DWP Letter Saying I Owe £2078 - Tax Credits Overpayment From 2013 - UC Overpayment from 2021

[blondebubbles]

It would not have been possible for you to provide them with the 2013/14 income until after 6th April 2013. You'd need to find a call after that date to prove you updated the income correctly.

 

You couldn't have updated this on 3rd April 2013 as this was still in the 2012/13 year.

[mystic_bertie]

At the time i never realised this, i did not know the year end for tax credits was the 5th of April, i had been under the assumption it was the same as the tax year. So what you say is something that never occurred to me.

 

The overpayment is for 2013/14 and the award notice i received on july 2013 says my income is an estimate i provided for the 2013/14. So they were using a figure i never gave them for the current year. They were not using the previous years income.

[blondebubbles]

So what figure was this? They don't make figures up so it must have come from somewhere.

 

I'm sorry to say but so far it sounds like you failed to give them an estimate for 2013/14 (as you say you weren't aware of the tax year dates). These aren't just for tax credits, they are based on the tax year dates for income tax purposes.

[mystic_bertie]

I cant say for sure without that call thats missing.

 

At the time of the call i expected them to use my new earning for 2013/14, i did not know we were still in the previous years period. So im guessing they made an adjustment to my earnings to £9000 for the year 2012/13.

 

They have used the figure of £9000 as current year earnings for the 2013/14 period too, it states this was an estimate provided by me but that is not true. There is no way i would say my earnings were £9000 when they were gonna be about £38000.

[blondebubbles]

That call is irrelevant. No matter what you said about your 2013/14 income on that call, they couldn't do anything about it as the tax year had not started. They cannot update income for a year until the year starts.

 

The system goes down on 6th April to be upgraded for the new tax year. From then you could have updated 2013/14 income but not before 6th April.

[mystic_bertie]

Hi guys.

 

I started a thread in 2015 regarding tax credit overpayments see the link below.

 

I still owe HMRC £1400 according to them. I thought i had followed the right dispute process and when i wrote to the AO and i was told i had not followed the correct dispute process with HMRC i gave up.

 

I ended up paying £25 a month to a collection agency and i have reduced the debt by £940, i had to stop these payments because of job loss during the lockdown.

 

Now they have sent a fresh demand for the outstanding £1409. I'm in employment now but i still don't think i should pay this back as it was their mistake that these overpayments happened. Is this debt statue barred now by any chance?

 

 

[dx100uk]

threads merged

you should never pay a DCA for an HMRC debt, they'll be taking their cut, shows how legitimate it must be if they farmed collection out to a powerless DCA they are NOT bailiffs and have zero legal powers on any debt no matter what it's type

you should have ignored them.

 

deal with HMRC directly only.

 

[mystic_bertie]

Hi Dx many thanks for your reply.

 

I did not know this at the time as i could not be bothered with the hassle at the time and i assumed that you cant avoid these HMRC tax credits overpayment debts. I have done the SAR and wrote to them on a few occasions and wrote to the AO but as i said i was told i had not followed the correct procedures. So i gave up.

 

What should i do next? I am prepared to dispute it again or do what it takes to get rid of this debt caused by HMRC. 

[dx100uk]

they must prove the debt is legitimate and hold the data that proves this.

 

but no if the debt is legit then you can't avoid it but most certainly never pay it to a dca ever!

 

6 minutes ago, mystic_bertie said:

not followed the correct procedures.

what procedures?

 

[mystic_bertie]

Hi Dx thanks for your reply

 

Can i request that they prove the debt is legitimate?

 

on the tax credit casualties website it says there are 2 tiers to the dispute process so i assumed i have not done the tier 2 to their satisfaction but i thought i had. The AO would not entertain me.

[dx100uk]

send a new sar use the one on the HMRC website

[mystic_bertie]

Ok great will get onto that its good to see they now have it online.

 

I found the letters i sent to HMRC and these are my 2 tiers of the dispute so i dont know why HMRC claimed i had not done this to the AO.

[mystic_bertie]

I was working in a Temp job for 3 months and now i am back on UC benefits and HMRC are taking £110 from my benefit money. I already requested the SAR last week.

 

How can i stop them stealing money from me as this is torture.

Im not working at the moment and they are forcing me to pay them back money i have disputed already and failed. 

 

I sent the 2 dispute letters to HMRC in the past.

HMRC told me that 'i had done the 2 stages of the dispute'.

 

I then wrote to the AO and they told me i had not followed the correct dispute procedure with HMRC although HMRC told me i had.

 

I still have the old SAR that i received and there is a web chat there where the advisor verifies the above.

[London1971]

Hello,

 

Sorry you find yourself in this situation, this whole HMRC linking up with the DWP, and clawing back repayments via UC has been on the cards for years, they finally got clever , What's more, they seem to be paying no regard to the recipients financial circumstances.  In HMRC's mind people are claiming Universal Credit just for the fun of it, rather than because they can't afford their rent, and it's just fine to deduct food money from the most vulnerable in society, because of a mistake they may or may not have made 10 years ago.

