Anglia Water CCJ's/CO's, Order Of Sale for +10yrs of backdated Surface water charges i'd either paid or are bogus. i lost everything.

[frettful38]

Where a claim is defended it is then transferred to the appropriate local county court.

 

You could ring the court also and ask for advice

 

http://www.consumerwiki.co.uk/index.php/Small_Claims_FAQ

[meursault22]

The hearing has been scheduled at the most convenient court for the debt collector where they are holding hearings all day. I phoned the court who advised me that I should write requesting it be transferred to the most convenient court for me, but the judge has refused to release the hearing, and this isn't the first time!

[dadofholly]

There must be some kind of complaints procedure.

Put in a complaint to the ministry of justice via their website.

Are you a litigant in person? or are you defending under a company name?

 

Here is a link to Ministry Of Justice website.

The link covers the automatic transfer under cpr 26.2

Does this cover you? If so say so in your letter and make a complaint as such.

 

http://www.justice.gov.uk/civil/procrules_fin/contents/parts/part26.htm#IDATUOVB

 

Would imagine that under normal circumstances 26.2 (1) b and d would probably apply to you.

[meursault22]

Thanks, that's a great idea.

I am a litigant in person and I quoted CPR 26.2 in my letter requesting a transfer. The fact that the judge has refused to release the case already shows prejudice. I'll put in a complaint.

[meursault22]

Hi, after being hammered with repeated charging orders and orders for sale, all based on legal costs by the water company, I can't see any way out and have handed the keys in to my mortgage company. The house is in negative equity so after they sell it, there will not be anything left,

 

There are four charging orders by the water company.

Two of them have been paid.

 

I paid the first one when there was just one, thinking it would sort everything out, but they swiftly put a second one in place for their legal costs of dealing with the first one. I paid that too, but two more followed suit.

 

The first two although paid, have not been removed, so there is a total of four, amounting to around ten grand.

What happens to them?

 

By the way, the mortgage company are being very helpful and were extremely reluctant to take the property and have also agreed to rent it back to me until I'm sorted!

 

They say it's up to the water company to apply to the courts to have the charging orders converted to unsecured debt as there isn't enough equity to pay them off.

 

Is this right?

[newstarter]

If you can get down to that lender and get those keys back A.S.A.P ,say anything you like but get those keys back for crying out loud you will loose a fortune if your not careful

 

.Now, i need more information,

(1) how much in total

(2) over how many years and also can you give a bit more info on how this all started.

 

Above all dont let these bullies make you give up your home, i know you have had enough of this pressure but this is your home were talking about so why should you be bullied into loosing the roof over your head, get back to us with all the info a.s.a.p, FIRST ON THE LISTOF TO DO,S, GET THOSE KEYS BACK.

 

They can of course by law apply for a charging order and an order for sale, however take a look at Bank of Ireland vs Bell 2001 which stresses the need to safeguard lenders and creditors, but the sale should only be forced if this would prove no real hardship to the debtor as in Mortgage Corporation vs Shaire 2000., this can be your skeleton argument in an N244 defence, you really have no need to be taking all this c**p from the water company

 

p.s one more thing, the charging order secures the judgement ,not the money owed as some people may think.

[meursault22]

Thanks, I will take your advice, and think some more.

 

It shouln't be too hard to get the keys back since they were very reluctant to take the house, but I did think long and hard and decided that I'd rather the people I borrowed money from have the house rather than the water company, who in my mind have no moral right to anything

 

it all started over them never coming to connect the water, but instead getting a judgement from the Northampton bulk centre, which I only heard about when the land registry wrote to tell me the first charging order had been applied. They then started with and order for sale, were granted huge costs for this although the application was dismissed. 

The costs were then made into a charging order and another order of sale application straight away.

 

I was advised by my solicitor that if I didn't pay this, I'd lose my home, so I sold everything I could lay my hands on and paid, but that didn't stop them being granted yet more costs, and another c.o. and so on. They just won't stop until they've got everything.

 

ve suffered a stroke, most probably from the stress, and just want out. I've tried everything and have had some excellent advice from this forum which has worked for some, but it hasn't worked for me.

 

I had a N244 hearing to have the original judgement set aside and although the judge agreed that the original alleged debt was unsound, he said that he first had to be convinced that I had not been served with the original summons by Northampton and he said there was no reason to doubt that it had not been correctly served other than my word that I had not received it, he dismissed my application and granted the water company another huge amount in costs.

 

I know that legally, they shouldn't even start order for sale proceedings on a property in negative equity, but the judge does not agree!

 

I just think it's time to start again. Although it is my home, I haven't managed to renovate it as i'd hoped and it's still a half done building site.

 

By the way, I've no problem with the lender. I've never been late on a payment, and it's a great deal (1.45% ) and there's £48,000 left over another ten years.

 

Thanks again for your advice.

[newstarter]

get those keys back,come back to this forum and we will go from there either Ellen or myself will help you through this and get these people off your back once and for all.

[newstarter]

I notice that you have two charging orders that have been paid, you can apply to the court to have those discharged, ask the court for a certificate of satisfaction on those two county court judgements and include evidence of payment in your application, that gets those two sorted.

