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Big Motoring World- @BigMotoringWrld - refusing to honour statutory rights


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Hi guys,

 

I have purchased used vehicle on finance, on 1st of June 2021 from Big Motoring World (Audi A7 - 2016 plate).

 

On 7th of June I noticed a vibration on wheel and noise on passenger front side when breaking. I logged the problem on warranty app that comes with the car (3 months). I took the car to local independent garage on 9th of June. They advised me that break discs are slightly warped, and disc pads needs replacing. Invoice and diagnostics sent off to BMW warranty team. They are not happy with the price quoted and asked me to take the car to Halfords auto center. This is fine and I am happy to do that.

 

However a real problem started this morning 11th of June. I heard a loud whistling noise coming from under bonnet when I accelerate. I suspected this was a turbo noise. I took the car to local independent garage and been confirmed that the turbo is gone. Been advised not to drive the car. 

 

I called BMW warranty department and they have given me details of approved Audi dealer. The garage gave me appointment to diagnose next week Thursday 17th of June. 

 

I am no longer happy with this, meaning I will have no vehicle for at least a week and have no way of getting my family around. I thought about the issues that are occurring within the first week and I decided that for peace of mind I would like to hand the car back. I suspect it will cost me arm and leg if I do decide to keep the car. I called BMW after sales team and advised them that I would like to reject the car and return it back. They have advised me that they don't offer that option and that is not possible to do so.

 

Now, I thought under consumer rights I have 14 days to cancel this? I have paid 3000 pounds deposit and remaining is on finance. What are my options here? What can I do? Any suggestions please? Anyone has had anything similar happen? 

 

I am on the line to speak with the financing company to see what they tell me and what my options are.

 

Many thanks for any suggestions.

 

 

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Sorry, I didn't know how to edit the post. 

 

I have just spoken with finance department at Black Horse Trading. I explained the problems to them and advised that I want to reject the vehicle.

 

They advised me that this cannot be done. They must take the vehicle to authorized garage on Thursday 17th of June and confirm what the problem is before they can help. They will arrange for recovery truck to move the car to garage. They will try to resolve the issue for me afterwards. How would I protect myself before it goes onto the recovery truck in case damage is caused? 

 

However, I am still not confident with the car and I believe I will have further problems down the line. I want to hand it back. They didn't really care that I have kids to take around to school and I have no means to do so until the car is back. They cannot provide courtesy car.  Sounds like this will be a lengthy process to say the least.. 


Thanks

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The first thing to do is to reject the car under the consumer rights act.

You should send the letter in writing.

You should not agree to a warranty repair because this is not invoke your statutory rights. If you do eventually agree to any repairs, you should insist that they are done as part of your statutory rights are not under warranty.

Warranties are a trick which are calculated to distract you from your statutory rights and also eventually to deprive you of your statutory rights if you insist on the warranty repair. In fact you will find that it is the dealer that will prefer the warranty repair.

The BMW after sales team are completely wrong and am amazed that they are actually telling you that rejection is not possible. Black Horse Trading are also completely wrong but it is rather less surprising that they are attempting to evade their statutory responsibilities.

I would suggest that you write a letter to BMW after sales:

 

Quote

Dear Sir/Mdm

As you know on 1 June 2021 you sold me an Audi registration number XXX.

By 7 June the vehicle had started to demonstrate serious defects and in fact I have now been told that I should not drive it.

I have decided that I have lost confidence in the vehicle and I'm hereby rejecting it under the Consumer Rights Act and I require you to help me arrange a complete refund of money that I have spent including revocation of the finance agreement with Black Horse Trading.

I would point out that I have already attempted to inform your after sales team about this issue and also have attempted to reject the vehicle. I was astonished to be told by the BMW team that it was not possible to reject the vehicle and that you don't offer that option.

