St Audries Park Somerset - Wedding Cancellation

[AndyOrch]

That's the next stage really because you have not actually requested a refund as yet therefore you need to ask that and let them confirm in writing either yes or no....if no then the above comes into action.

[BStealth]

Understood and so something simple via email (as written contract cancellation is sufficient) should suffice:

Dear XXX,
 

It's unfortunate that we've been unable to come to an agreement on the postponement of our wedding date and as of such, I must confirm in writing the cancellation of our wedding with St Audries Park on XX/XX/XX. I politely request that we are refunded for the sum of £2497.50 in alignment with the Competition & Markets Authority Guidance – Statement on coronavirus (COVID-19), consumer contracts, cancellations and refunds dated 07/09/2020.

 

Yours Faithfully,

 

 

just something short to receive their rejection response?

[AndyOrch]

Correct.......let them  confirm their position...change the word "   alignment  " to pursuant.

[BStealth]

And their response;

 

Dear XXX,

 

Thank you for your email.

 

As previously stated, this is the last thing that we would want and we are truly sorry to receive your instructions to cancel your reservation of St Audries Park on XXX XX August 2021.

 

As both parties are able to fulfil their obligation to the contract, we cannot apply the logic of frustrated contract law. We therefore have to revert to contract law surrounding unfair terms. In March 2016, when the CMA released their directive on venue deposits, we took the opportunity to review our terms and can confirm they were found to be compliant. Recently, when the CMA announced they would be reviewing wedding venue payment plans, we proactively wrote to them to ensure this is still the case. However, this guidance is not the law itself and I am pleased to inform you that our staggered deposit schedule is quantifiably offset with costs incurred by the venue pre-wedding day. The most recent guidance from the CMA has also been a little misleading in respect of refunds as they fail to really communicate that the venue is allowed to retain amounts in line with costs incurred. I would also like to highlight that the CMA has yet to hold any meaningful consultation with the Wedding industry prior to releasing any of its recent advice, however where it has opened dialogue with one wedding venue group, Bijou, it did backtrack considerably with regards to recoverable costs.

 

St Audries Park is a non-residential property which is maintained by the service provider exclusively for the provision of wedding services. To this extent, St Audries Park relies solely on the income from couples who contract for wedding services. From the moment an agreement is reached, and so as not to fall short of our obligations as a service provider pursuant to the CRA, St Audries Park commits to:-

• maintaining the property at the same high standard as evident at the couples’ first viewing (inclusive of … maintaining gardens/employing cleaners/inspecting the property etc);
• insuring the property for use for large events (i.e. weddings);
• reserving the wedding date for the couples’ exclusive use and therefore being unable to offer their services to another couple.

 

In addition to the above and as per our terms and conditions, each couple is provided with an expert personal wedding manager (paid for by the supplier) who is available at all times prior to their wedding day. Further, couples have the right to attend St Audries Park at no extra charge on any day that a wedding is not being held. To this extent, we cannot agree that our incurred costs in relation to your booking are limited to administration fees. A significant portion of fees are incurred by the supplier prior to the wedding date, who – acting in good faith and with the intention of performing the contract to conclusion – ensures that all obligations under the contract are carried out to the highest standard. Perhaps most importantly, the supplier is obligated to reserve the date of booking for the exclusive use of the couple and therefore committed to turning away any further possible sales and sole income for the date agreed. In accordance with section 62(4) CRA and when our terms and conditions were drawn up by our legal team, such obligations were balanced with the rights of couples to cancel their wedding in determining a fair deposit price to be paid by those wishing to reserve the services of the supplier. We are satisfied that, on balance, our deposit price is fair and (as per our terms and conditions) non-refundable.

 

In addition and, as per our standard terms and conditions, cancellation on your part at this short notice will now incur a cancellation fee for which I attach the invoice.

 

We are sorry that this is not the response that you were hoping for and would urge you to reconsider your position.

