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Hermes damaged my parcel and disposed of it


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-Sold graphics card on Ebay (£700) using Hermes tracked, no insurance on 31/12/20. 

-Jan 4th 2021- Invoice from Hermes stating that I underestimated parcel weight and need to pay £6.66 

- Parcel arrived at Birmingham depot however later updated to "damaged beyond repair" and was disposed of due to Health and safety reasons.

 

Parcel was well-packaged and I have photographic evidence of this.

Hermes couldn't provide me with any photographic evidence of it being disposed.

 

- Despite submitting lost/damaged claim- received £22.32 compensation 17/02/21. I later sent an email saying I reject said refund.

- Applied online via small claims court- Hermes did not respond within 28 days so I filed for automatic judgement

- Hermes later defended the case and disputed the claim amount on the same day after I filed for judgement

 

My question is,

since I filed for automatic judgement before Hermes submitted their defence - Does the judgement not automatically rule in my favour?

Is there any chance I can win this case against Hermes.

 

I apologise if this is such a lengthy post its my first time here and I would really appreciate any advice anyone has! 

 

Thank you.

 

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Please will you post up documents in PDF format.

You need to post up the claim form as well.

Before a general comment on the situation – which we can only see when you have shown us the claim documents, I'm afraid that although it seems unfair, apply the judgement doesn't automatically grant it. They can still sneak in with their defence before your application for judgement is actually processed.

Hermes always leave things to the last moment and this is not the first time it has happened. I'm afraid although it's disappointing it seems unfair, if they managed to put in their defence before your application for a judgement was processed then their defence will have priority.

Please post up the relevant documents

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Hi,

 

Attached is the PDF document. By claim form do you mean particulars of claim?

 

This is what I submitted:

Quote

I paid Hermes to deliver a parcel (tracking
number X).My parcel contained
a graphics card that I had sold on Ebay.
Hermes sent an email stating that whilst
carrying out an audit my parcel weighed more
than declared weight so I had to pay an extra
£6.66 on top of original postage fees. When I
rang Hermes I was informed the parcel was
allegedly damaged.This was a very well
packaged item, in its original packaging then
packed into a larger box. I requested that
the item be delivered regardless, returned,
or I would collect it from the depot. Hermes
informed me that the parcel had been damaged
beyond repair and that they had disposed of
it. They were unwilling to provide me with
photographic evidence of the damage and were
unwilling to provide me with photographic
evidence of the damage and were unwilling to
allow me to collect my property. My claim is
that Hermes are in breach of contract as they
had not only been negligent with my property
but also had disposed of it, against my
wishes and without proof or explanation why.

 

Thank you!

 

 

Doc_20210601_194543.pdf

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There are quite a few things to say about this. Some of them you aren't going to like.

However, first of all you say that you asked them for evidence of the damage. Did you do this in writing? Did they decline in writing? Do you have copies of this writing?

Secondly, you declared it as £650 value and am afraid that limits the value of your claim. I'm not sure that you have read around the Hermes toys on this sub- forum but when you do start reading around you will discover that when you enter into a contract, you create expectations on either side. They create an expectation that they will deliver your parcel. You create an expectation in them that they are carrying a risk of £650. If the contract goes wrong then those are the liabilities.

When you read around the stories on this sub- forum, you will understand what we have to say about the insurance requirement and why it is unfair.

Next, they have taken your property and destroyed it without any reference to you. In other words they have acted as if they were the owners of the property – and in law they have effectively taken over ownership. This is known as the – tort of conversion – and it is contrary to the Torts (Wrongful Interference with Goods) Act 1977 and you could claim for their tort of conversion and you could claim discretionary damages of probably £100 or maybe £150.
You haven't done this and if you wanted to add this head of damage to your claim then I'm afraid that it would properly cost you over £200 to make the application notice in order to amend your claim and you would not get this money back because it was your fault that you hadn't put it in the first place.

This is a real shame, because we have had several instances of Hermes apparently damaging items and then simply destroyed them – or saying that they have destroyed them – without any permission, authority and without providing any evidence. We have had one claim go through so far for a Gucci bag which apparently was destroyed. The value was £650 and we added £100 on top for the conversion and Hermes paid out.

There are other cases which I think are going through at the moment involving the tort of conversion.

