regulations made under it which does not constitute or contain a request for payment) in such cases, make clear to the customer that although the debt remains outstanding it is unenforceable.

 

I would ask that no further contact be made concerning the above accounts unless you can provide evidence as to my liability for the debt in question.

 

I await your written confirmation that this matter is now closed.

 

Should this not happen, I will have no option but to make a complaint to the Trading Standards Department and consider informing the FCA of your actions.

 

I look forward to hearing from you.

Yours faithfully
SIGN YOUR NAME

[dx100uk]

hold that... don't ever send pointless letter tennis till will know the true facts.

 

 

[PrestonProblems]

Ok, thank you for the advice!

[PrestonProblems]

some news.

There IS a CCJ on file brought about by Arrow. It's been on file all this time and no activity

in Feb of this year they passed it on to Burnley Crown Court.

 

Called them too, they said there had been no activity - no application for enforcement.

They asked for my current address but said they will not be taking any action.

They would only act if if Arrow / Drysden's apply for enforcement.

Thoughts on moving forward?

Thanks again for all your input, you have been extremely helpful!

Preston

[dx100uk]

POC?

[PrestonProblems]

What exactly do you need dx? I don't entirely understand?

[dx100uk]

did you get the particulars of claim, that was the idea of ring courts....

 

dx

 

[PrestonProblems]

Finally.....
Particulars.
Thoughts?
Thanks again for everything!

CCJ.pdf

[dx100uk]

no thats the judgement that we already knew about 

 

you need the POC from the claimform 

[PrestonProblems]

Ok, spoke to Burnley CC this afternoon. Was asked to put the request in writing which I’ve done. The chap I spoke to did say that any claim form that has had no action taken for three years is usually destroyed. Let’s see what happens as he said they may have a copy on the computer somewhere. 

[dx100uk]

Northants bulk will have it, as i said in post 6 go ring them and ask this . THey might not have it in paper format but ask them to read it out..record your call..we need the exact text.  Check the address it was filed too as well

[PrestonProblems]

On it - thank you!

[PrestonProblems]

ok dx i spoke northampton cc this morning.

 

they no longer have the document- however they went through their pc files and said they do have the particulars.

 

this is what they gave me:

1. the claimant's claim is for the sum of £1030.83 being monies due from the defendant to the claimant under a regulated agreement between the defendant and shop direct limited (carval) and assigned to the claimant on 13/05/2011, notice of which has been provided to the defendant. 

2. the defendant has failed to make payment in accordance with the terms of the agreement and a default notice has been served pursuant to the consumer credit act 1974. 

3. the claimant claims the sum of £ 1030.83 4.

 

c has complied, as far as is necessary, with the pre-action conduct practice direction.

 

that's all they have.....

[dx100uk]

so confirms all the dates etc.

shame you started pointless letter tennis with the fleecers.

shame you you allowed yourself to be cashcowed blind for so many years paying £1PCM and running the SB date to infinity. if you'd not made those the debt would have been SB by the claimdate

 

not alot you can do ...yours is not the next move, though as i say i doubt they'll leave be as you stated kicking their pramwheels....

[PrestonProblems]

So they don't need any of the original documentation from the initial debt, they don't need addresses they served to or anything on their POC?
Fortunately this is not mine dx, i'm working this for a friend of mine - I have never been stupid enough to fall for the 1 pound per month and keeping the debt alive stuff. I advised him against it many years ago and am just fighting for a solution for him now.....
Thanks for the help anyway dx.