 

Kind regards,
 

And they kindly sent me an invoice as follows:

Wedding & Reception Excluding VAT 

• 1 Enhanced Wedding Package for 60 Guests @ £3,995.00 £3,329.17
• 1 Holly Cottage (Night Before) FOC @ £0.00 £0.00
• 5 Additional Child Day Guests @ £68.00 £283.33 
• 8 Bottled Water Package @ £5.00 £33.33
• 2 Supplier Main Meals @ £36.00 £60.00
• 1 Church Lodge - Night Before @ £460.00 £383.33
• 1 Inddor & Outdoor Candle Package @ £200.00 £166.67
• 1 Garden Games @ £150.00 £125.00
• 1 Flower Wall & Foliage Arch @ £195.00 £162.50
• 1 Post Box @ £40.00 £33.33
• 1 12 Coach House Bedrooms @ £1,520.00 £1,266.67
• 1 Refundable Damage Deposit @ £1,000.00 £833.33
• 1 13 Main House Bedrooms @ £2,330.00 £1,941.67
• 1 Bridal Suite (FOC) @ £0.00 £0.00 Page
• 3 Additional Teenager Day Guests @ £102.00 £255.00

Cost of above services £8,873.33 Total VAT @ 20% £1,774.67

Total £10,648 LESS Booking Deposit @ £500 -£500 Further Deposit @ £1,997.50 -£1,997.50 Total £8,150.50

LESS Cancellation waiver at 25% of above -£2,037.63

LESS Part Bulk Payment Received @ £1,497.50 -£1,497.50

Total Now Due £4,615.37

[BStealth]

To add comment to this invoice which they've sent me.

 

Wedding & Reception Excluding VAT 

• 1 Enhanced Wedding Package for 60 Guests @ £3,995.00 £3,329.17  This is the wedding package and contract for 60 people
• 1 Holly Cottage (Night Before) FOC @ £0.00 £0.00 N/A
• 5 Additional Child Day Guests @ £68.00 £283.33 This we never confirmed
• 8 Bottled Water Package @ £5.00 £33.33 This is not disposable goods
• 2 Supplier Main Meals @ £36.00 £60.00 
• 1 Church Lodge - Night Before @ £460.00 £383.33 This we never confirmed
• 1 Inddor & Outdoor Candle Package @ £200.00 £166.67 This is not disposable goods
• 1 Garden Games @ £150.00 £125.00 This they already own
• 1 Flower Wall & Foliage Arch @ £195.00 £162.50 This they already own
• 1 Post Box @ £40.00 £33.33 This they were giving for free
• 1 12 Coach House Bedrooms @ £1,520.00 £1,266.67 This we never confirmed
• 1 Refundable Damage Deposit @ £1,000.00 £833.33 This is a damages deposit
• 1 13 Main House Bedrooms @ £2,330.00 £1,941.67 This we never confirmed
• 1 Bridal Suite (FOC) @ £0.00 £0.00 Page N/A
• 3 Additional Teenager Day Guests @ £102.00 £255.00 This we never confirmed

Cost of above services £8,873.33 Total VAT @ 20% £1,774.67

Total £10,648 LESS Booking Deposit @ £500 -£500 Further Deposit @ £1,997.50 -£1,997.50 Total £8,150.50

 

LESS Cancellation waiver at 25% of above -£2,037.63
LESS Part Bulk Payment Received @ £1,497.50 -£1,497.50
Total Now Due £4,615.37

If my judgement is right and that near to none of that is even applicable as a 'loss' then they would be claiming they're acting in line with the CMA, consumer trading act and that only an enforceable sum of £3329.70 + £667 VAT = £3993.70 - £2497 = £1496 Less cancellation waiver at 25% £375 = £1496 - £375 = £1,121 they could claim?

[intree]

My Fiancé and I were due to Marry May 2020 after receiving a late cancellation booking Jan 2020.

- £500 deposit for the booking as per contract, via bank transfer.

- Due to COVID, we were advised that the venue could not host and we were only offered postponement, This was re-arranged for 4th August 2021. 

 

Hi Reading the above this is no different to what we are facing, the Venue cancelled all events for April/May 2020, they forced us to postpone, technically unless I am wrong this was a Contract like ours under the Consumer Rights Act 2015, accordingly they postponed and you just changed the date as they refused to refund, is this correct?

