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    • The Notice to Hirer does not comply with the protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule  4 . This is before I ask if Europarks have sent you a copy of the PCN they sent to Arval along with a copy of the hire agreement et. if they haven't done that either you are totally in the clear and have nothing to worry about and nothing to pay. The PCN they have sent you is supposed to be paid by you according to the Act within 21 days. The chucklebuts have stated 28 days which is the time that motorists have to pay. Such a basic and simple thing . The Act came out in 2012 and still they cannot get it right which is very good news for you. Sadly there is no point in telling them- they won't accept it because they lose their chance to make any money out of you. they are hoping that by writing to you demanding money plus sending in their  unregulated debt collectors and sixth rate solicitors that you might be so frightened as to pay them money so that you can sleep at night. Don't be surprised if some of their letters are done in coloured crayons-that's the sort of  level of people you will be dealing with. Makes great bedding for the rabbits though. Euro tend not to be that litigious but while you can safely ignore the debt collectors just keep an eye out for a possible Letter of Claim. They are pretty rare but musn't be ignored. Let us know so that you can send a suitably snotty letter to them showing that you are not afraid of them and are happy to go to Court as you like winning.  
    • They did reply to my defence stating it would fail and enclosed copies of NOA, DN Term letter and account statements. All copies of T&C's that could be reconstructions and the IP address on there resolves to the town where MBNA offices are, not my location
    • Here are 7 of our top tips to help you connect with young people who have left school or otherwise disengaged.View the full article
    • My defence was standard no paperwork:   1.The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made. 2. Paragraph 1 is noted. The Defendant has had a contractual relationship with MBNA Limited in the past. The Defendant does not recognise the reference number provided by the claimant within its particulars and has sought verification from the claimant who is yet to comply with requests for further information. 3. Paragraph 2 is denied. The Defendant maintains that a default notice was never received. The Claimant is put to strict proof to that a default notice was issued by MBNA Limited and received by the Defendant. 4. Paragraph 3 is denied. The Defendant is unaware of any legal assignment or Notice of Assignment allegedly served from either the Claimant or MBNA Limited. 5. On the 02/01/2023 the Defendant requested information pertaining to this claim by way of a CCA 1974 Section 78 request. The claimant is yet to respond to this request. On the 19/05/2023 a CPR 31.14 request was sent to Kearns who is yet to respond. To date, 02/06/2023, no documentation has been received. The claimant remains in default of my section 78 request. 6. It is therefore denied with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant, the Claimant has failed to provide any evidence of proof of assignment being sent/ agreement/ balance/ breach or termination requested by CPR 31.14, therefore the Claimant is put to strict proof to: (a) show how the Defendant entered into an agreement; and (b) show and evidence the nature of breach and service of a default notice pursuant to Section 87(1) CCA1974 (c) show how the claimant has reached the amount claimed for; and (d) show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim; 7. As per Civil Procedure Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed. 8. On the alternative, as the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of Section 136 of the Law of Property Act and Section 82A of the consumer credit Act 1974. 9. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.
    • Monika the first four pages of the Private parking section have at least 12 of our members who have also been caught out on this scam site. That's around one quarter of all our current complaints. Usually we might expect two current complaints for the same park within 4 pages.  So you are in good company and have done well in appealing to McDonalds in an effort to resolve the matter without having  paid such a bunch of rogues. Most people blindly pay up. Met . Starbucks and McDonalds  are well aware of the situation and seem unwilling to make it easier for motorists to avoid getting caught. For instance, instead of photographing you, if they were honest and wanted you  to continue using their services again, they would have said "Excuse me but if you are going to go to Mc donalds from here, it will cost you £100." But no they kett quiet and are now pursuing you for probably a lot more than £100 now. They also know thst  they cannot charge anything over the amount stated on the car park signs. Their claims for £160 or £170 are unlawful yet so many pay that to avoid going to Court. When the truth is that Met are unlikely to take them to Court since they know they will lose. The PCNs are issued on airport land which is covered by Byelaws so only the driver can be pursued, not the keeper. But they keep writing to you as they do not know who was driving unless you gave it away when you appealed. Even if they know you were driving they should still lose in Court for several reasons. The reason we ask you to fill out our questionnaire is to help you if MET do decide to take you to Court in the end. Each member who visited the park may well have different experiences while there which can help when filling out a Witness statement [we will help you with that if it comes to it.] if you have thrown away the original PCN  and other paperwork you obviously haven't got a jerbil or a guinea pig as their paper makes great litter boxes for them.🙂 You can send an SAR to them to get all the information Met have on you to date. Though if you have been to several sites already, you may have done that by now. In the meantime, you will be being bombarded by illiterate debt collectors and sixth rate solicitors all threatening you with ever increasing amounts as well as being hung drawn and quartered. Their letters can all be safely ignored. On the odd chance that you may get a Letter of Claim from them just come back to us and we will get you to send a snotty letter back to them so that they know you are not happy, don't care a fig for their threats and will see them off in Court if they finally have the guts to carry on. If you do have the original PCN could you please post it up, carefully removing your name. address and car registration number but including dates and times. If not just click on the SAR to take you to the form to send to Met.
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CEL ANPR PCN PAPLOC - Port of Wells Car Park, the Quay, Wells-Next-The-Sea, NR231AT