[meursault22]

I already did this, sending proof of payment, receipts, and the £15 fee for a certificate of satisfaction, and the court replied, refunding my £15 and stating that they could not issue a certificate of satisfaction because there were unpaid costs (which are the other charging orders).

 

Unfortunately, the firm of solicitors that the water company have formed a "strategic partnership" with, are big fish in this little stinky pond and they have alot of influence in the local court.

 

On several occasions, I have written to the court, only to receive a (rather threatening) reply from the water company's solicitors rather than the court.

[newstarter]

OK i get the picture so the two current charging orders in force are soley due to court costs can you tell me what the figure stands at now regarding those two orders

 

is the property owned by you only or is it jointly owned ?

 

are you the only person resident in the property

 

could you not attend any hearings because of your recent health

 

a lot of questions i know but under the charging orders act 1979 the court must consider all the circumstances of the case in particular the personal circumstances of the debtor.

You must now send a S.A.R request to both the water board ,and one to their solicitors,you need to ask for (in both cases)every scrap of information they hold about you and your account,dates of payments

 

court papers

 

correspondence to their solicitors

 

court documents

 

copies of original ccj,s

 

in other words everything,including details of the original dispute

 

and again to the solicitor, court papers

 

copies of letters to you

 

again,everything they hold about you and your dispute with their client.

 

Each S.A.R will cost you 10 pounds (in postal order form) and they have 40 days in which to supply you with the above.

 

I think this will be a good place to start as it will provide us with the information we need to N244 this and and get these orders set aside ,it will also let them know that you mean business, dont be worried about their reps threats in letter form we can deal with these ,

 

i suspect that when you went into the hearing you had not got much in the way of a defence and that's why you have been walked over, get the above underway and lets fight back at these bloodsuckers.

[meursault22]

You make it sound so simple, but for one, I have exhausted the court system at great expense to myself. The only thing I gained was the knowledge that you cannot fight against judges who are either extremely biased, corrupt, or just plain stupid and who reserve the case to themselves.

 

Secondly, it is not a utility bill. There was never any unpaid utility bill. This is over court costs that the solicitors acting for the water company have been granted.

 

My own part 20 claim was dismissed because the judge insisted that it was filed too late (it was filed with my defence but he refused to look at the date on which it was filed and instead took the word of the opposing solicitors), and costs awarded again to the water company, even though no defence was ever filed against my claim.

 

I have sold everything I own and given the money to the water company but that just encouraged them to believe that there was even more money to be had and they took me to court for thousands more in solicitors costs. You just can't fight against this.

 

I have tried very hard to reason with them, but they just won't stop harassing me. It has made me insolvent and ill. Bankruptcy looks very appealing. I just wanted to be sure those debt would be wiped out. I don't have any other debts, but the costs they have been awarded are many thousands of pounds.

 

So, dodgygeezer, why should I trust you?

 

I was told I need to write to ask for the property back, so I've written to the mortgage company and just waiting to hear back.

 

I did request a S.A.R. and the water company came up with every excuse under the sun about the files no longer existing, claiming they sent everything to me and that I must have lost it, etc... etc...

 

I submitted an N244 asking the court to order the water company to comply with the S.A.R request, but the judge dismissed my request. I also went down the route of requesting a set aside of the original judgement as it had never been defended, but the judge ordered that he was satisfied that I had been correctly served with a summons from Northampton Bulk Centre (even though the original summons could not be found) and that I had made a deliberate decision not to defend it!!!!

 

I can't stress how much I have really tried everything. I would not loose my home lightly but it really seems time to cut me losses. At least handing the keys to the mortgage company, most of the mortgage would be dealt with and it would stop the water company is their tracks.

 

I have heard from a poor unfortunate who had an order for sale granted to the water company, that they charged him the whole amount achieved by the sale of his home in administration and legal costs, so he actually ended up still owing as much.

 

I really want to avoid that, and want the mortgage company to get the money I borrowed from them, and not for that money to go to the water company, from whom I never borrowed a penny.

[meursault22]

Well, I got my final reply back, and the house is gone. They offered to rent it back to me for the moment, but since the house is in almost derelict condition, I'll probably only carry on with this till I can find something else affordable or get housing benefit sorted. At least its one worry off my mind.

 

The firm of debt collectors are big fish in a small stinky pond. In this small town, they own the court, own the judges etc... There was never going to be a good outcome and at least this way the water company and their debt collectors can't take everything and leave me still owing the mortgage providers, which was their plan.

[meursault22]

AW are an extremely devious and greedy bunch of liars. At this point I would be checking daily with the Northampton bulk claims court as they tend to send summons to a previous address, so you never get to find out about the hearing and they win by default then amazingly come up with your correct address afterwards. In my case, they also spelled my name wrongly in continually changing ways, to make it impossible for me to keep track of anything.

 

My only advice, which isn't worth much since I ended up losing everything to them, is to not pay anything. It's tempting borrow money wherever you can get it, thinking that it will make them go away, but at the slightest sniff of money, they get much much more aggressive, assuming that there's millions more they can squeeze out of you.