 

The fact that they cancelled the event left you in a position which was not clear and you safeguarded your money to allow the venue to provide a alternative date, which you agreed to be in 2021.

 

However Andy is correct you must ask for the refund, based on the original contract being postponed/cancelled by them and you being like many other couples agreed to the the postponement to safeguard your position.

 

The venue charged you date change fees, this is unreasonable under the CRA 2015.

They have then refused to refund you, when in fact they had to postpone in 2020.

 

Accordingly this is your starting point, please read the thread on Goosedale again, this is very similar indeed, but if there is something I am missing please let me know so I can help?

[intree]

Covid cancellations: couples still left out of pocket by wedding venues keeping their cash – Which? News

WWW.WHICH.CO.UK

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Many couples are still struggling to get the refunds they're legally entitled to for weddings cancelled due to the pandemic. A year after we first raised the alarm that venues were leaving couples out…

 

[intree]

Hundreds of Couples are in the same Boat, its shocking what is happening and there are laws which should protect consumers, which are being flaunted by greedy venue owners!

[BStealth]

Hi Intree 

 

at the time we didn’t ask for a refund as of such, they just told us they could change our date providing we placed the upfront payment and they didn’t once offer us a refund. 
 

Now, they’re claiming we owe them for what we ‘were thinking’ of Hiring on a ‘running order’ however all of those items are outside of the contract and booking form which is £3997 for a 60 guest wedding.
 

what I really need to know is;

 

- am I right in believing none of these additional items would be fit for payment by law

- should I press them for a refund and produce a claim letter

- do I even have a leg to stand on

 

 thanks!  

[intree]

Now that you have their response you really need to issue a LBC confirming that you were asked to postpone in 2020, and that the Venue could not fulfil its contract since that time, you postponed and were never offered a refund, under the CRA 2015 you can not be forced to pay cancellation charges or be subject to unfair practices, in the end the matter will need to proceed to Court its not a difficult thing to do, yes its very disheartening but it has to be done to get justice for you and your fiancé.

 

The starting point is the Consumer Rights Act 2015 and the frustrated contract, both these will override any terms in a contract, then you must confirm to them that they postponed the event in 2020, not you and then ask them to verify their charges under the CRA 2015.

 

After this come back to the forum and take further advices I can only go by my situation, they are leeches and here you will get the support but most of the work will need to be done by you, with help from senior members as I am a Novice I can only ask you to read the above and my claims currently in Court, it will not be a easy way but in the end if the laws are anything they should protect people like you and me, if they dont then I will be very dissapointed as the Smalls claim courts are supposed to be consumer friendly.

[BStealth]

I’ve also just found reviews on their Facebook where they’ve refused other people’s refunds and claim that their t&c’s of no refunds permits them to do this. At least two other people in their reviews have commented that they’ve started legal procedures. 

[BStealth]

Thanks intree. I have a LBC drafted already however I will make changes tomorrow AM GMT and post here for feedback. Greatly appreciate your time. 

[intree]

then follow the advice and start your LBC and claim as they are twisted fools who will not listen unless forced by a Court of law, at the moment there is not law only guidance and the CMA are not ones who will take up your claim on a one to one basis, please do not delay as come August 2021 you may still be in a restricted wedding arena, the longer they hold your money and the longer this goes on the more chance they go bankrupt then you lose everything!!

 

[intree]

For guidance look at the LBC i sent and then approach Andy on the forum for further advice.

 

Please keep your head up and we are with you, dont despair your one of hundreds they are doing this to and your no longer on your own

[intree]

SOMETHING LIKE THIS BUT WAIT FOR ADVICE AND CHANGE TO YOUR OWN VENUE:

 

 

I write in relation to contract reference  xxxxx : venue hire for a wedding reception of 350 guests; a total payment of £7,700. This amount was paid in full by me on 02/04/2019. The contracted event is unable to take place due to current Government guidelines and a full refund is requested.

Below is a timetable of recent key events:

1.      On 20/03/2020 xxxxxx advised our original booking for 23/05/2020 had to be postponed in line with Government guidelines. A request for a full refund was disregarded and Goosedale insisted we postpone our event.