We all know that this is a breach of your statutory obligations. The vehicle is rejected and I require you to make arrangements to collect it and as I have said, reimburse all expenditures and to deal with the finance company to cancel the finance agreement.
I'm sending a copy of this letter to the finance company.

If you have already started make any arrangement to carry out warranty repairs et cetera then I advise you to stop because I will not be proceeding with this purchase.

If you force me to go to court about this then I'm more than happy and the court will draw its own conclusions about your attempts on the telephone to mislead me into believing that I had no statutory rights in the matter.

Yours faithfully

 

Start off with that letter. As you can see, it includes a copy to the finance company.

I would also contact the finance company on the telephone. Point out that you have reject the vehicle and you want all of your money back and that you are not happy with their position that you had no rights in the matter.
Tell them that you want to begin an immediate complaint to the financial ombudsman service and you want their final response in a week so you can progress it.

 

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  • BankFodder changed the title to Big Motoring World - refusing to honour statutory rights

Are these the dealers?  

WWW.BIGMOTORINGWORLD.CO.UK

Big Motoring World, Used Car Dealer based in Maidstone, supplying Used Cars for sale within Kent, including Bmw, Volkswagen, Mercedes-benz, Ford, Nissan

 

 

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  • BankFodder changed the title to Big Motoring World- @BigMotoringWrld - refusing to honour statutory rights

Wow, thank you so much for detailed reply BankFodder!

 

Understood, I will not take the warranty repairs and leave the car outside of my house for time being. I was also confused when both companies told me I have no rights, but thinking about it no wonder with finance company not wanting to take a hit. 

 

I have in fact just spoke with Black Horse and advised them what you just told me to do. They have advised me that they have this logged on system and that I want to reject the car. However, the man on the phone has advised me that the vehicle still needs to be inspected and report given to them before they can proceed further. I have advised them that I would be happy to do that as long as the vehicle is not being repaired under the warranty and that only inspection is carried out. Does that sound correct? Should I let recovery vehicle take my car to the garage? 

 

Yes indeed it is correct dealer!

 

I will get on with the letter now. May you please advise if I should send the letter to both companies via email or physical letters and get paid postage receipts?

 

Thanks

 

 

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I should make sure that you put everything in writing. You should normally record your calls – read our customer services guide. If you have any phonecalls then you should make notes of everything which was agreed and then send it to them in writing – email is fine – so everything is on record. You don't want to be in a position where you agree something and then later on they deny or they say that the agreement was different.

Point out to Black Horse Trading that because the defect has occur within the first 30 days, the presumption is that it was always there and that the car is rejected and you won't stand for any excuses. Insist that it is a formal complaint to the ombudsman. Don't back down on this. They are obliged to put your complaint forward so make sure that they understand now that you mean business they can certainly take the car to the garage. Make sure that they understand that when they take the car, it is not coming back. It will not be accepted back. You will cancel all insurance and you want to revoke your ownership and if they try to return it to you then it will be an uninsured vehicle.

Make sure they understand that all of this is done on the basis of your statutory rights and you are not interested in the warranty which is part of the contract and you have rejected the contract.

By the way, don't expect this to be the end of it. At the moment you are stating your position and they won't like it. Be very careful about them trying to pull the wool over your eyes in some way on this.

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Ok, I got the app for recording and just raised this officially with black horse, but for some reason it did not record.

 

They told me this is now raised and they are dealing with BMW directly and I should hear response back next week. I have pointed out all the statements that you advised. 

 

I guess, for my own protection I will type this out to them directly via email so I have this as proof. If you don't mind I will post this just to review.

 

Thanks

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I'm afraid that some of the recording apps don't work now because Apple and also android have blocked recording in that direction. They will only record the outgoing part of the conversation

It's essential that you put everything into writing and make sure everybody has a copy. Send copies of letters that you sent the finance company to the dealership. Send copies of the letters that you sent to the dealership to the finance company.