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Date of the infringement 12/07/2020

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date] Not sure, i will check!

3 Date received 10/05/2021  

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?] It does!

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event? Yes, but only the car going in and out of the car park, not parked!

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal] No.

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up I keep getting letters in escalating threats, but following other posts advice, i have ignored and not replied.

7 Who is the parking company? Civil Enforcement have picked this one up.

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town] Port of Wells Car Park, the Quey, Wells-Next-The-Sea, NR231AT 

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under. It doesn't say.

There are two official bodies, the BPA and the IAS. If you are unsure, I think its BPA.

Hi,

you guys have helped before so again i'm looking for advice as i have tried to follow other threads and wanted to check a few things. 

I am the registered keeper, and I received the PCN last year for a parking violation of no ticket, but have been ignoring the letters as its addressed to me but I was not the person who was supposedly parking.

  Ironically there are no photos of the car being parked and from what I understand the car was never parked as no-one left the vehicle, only sort the kids out before continuing their journey.  

I have had other letters in the past which i don't have anymore as i have also moved so have a new address! 

Not sure if this effects me needing to correspond with them as have to get it from new owners. 

Its now asking to fill in the PAP which i don't really understand what it is?

  Is this the letter before court that other posts have mentioned? 

Any advice would be greatly received.

Many thanks.

Muzza26

 

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  • dx100uk changed the title to CEL ANPR PCN - Port of Wells Car Park, the Quey, Wells-Next-The-Sea, NR231AT

how long was the stay and this is a port covered by Port byelaws is it not??

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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post all you have received to date bothsides one multipage PDF only

had to remove you upload 

as crossing out with a pen is no good they can still see your details through the pen.

 

there are numerous questions unanswered get the answers from the paperwork to date

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • dx100uk changed the title to CEL ANPR PCN - Port of Wells Car Park, the Quay, Wells-Next-The-Sea, NR231AT

owned by the port harbour commissioners so i suspect byelaws might apply here

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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If it is within the harbour estate,

The Wells Harbour Revision Order 1994, 

General Bylaws, s.9,(1),(k) regulates the movement ,speed and parking of vehicles on the estate.  

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By "3 Date received" we meant when you received their first letter which they will have called a PCN.  It will show whether they have sent out their paperwork in time to create keeper liability.

 

In any case their claim is pants - bye-laws, 10 minutes' grace period, no actual parking, etc.

 

The letter they sent is rubbish as a Letter Before Action but they do go on about pre-action protocol so it's best you reply with a suitable snotty letter.  You also need to let them have your new address, otherwise they could sue you at your old address and you'd lose automatically as you'd know nowt about it.

We could do with some help from you.

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but dont give ANYTHING away you know they have no legal claim...

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Thanks all.  I have been trying to find the original letter where they had pictures of my car entering and leaving the car park, but stupidly i now can't find!  

 

So if i need to discretely contact them and change my address but without incriminating myself, how should i do this?  Do i just make a very basic letter with the reference number and inform them of my correspondence address? 

 

Also - should i ask for the original photo evidence again?

 

Thanks in advance.

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why?

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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No, they have sent you a letter mentioning Pre-Action Protocol so you need to try to disuade them from issuing a county court claimform by showing them you'd be trouble if they did do court and would hit them in the wallet.  Something like -

 

 

Dear CEL,

 

Re: PCN no. XXXXX

 

would you please note that I have moved from XXXXX to XXXXX.

 

Also, cheers for your letter dated XXXXX which I'm guessing was your teaboy's attempt at writing a Letter Before Action.  I had a good laugh at the idea that you really think a motorist would take such tripe seriously and would actually cough up.