2.      Due to our hands being tied as xxxxxx held our full £7,700, we reluctantly agreed to post-pone to 18/07/2020.

3.      In line with Government guidelines, wedding venues remained closed on 18/07/2020 therefore a further date was secured for 08/10/2020.

4.      Goosedale have advised us that weekend bookings require a higher payment, however despite 08/10/2020 falling on a weekday, we were not offered a price reduction.

5.      Since 17/04/2020, we have received one email on 03/09/2020, with a letter attached requested a further “£250 security bond for the event on 08/10/2020”.

6.      The current Government guidelines highlight that wedding ceremonies allows for up to 30 guests at a sit-down wedding reception which came into effect from 15/08/2020. As detailed above, our current contract and payment has been for 350 people. Goosedale are not in a position to provide this service.

I draw your attention to the following legislations:

·         GOV.UK – Competition & Markets Authority Guidance – Statement on coronavirus (COVID-19), consumer contracts, cancellations and refunds dated 28/08/2020.

·         The Consumer Rights Act 2015 Unfair Terms - ss.61-76

In line with the detailed legislation and guidance, you are unable to carry out a service that I have paid for; subsequently the contract has been frustrated. Therefore, I request a full refund of £7,700 within the next 14 days.

In closing, I would draw your attention to paragraphs 15 and 16 of the Practice Direction which gives the courts the power to impose sanctions on the parties if they fail to comply with the direction including failing to respond to this letter before claim. 

Should I not receive a response to my letter within this time frame then I anticipate that court action will be commenced with no further reference to you.

Yours sincerely,

[intree]

I also advise you read and become familiar with the following :

 

 

UK Government rules: Exhibit’s CMA law guidance

 

Exhibit 8:  2 March 2016 - CMA Guidance to the Wedding Sector dated 2 March 2016 (regarding unfair T&Cs)
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/wedding-and-event-venue-providers-letter-from-the-cma-on-contract-terms

 

Exhibit 9: 23 March 2020 – “stay at home” all events cancelled. 

https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/pm-address-to-the-nation-on-coronavirus-23-march-2020

 

Exhibit 10: 30 April 2020 - “Contracts that cannot go ahead due to lockdown laws” – frustrated contract – consumers should be entitled to a full refund.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/cma-to-investigate-concerns-about-cancellation-policies-during-the-coronavirus-covid-19-pandemic

 

Exhibit 11: On 28 August 2020 - Government Guidance. 

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/cma-to-investigate-concerns-about-cancellation-policies-during-the-coronavirus-covid-19-pandemic/the-coronavirus-covid-19-pandemic-consumer-contracts-cancellation-and-refunds

 

Exhibit 12 :7 September 2020 - Where lockdown laws prevent (or prevented) a wedding from going ahead as agreed, the consumer should be offered a refund.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/wedding-services-coronavirus-covid-19-cancellations-and-refunds/wedding-services-affected-by-covid-19-statement-of-the-cmas-position-on-cancellation-and-refunds

 

Exhibit 13: 26 November 2020 - The CMA warned wedding Venues about unfair practices and misleading customers over refunds. 

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/covid-19-refunds-cma-warns-wedding-firms-over-unfair-practices

 

 

Supporting Legislation

 

 

Consumer Rights Act 2015:  https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2015/15/contents/enacted

 

Unfair Trading Regulations (2008):  https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2008/1277/contents/made

 

Frustrated Contracts law:  https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Geo6/6-7/40

 

[BStealth]

Whilst the goosedale case is a strong reference, they’re case is very different. They had a contract which was unable to deliver as the restriction was 30. Our venue contract is 60 and the venues permitted for 66 however they’ve known all along that we were planning on paying for many more. Also, the venue quotes they can deliver on our contract however we state that social distancing and limitations means the wedding is out of the ordering and impacted by that. I’ll write this up in the morning. Thanks again. 

[BStealth]

Well, some dishearting news today. I spoke with someone who took St Audries to court for the refusal to refund their £5500 deposit under unfair t&c's and they lost their case. St Audries turned up with a Barrister and the court through out the claim. 

[honeybee13]

Do you know why they lost? It would help you to know what the barrister's arguments were and what the judge said.