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I guessed so. I just tried on couple different numbers and it did not record... Do you mind just having a look at what you typed out and I just added few things at the bottom that you said. Does that sound ok to send over to both BMW and Black Horse?

 

Thanks, I really appreciate you helping me here!!

 

Dear Sir/Mdm

 

I insist that this is a formal complain to the financial ombudsman.

 

As you know on 1 June 2021 you sold me an Audi registration number RF16 TYV.

 

By 7 June the vehicle had started to demonstrate serious defects and in fact I have now been told that I should not drive it.

 

I have decided that I have lost confidence in the vehicle and I'm hereby rejecting it under the Consumer Rights Act and I require you to help me arrange a complete refund of money that I have spent including revocation of the finance agreement with Black Horse Trading.

 

I would point out that I have already attempted to inform your after sales team about this issue and also have attempted to reject the vehicle. I was astonished to be told by the Big Motoring World team that it was not possible to reject the vehicle and that you don't offer that option.

 

We all know that this is a breach of your statutory obligations. The vehicle is rejected and I require you to make arrangements to collect it and as I have said, reimburse all expenditures and to deal with the finance company to cancel the finance agreement.

 

I'm sending a copy of this letter to the finance company.

 

If you have already started make any arrangement to carry out warranty repairs et cetera then I advise you to stop because I will not be proceeding with this purchase.

 

If you force me to go to court about this then I'm more than happy and the court will draw its own conclusions about your attempts on the telephone to mislead me into believing that I had no statutory rights in the matter.

 

I would also like to point out that since the defect has occurred within the first 30 days, my presumption is that it was always there and that the car is rejected and I won’t stand for any excuses.

 

As discussed over the phone on 11 June, we agreed that appointment is booked for authorized Audi garage at 8:30am on 17 June. You can certainly take the car away on the recovery vehicle, but I would like you to understand that when you do take the car, it will not be coming back. It will not be accepted back. I will cancel all insurance and I also want to revoke my ownership and if you do try to return it to me it will be an uninsured vehicle.

 

I want you to also understand that all of this is done on the basis of my statutory rights and that I am not interested in the warranty which is part of the contract and I am rejecting the contract.

 

Yours faithfully

 

Edited by Karalius
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I don't understand you are you are writing to here. Is it to the dealer or to the ombudsman. If it is to the dealer then why are you telling them that you want it sent to the ombudsman. That is a matter for the finance company.

Please can you have a look at the letter and make sure that it is directed to the person to whom you attend to address it. Then we can go further

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Ok, my apologies for my misunderstanding. I want to send the letter to both BMW and Black Horse Finance. Should I only send such as you posted in post #3? Or also add the extra

 bits which you made in post #6 too? 

 

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So do want a BMW. Do another one to Blackhorse. Let's have a look at them. Make sure that you send a copy of each 1 to the other party.

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I am sorry if I am still not understanding this correctly. Forgive me as I have never been in such situation prior. Please see if this sounds ok to send to both companies? 

 

Ok, so to BMW, and below to Black Horse.

Quote

 

Dear Sir/Mdm

 

As you know on 1 June 2021 you sold me an Audi registration number RF16 TYV.

 

By 7 June the vehicle had started to demonstrate serious defects and in fact I have now been told that I should not drive it.

 

I have decided that I have lost confidence in the vehicle and I'm hereby rejecting it under the Consumer Rights Act and I require you to help me arrange a complete refund of money that I have spent including revocation of the finance agreement with Black Horse Trading.

 

I would point out that I have already attempted to inform your after sales team about this issue and also have attempted to reject the vehicle. I was astonished to be told by the Big Motoring World team that it was not possible to reject the vehicle and that you don't offer that option.

 

We all know that this is a breach of your statutory obligations. The vehicle is rejected and I require you to make arrangements to collect it and as I have said, reimburse all expenditures and to deal with the finance company to cancel the finance agreement.