 

Now you know and I know and now you know that I know all the reasons why your claims against motorists parking at the Port of Wells are complete pants.

 

You also scored a big own goal by sticking in £60 Unicorn Food Tax.  I doubt a judge would be very impressed by these made-up charges.

 

If you want to go to court, fine, I will go for an unreasonable costs order under CPR 27.14(2)(g) and then spend it all on a foreign holiday after borders reopen while laughing at your expense.

 

I look forward to your deafening silence.

 

 

I notice in post 9 a Letter Before Action is mentioned, but it seems to have disappeared from the thread.  Will you please redact and post it up again as I wouldn't want there to be something to contradict the proposed snotty letter.  Indeed redact and upload all the correspondence you have from the fleecers.

 

 

We could do with some help from you.

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FTMDave, thanks for the good laugh, i like the letter and think you have the tone just right!!

Here is the documents I have, which are pretty much the same and come in once a month! 

The original just had the details of the supposed crime, but only had a grainy picture of the car entering and leaving with a time stamp of how long it was there. 

still think I should send in same sarcastic tone?

Thanks.

Muzza26

letters i have....pdf

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Thanks.  I don't know why the letter disappeared after you uploaded it the first time.

 

However, I think I've got it wrong.  CEL wrote to you on 12.07.2020, later some powerless debt collectors wrote on 18.12.2020.  If so the matter is not at Letter Before Action stage.  You can simply go on ignoring CEL.

 

Is that right?  No other correspondence since 18.12.2020?

We could do with some help from you.

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prob got the letter on my server by not around till later, 

i believe it was just crossed out in pen and could be seen thru, though i thought i'd copied it back here hidden...but cag did go funny that time i think

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Did this 10.05.2021 letter include anything about Letter Before Action, Letter Before Claim, Letter of Claim, PAPLOC, or Pre-Action Protocol?

 

Or were there just the usual generic threats from CEL?

 

The difference is very important.  From memory, and from what is written in post 9, I think it was the former.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

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Hi, the only other part of the letter on the 10th May 21 is now attached.  

It is a reply for on if and how I will pay and asked for all my earnings with a load of cases that they have won.  
 

nothing about the final warning or letter before court, etc..

REPLY FORM.pdf

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Yes lookinforinfo, I seem to remember it was an LBA.

 

Muzza, for goodness sake learn from this and never throw away the paperwork when you're in legal dispute.  All that leads to is confusion and trying to guess what is going on.

 

So from Plan A to Plan B to Plan A again.  I've tweaked the snotty letter.  If none of the regulars suggest changes this evening, get it sent off tomorrow by normal post but get a free Certificate of Posting from the post office.

 

Dear CEL,

 

Re: PCN no. XXXXX

 

would you please note that I have moved from XXXXX to XXXXX.

 

Also, cheers for your letter dated 10 May which I'm guessing was your teaboy's attempt at writing a Letter Before Action.  I had a good laugh at the idea that you really think a motorist would take such tripe seriously and would actually cough up.

 

Now you know and I know and now you know that I know all the reasons why your claims against motorists parking at the Port of Wells are complete pants.

 

You also scored a big own goal by sticking in £82 Unicorn Food Tax.  I doubt a judge would be very impressed by these daft made-up charges.

 

If you want to go to court, fine, I will go for an unreasonable costs order under CPR 27.14(2)(g) and then spend it all on a foreign holiday after borders reopen while laughing at your expense.

 

I look forward to your deafening silence.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

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Thanks and yes I will get it posted tomorrow first thing, unless I hear otherwise.  
 

I agree, pretty daft to lose the original paperwork, I might have a better look tonight and see if I put it somewhere!  
 

How long after would I normally expect to see a court letter after the LBA?  How do they even know who was driving, do they have to guess and just take it the registered keeper was responsible? 
 

Thanks for the replies, you guys are extremely informative.  

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2 hours ago, Muzza26 said:

How long after would I normally expect to see a court letter after the LBA?  How do they even know who was driving, do they have to guess and just take it the registered keeper was responsible?  

Impossible to say.  Some of the PPCs are organised and about a month after the deadline given in the LBA they will sue who they have decided to sue.

 

But there's no rhyme or reason.  Some will crawl back under their stone and then a year later send another LBA from a firm of solicitors.

 

Yes, they usually just decide the keeper was the driver, and in fact have been hammered in court on this point countless times.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

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  • dx100uk changed the title to CEL ANPR PCN PAPLOC - Port of Wells Car Park, the Quay, Wells-Next-The-Sea, NR231AT
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