The unfortunate thing is that I see that you have been registered with this since March. It's a shame you didn't come here earlier because I can imagine that you issued your claim after you registered here when you knew that we existed and that we would help you. We would have urge you to read the Hermes stories and you would have discovered about the tort of conversion although we would have prompted you on this issue.

I'm not sure why you decided to register and then at least not read around the stories to understand the principles involved – and then even ask us to help you begin your claim, draft your documents et cetera.

On the basis that you probably won't want to spend the money adding a claim for conversion, the defence document which you received is absolutely their standard defence document. The next stage is that you will receive the directions questionnaire and they will probably indicate that they are happy go to mediation – and you should agree this.

Let us know when you get the directions questionnaire and in the meantime I strongly suggest that you read around the Hermes stories on this sub- forum so you understand how it all works, what the arguments are, in particular the attitude to their insurance requirement and also the mediation journey.

There are several excellent summaries of people's mediation experience here and you should pay good attention to them.

Keep us updated

Also, when we ask you to post up documents in PDF format – we really do mean that and it includes the claim form/particulars of claim which you have decided to type up. We prefer to receive in PDF format.

We provide free help but we would like people to cooperate with us and make it as easy as possible.

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Hi,

 

I really do regret not coming here earlier as you made some fantastic points.

 

With regards to the first point I did email them asking for photographic evidence and this was their response:

 
Quote

 

Thank you for contacting us with your enquiry.

Unfortunately, our depot have confirmed that the contents of this parcel have become damaged within our network.
 
Due to health and safety reasons, this parcel and the remaining contents have been disposed of at the depot.

Should you wish to submit a claim, please complete the following online form: 

In addition to this online form, please provide the following information in order for us to assess your claim;

• For items sold on eBay, please provide the eBay item number
• Proof of value e.g. PayPal receipt/invoice (Not required where eBay item number provided)

Please submit your claim within 14 days of this email.  Note; if no response is received, we will assume you no longer wish to pursue this claim and your incident will be closed.

On receipt of a completed claim, we will review the information within 14 working days and contact you again

Please accept my sincere apologies for any inconvenience this may have caused you.

 

 
 
- Secondly- I'm 99% sure I declared the value of the item as £700 as when I was submitting the claim form I attached evidence of my Ebay listing where the sold value was £700. Unfortunately there is no way to access submitted claim forms therefore I am not able to double check.
 
-During my particulars of claim I did state that the parcel was disposed of without my consent but I'm guessing this doesn't have the same power as Tort of conversion.
 
- I will keep you updated with the mediation. 
 
P.S I couldn't find a PDF version of the particulars of claim but I will try and upload future documents in PDF.
 
Thank you.
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Did you organise this delivery directly with Hermes or did you use an intermediary such as Packlink?

 

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If you made the booking directly through Hermes without using an eBay mechanism then it will be you who have been responsible for the declaration of value. That's the way I understand it. Had the delivery been organised through eBay then they would automatically have adopted the sale price of the item

They seem to be very clear on the defence that you declared only £650. I think it will be a good idea to write to them and ask them for evidence of the declaration.

It's a shame that you haven't kept copies or screenshots of your delivery arrangements because it was made things much easier.

I'm afraid that it is too late to claim for a Conversion without making a formal application to the court to modify your claim.

This would have allowed you to add a figure of about £100 or £150 on top of the value of your item. Damages for conversion aren't intended to represent the value of the item. Damages for conversion are intended to compensate you for the insult of having your ownership interfered with. It's a kind of trespass to property.

I'm not sure that there is much else to say at the moment. Let us know when you get your directions questionnaire but it's essential that you start reading the material that we have on this forum. It's all there. It's all free. It's just going to take some time

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  • 2 weeks later...
Posted (edited)

Hi,

This is what I received through the post. I got a notification saying that Hermes filed for a DQ on the 14/6. Does this mean I can no longer apply for mediation? I had to self-isolate for a few days so haven't sent the form out yet. Do i fill out the small claims track form or just the mediation one?

Not entirely sure what address for service means.

 

Thanks in advance

jpg2pdf-min (1).pdf

Screenshot 2021-06-15 at 06.05.11.pdf

Edited by am1779
additional info
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You should fill out the DQ and indicate that you are prepared to accept mediation.

Read the Hermes stories so that you have a complete understanding of how it goes

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Thank you. Is the address for service just my address? I have no solicitors/lawyers representing me

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Yes. You are litigant in person so it is your name and address

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