 

I'm sending a copy of this letter to the finance company - and I have informed them that you are attempting to avoid your statutory obligations.

 

If you have already started make any arrangement to carry out warranty repairs et cetera then I advise you to stop because I will not be proceeding with this purchase.

 

If you force me to take you to court about this then I'm more than happy and the court will draw its own conclusions about your attempts on the telephone to mislead me into believing that I had no statutory rights in the matter.

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

To Black Horse

Quote

 

Dear Sir/Mdm

 

This is my formal complaint with much I wish escalated to the financial ombudsman service

 

As you know on 1 June 2021, I was sold an Audi registration number RF16 TYV by Big Motoring World. The purchase was financed by yourselves finance reference number XXX


You should understand that I am fully aware of my rights under section 75 Consumer Credit Act 1974
 

By 7 June the vehicle had started to demonstrate serious defects and in fact I have now been told that I should not drive it.

 

I have decided that I have lost confidence in the vehicle and I'm hereby rejecting it under the Consumer Rights Act and I require you to help me arrange a complete refund of money that I have spent including revocation of the finance agreement with Black Horse Trading.

 

I would point out that I have already attempted to inform Big Motoring World after sales team about this issue and also have attempted to reject the vehicle. I was astonished to be told by the Big Motoring World team that it was not possible to reject the vehicle and that they don't offer that option.
 

I have also attempted to inform you and I was also astonished to be told by your staff that I was not entitled to reject the vehicle and that I had no rights in the matter. This will be the basis of my complaint to the ombudsman about you
 

We all know that this is a breach of statutory obligations. I am rejecting the vehicle and I require for Big Motoring World to make arrangements to collect the vehicle and as I have said, reimburse all expenditures and to help me cancel the finance agreement.

 

I would also like to point out that since the defect has occurred within the first 30 days, my presumption is that it was always there and that the car is rejected and I won’t stand for any excuses.

As discussed over the phone on 11 June, we agreed that appointment is booked for authorized Audi garage at 8:30am on 17 June. Big Motoring World can certainly take the car away on the recovery vehicle, but I would like you to understand that when they do take the car, it will not be coming back to me. It will not be accepted back. I will cancel all insurance and I also want to revoke my ownership and if they do try to return it to me it will be an uninsured vehicle.

 

I want you to also understand that all of this is done on the basis of my statutory rights and that I am not interested in the warranty which is part of the contract and I am rejecting the contract.

 

Yours faithfully

 

 

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Edits in red

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Hi,

 

I have just received an email from BMW. I am unsure if I should be replying to this email. It sounds like they want to go into route of repairs, they should see the problems logged on the system either way. Can you please advise my course of action? Thanks

 

"Good Morning, 

Thank you for contacting us and I am sorry to hear that you are not satisfied with the vehicle. 

Could you please advise what the fault with the vehicle is that you are experiencing and if you have had a diagnosis report carried out?"

 

 

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Write to them and simply confirm the fault of the vehicle is XXX, it is not a satisfactory quality and you are asserting your right under the consumer rights act and you are rejecting the vehicle and you want them to make appropriate arrangements to collect the vehicle and to cancel the contract.

Tell them that you're not in the mood to muck around, to negotiate or to accept anything less

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Hi BankFodder,

 

Hoping you had a great weekend. I have sent them the email as suggested above, and just received below email from them. Should I agree for the warranty company to collect the car and give them all the requested documents et cetera? Should I be taking the pictures of the vehicle and videos etc of the faults in case they play a game with me? Will they try to down value from my payments that I made due to milage that I clocked up already (around 850 miles). Should I mention to him that the after sales team is where I was told that my vehicle could not be rejected? 

 

Thanks

 

"Good Afternoon,

Thankyou for getting in contact with us, and for providing the additional details in your prior emails. 

I cannot see anything stating previously that your right to reject the vehicle is voided and not something that we would look into.
I can assure you that we are more than happy to assist with moving forward on that front. The eventual outcome and agreement to accept the rejection will of course be subject to an inspection confirming the noted concerns/faults.