 

So, in terms of your SAR, did you notice 

 

1 Any mistaken assumptions on their part with your income

2 Any phone calls that didn't happen

 

Sometimes they over estimate your income for a particular year, I'd go through that with a fine tooth combe. If that turns out to be the case then they would need to revise what you owed them.

 

Then I'd take a look at this Link

 

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/953377/HMRC_organisation_chart_January_2021.pdf

 

Find the correct person to write to, right at the top.  2 copies, one to the Director, one to  perhaps the 'well being champion'

 

Reference number, Name Etc

 

The general Gist of your letter, should be that you feel bad that you still owe money, and would like nothing better than to pay it back, you understand the importance of public finances blah blah  

 

You've worked all your life, but because of the Pandemic you are now forced to reply on your monthly UC payment of £xxx to eat and pay rent. Quite simply the deduction of £xxx is forcing me to choose between heating my home and eating dinner.  I'd be very grateful if you could stop deductions for 6 months, giving me the chance to get myself back onto my feet after Covid. At that point I'd be more than happy to come to an arrangement to pay this back,

 

Kind Regards

 

XXX

 

 

Doing the above, in writing by recorded Royal Mail, gives you a better than 50% chance of stopping this. Remember you have far more power than you think, I got a letter back from the Chancellor of the Exchequer (Philip Hammond) on my case a few years back.

 

 

[mystic_bertie]

Many Thanks for your very helpful reply and Yes your right its just awful how they don't seem to care about the damage they do and just claw it back.

 

When it came to my income, from what i remember i had informed them of a new job which i had just started and it had a much higher wage that my previous earnings. I was anal about informing them of every change right away as i wanted to keep out of trouble. They ended up using my previous years earnings which were much lower for the calculation, i was not aware of this and as a result i was overpaid. By the time i realised it was too late and i was overpaid about £4300. There was 3 calls missing from the SAR and the one where i call them to inform them of the changes is missing surprise surprise!

 

Do i write to these guys below would you agree these are the right people? Many thanks for your idea and i will get a letter sent off right away.

 

Benefits and Credits Operations Adam Altoft (Interim) and 

Director General, Customer Services Wellbeing Champion Karl Khan** (Interim)

[London1971]

On my SAR it was the opposite , rather than taking a call away they added one that was never made.

 

Definitely write to them, don’t hold your breath, it might take a while for a response but you may well get a result.

 

look on the bright side, once you are up and running and off UC they can go sing for it!

[mystic_bertie]

Thanks for your reply. I am about to write this letter today, i know who to send it to but what address should i use?

 

I will lay it on thick and hope to get them off my back for now.

 

 I think i should attempt to tackle this debt as there is no guarentee i can stay off of UC. Im not sure if this is still possible but i will wait until i receive the new SAR.

[London1971]

Income Tax: general enquiries - GOV.UK

WWW.GOV.UK

---

Contact HMRC for help with questions about Income Tax, including PAYE coding notices and Marriage Allowance, and...

 

[mystic_bertie]

thanks for the link that goes to income tax address.

 

I found this will i post to the second address?

 

Tax credit renewal forms

Send tax credit renewal forms to this address. You do not need to include a street name or PO box.

Couriers should use a different address.

Tax Credit Office
HM Revenue and Customs
BX9 1LR
United Kingdom

Complaints or change of circumstances

Send complaints or changes in your circumstances to this address. You do not need to include a street name or PO box.

Make it clear why you’re writing. For example, write ‘change of circumstances’ or ‘complaint’ at the top of your letter.

Couriers should use a different address.

HM Revenue and Customs
Tax Credit Office
BX9 1ER
United Kingdom

 

Guys is this the right address to try and stop my UC deductions? I picked these guys from the chart as requested but im not sure if this is correct.

 

FAO -  Adam Altoft 

Complaints
HMRC - Tax Credit Office
BX9 1ER

 

FAO - Karl Khan

Complaints
HMRC - Tax Credit Office
BX9 1ER

[mystic_bertie]

Guys HMRC are deducting over £100 a month from my UC. Someone on here advised me to write a letter to the director and another copy to the well being champion. I have composed my letter but where do i send these 2 letters to as im not sure if its the typical HMRC address or a specific address to get the attention or these people. 

[unclebulgaria67]

You need to take this up with DWP Debt Managment.  Raise a dispute with them and ask them for proof there is a debt still owing to HMRC.

DWP Debt Management team

Telephone: 0800 916 0647

 

Debt Management (C)
Mail Handling Site A
Wolverhampton
WV98 2DF

 

DWP Debt Management customer service standards - GOV.UK

WWW.GOV.UK

 

[dx100uk]

threads merged.

 

dx

 

[London1971]

Yup there you go it's all been transferred over to the DWP, mine pre dated that. Give them a call, tomorrow first thing and explain circumstances.

[mystic_bertie]

UncleBulgaria67 many thanks for your reply i shall give them a call tomorrow and see what they say.

 

Are these people able to halt my payments for now? 

 

Do i need to raise the dispute with them over the phone? 

 

London1971 many thanks for your help its much appreciated.

 

[unclebulgaria67]

Depends on what information you provide.  DWP Debt Management won't stop the deduction, unless there is a clear indication of there being an error with the debt.

 

If you phone them, provide as much information as possible and ask them to raise a dispute.