 

That is my biggest regret. All my friends told me to borrow money and insisted that even though the money was never owed in the first instance, that it would be easier and less stressfull just to pay it to get them off my back, well the only difference it made was to make them behave even worse, and to end up owing money to others.

 

Sorry for repeating myself again, but I don't want you to fall down the same hole as I did.

Just about everyone seems to be under the misaprehension that AW are the "good old honest Water Board" but they are just a private company in a powerful position willing to abuse it to the hilt for a bit more money.

Edited August 19, 2011 by meursault22

[dx100uk]

anglian water are simply a util co

no diff than a catalogue do

they are not a priority debt either

how come you lost 'everything' to them.....

 

dx

 

[meursault22]

They are very devious and employ a large number of solicitors both in house and externally. They have judges who will reserve the case to themselves, and they took out a number of charging orders for their legal costs of recovering a debt which did not exist.

 

My mortgage company even wrote objecting to the charging orders, but the judge just approved them. Then they went for order for sale, after order for sale, after order for sale, and each time the thousands of pounds the judge granted them for the order of sale procedure was made into another charging order and so on down the ever increasing spiral.

 

In the end, it came down to either handing the keys back to the mortgage company, and at least not owing them as much money (It was in negative equity), or letting the house be taken by AW who would have taken it all in administration fees, and still owing the mortgage.

 

AW are not just another utility. With any other utility you can change to a different one. Have you tried changing your water company because they behave unfairly?

 

The other way they are different is that under normal circumstances, you have to either borrow money or buy something and not pay for it to end up in debt. As I found out, AW have the right to charge for something they have not supplied and then have the right to add solicitors fees ad infinitum even though you never chose to do business with them.

[dx100uk]

many threads mrged

title changed

 

dx

[Guest Tooth Fairy Wishes]

WOW meursault22!!

 

How the hell you managed to stay sane I will never know going through this nightmare!!

 

Anyways from my own personal experience, I won a set aside procedure as Mr A who took me to Court used illegal means to get my address & still managed to send it to the wrong number!! We won on this fact alone for our Judgement to be set aside!! Our Judge told us what to do next I.E. counter claim etc & we settled out of court.

 

So how on earth the Judge who sat at your case got away with this I do not know!! Let alone the fact he reserved this case for himself only!! (We also did get our case moved from one county to another as we worried about conflict as Mr A was a member of the police there.) Was there no option for you for taking this to a Higher Court at all?

 

Did you ever sort out your issue with Scottish power regarding Gas meter that did not give you gas?

 

You sure as hell got "done over" & to end up loosing everything just plain stinks!!

 

I hope the future for you is a lot better & that one day this will all be a horrible nightmare that you can move on from.

 

Good luck!

[meursault22]

Hi,

can anyone here help with advice?

 

I moved from a house several years ago but a couple of the utilities refuse to remove me from the bill.

 

In particular, the water company even added a subsequent tenant to my name to create a joint account with somebody I don't even know.

 

They keep taking me to court as well and if it were not for a friendly ex-neighbour who keeps collecting post and sending it on to me,

 

I woudn't even know about it.

 

As it is, I've tried reasoning with the company but they say that it is against policy to remove a name from a bill which is subject to court action, and they keep taking me to court. I did all the right things in notifying them and writing by special delivery etc...

 

How can I get out of this mess?

 

The gas company has behaved in a similar way, sending bills in my name and taking me to court over them but the strange thing is that there never was any gas supply to the property.

[dx100uk]

so what happened whn you went to court?

 

all you have to do is send them a coucil tax bill or utils bill

or copy of voters to prove you dont reside there anymore.

 

this sounds very strange to me.

 

dx

[meursault22]

Sorry for the delayed response because of my lack of internet.

 

In court it seems to depend entirely on the judge. Some of them who have actually looked at the details just dismissed the case, but a couple of judges in particular seem so biased in favour of utilities that they granted liability orders than meant I had to pay regardless of anything.

 

I have provided evidence of my new address and really can't understand why bills keep cropping up in my name. I can only guess that if they can manage to get money through court action, regardless of whether the money is owed, they'll just keep on with it?

 

Can I perhaps obtain a court order to force them to take my name off the bill?

[renegadeimp]

You DONT have to pay. As dx said, just provide proof that you arent resident at the building, and the judge would be very foolish to find in favour against you. They would be risking their job.

 

Again, all you need is evidence that you no longer live there.

[Desperate Daniella]

Surely you haven't been told by a judge to pay for gas when there was no supply at the property? The gas company would have to provide bills as evidence.

[meursault22]

A few years ago I was evicted from my home. The water company took out several charging orders based on their legal costs then an order for sale. This was all based on rainwater drainage charges as there was and still is no water connected to the property.

 

they never changed the title at the land registry resulting in me being relentlessly pursued for all the costs associated with the property which I have paid. just over a year ago I tried the back door key and it still worked! Nobody has been in the house

 

my question is whether there is a time limit that to change the title after which it would revert to being my property?

 

The house is in derelict condition and clearly not at all what anyone was expecting.

[dx100uk]

9 threads merged on the complete history.

 

pop onto the .gov.uk landregistry get a copy of the deeds se if anything is listed.