To move forward from the current position, we would need to organise for the vehicle to be recovered to our Snodland Service Center from yourself. Can you please confirm you are happy for me to forward your details across to our Warranty Company to liaise with you directly to organise this aspect?

When the vehicle is recovered, we would require for all relevant paperwork to be sent along with the car, most importantly any spare keys, SD Cards and the V5 document. These can be left in the glovebox of the vehicle when it is recovered. 

Please let me know if you're happy for me to forward your information across, and we can organise the next steps accordingly.

Kind Regards"

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Quote

I confirm my rejection of the vehicle and of the contract under the consumer rights act 2015.

I shall be more than happy for you to collect the car and all items and paperwork associated with it as soon as possible. Please let me know so that I can be ready for you.

Once you have recovered it, you should contact the finance company to repay them the money that they have provided to you by way of funding for the car. As you know I paid £3000 deposit. The finance company was not involved this and so I look forward to receiving this refund in full without delay

I have already contacted the finance company on this basis and they are expecting to hear from you.

 

Send a copy to the finance company as well.

Send a separate letter the finance company

 

Quote

As you can see, I have rejected the vehicle under my statutory entitlement to do so under the consumer rights act 2015.

This means that the contract is void and I now wish you to confirm that the finance agreement with you is dissolved and that I shall be refunded all monies paid over and above the amount provided by the loan.

In terms of the loan, you will have to apply to the dealer in order to recover your money.

Please confirm – and given your attitude so far when I have contacted you about this, you should understand that if there is any trouble then we shall be putting this before the financial ombudsman service and in anticipation of that, you can consider this that is my formal complaint.
I await confirmation that you are accepting the rejection or else if you do not, then your final response.

 

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Thanks BankFodder I will get onto this right now.

 

Just one more question - I have paid 3000 deposit by my debit card to BMW. Total car of cost was 18,000 - 3000 deposit = 15000 with the finance company. I hope I will not lose deposit money? 

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Not at all. The deposit money will be recoverable directly from the dealer. I'm amending the proposed letter above to refer to this

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Thank you ever so much. I will keep updating as we go along :) I hope this works out all well! 

 

Just FYI - I have only had option to update Black Horse via their portal, but once I did and no reference has been given. I have just called them to check if they can see on their system, and apparently they don't. I have just forwarded all the emails I have sent to them via email so now I have proof.

Edited by Karalius
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You need to show the loan company that you mean business. They won't like what you are doing at all.

Given a couple days and then phone them. If they think they don't have your documents then send them again but tell them you are beginning a formal complaint. You want a complaint reference number. You should be recording your calls. Read our customer services guide. You been here since 2017 so I expect that you record your calls anyway don't you?

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Well they have the formal phone complaint logged which is good. I have tried couple different apps, but it seems that apple is blocking the recordings and I am unable to make recordings.

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Hi, just giving update.

 

I received below email from BMW this morning. I had a phone call from them and been advised that car will be collected today on recovery truck. I am awaiting for them to get in touch with me to arrange this.

What can I do to protect myself in regards to the collection to ensure that vehicle is as they taking it away? Do I take pictures of the inside/outside once the vehicle is on the recovery truck? Milage etc? Anything I am missing here?

 

What do they mean in below email regards to subject to signing of settlement agreement and removal of any negative postings online?

 

Thanks

 

"Good Morning,

Thankyou for getting back to me and confirming.

I've forwarded your information across to the warranty company and they should be in touch with you shortly to organise for the recovery of the vehicle to us.

As noted in my previous email, the rejection of the vehicle will be subject to an inspection confirming the concern raised. Furthermore, it will also be subject to the signing of a settlement agreement and removal of any negative postings online. 

Once these elements have been confirmed, we will be able to proceed accordingly."

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