 

HB

[BStealth]

Sorry Honeybee13 the feedback isnt that in depth... 

- Judge said that they knew the t&c's at point of booking and carried on paying them money.

[BStealth]

Dear Sir, 

 

Reference: XXXX

 

As it has not been possible to resolve this matter amicably, and it is apparent that court action may be necessary, I write in compliance with the Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct. 

• On 20/03/2020 St Audries Park advised our original booking for 01/05/2020 had to be postponed in line with Government guidelines. 

• St Audries Park offered us a limited selection of dates which were week days and did not match our original Friday booking. 

• St Audries advised that weekend bookings require a higher payment, however despite 04/08/2021 falling on a weekday, we were not offered a price reduction. 

• St Audries advised “As you booked your wedding on one of our special offers the options, we are now able to give you are such good value as in normal circumstances these dates would have been of much higher value.” 

• St Audries insisted that to move the date, we would have to pay an upfront bulk payment of £1997.50 

• Due to our hands being tied as St Audries Park held our full £500 deposit, we reluctantly agreed to post-pone to 04/08/2021. 

• Visibility and insight into our personal circumstances, number of guests and plans for the day has always been paramount and made clear to our wedding planner employed by St Audries Park. 

• As a result of current Government Coronavirus Legislation impacting our wedding date, we had no choice but to ask for a postponement of our wedding date. This request was made to Aly on 18/06/21. The request for postponement has been declined twice and received from St Audries Board of Directors on 24/06/21 and 25/06/21. 

From you I am claiming that in accordance with the CMA’s position of weddings which can go ahead, albeit with restrictions and limitations, we should not receive disproportionate charges for cancelling our wedding. As per the Consumer Trading Act 2015 I ask that a proportion of my £500 booking deposit and further £1997.50 advance payment to St Audries Park to be refunded. The refunded amount should be minus actual costs incurred and a breakdown of this made available. 

Listed below are the documents on which I intend to rely in my claim against you: 

 

• GOV.UK – Competition & Markets Authority Guidance – Statement on coronavirus (COVID-19), consumer contracts, cancellations and refunds dated 07/09/2020. 

• The Consumer Rights Act 2015 Unfair Terms - ss.61-76 

• The Consumer Contracts Regulations 2014 

 

In accordance with the Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct I would request that you provide me with copies of the following documents: 

• Breakdown of actual costs incurred through cancellation of contract 

I can confirm that I would be agreeable to mediation and would consider any other system of Alternative Dispute Resolution (ADR) in order to avoid the need for this matter to be resolved by the courts. I would invite you to put forward any proposals in this regard.  

 

In closing, I would draw your attention to paragraphs 15 and 16 of the Practice Direction which gives the courts the power to impose sanctions on the parties if they fail to comply with the direction including failing to respond to this letter before claim.  

 

I look forward to hearing from you within the next 14 days. 

 

Should I not receive a response to my letter within this time frame then I anticipate that court action will be commenced with no further reference to you. 

 

Yours faithfully, 

 

[The GodMother]

If you do not have a contract for the extra items or items u was just thinking about then they cant charge u for them. have you any confirmation that these were added or not added. 

I know on experience of event planning that some companies expect u to have things or even if u enquire about them they add them to your list. Currently planning my partners and mine. 1st venue we looked at were nice and gave us options second venue has said we have some options but the 3rd has said we have no choice everything has to be by them and approved by them including cake colour scheme suppliers etc. 

 

 

[BStealth]

Attached the signed booking form and T&C's

Booking form.docx St Audries Park Terms and Conditions - Feb 20 (1)[908].pdf

[BStealth]

@Andyorch any thoughts here would be extremely valued

[AndyOrch]

With regards to your LBC... you should  reword " Of the refunded amount requested should there be any actual costs incurred a full breakdown of this made available for inspection"  

 

That is an action that they can deliberate / opt for...not something that you should invite.

 

Also in the intro you need to confirm your request of cancellation of the booking and their refusal with dates and in the conclusion of the LBC a statement should be added that should this procced to court they will be liable for costs and interest @8% pursuant to section 69  of the County Courts Act 1984.