Selling a property

[Lecter]

I'm currently selling a property, its almost gone through to handover, however, I keep getting questions from buyers solicitor regarding a porch I had built on the side of the house around 2008, I had no planning permission as I was told by the builder it was under a certain size, not restricting access and not near a boundary, I don't have any certificates now either it was that long ago.

 

The buyer is very happy with the porch and wants to keep it, their solicitor is getting right on my wick and with the stress, I'm close to telling them if it dosent go through soon I'm pulling out of the sale, although I don't want to, and I know it will cost me then.

 

All this after 100 questions regards gas certs, wood burning stove certs, garage certs, the garage and porch are on the exact sites of where the originals were when I purchased the property in 2004, I never had all these questions then, why so many now ?

 

Ive spoken to the buyer , they desperately want to keep the garage, porch and wood burning stove, so why they problems ?

Any advice would be much appreciated.

[AndyOrch]

I was involved in exact same situation a few years back ...obviously the red tape pre sales surveys are getting far more complex now which conveyancing solicitors must go through to cover themselves...but in my instance I thought it was more simply an exercise to justify their conveyancing bill.

 

I threatened to pull out and put it back on the market and the potential buyer would have to stand all their fees incurred so far.....the sale went through within 5 days without a hitch.

 

As in your case it wasn't the buyer being difficult...but their conveyancing Solicitor. 

 

Topic moved to General Legal Issues Forum.

 

Andy

[BankFodder]

I also had experience with this a few years ago. This is a solicitor who is being extremely cautious in protecting their own backside – client comes second.

I've found that most of the answers are things like "the seller is not aware". "The seller has no knowledge" – and in terms of planning permission relating to the porch, I would simply put "the seller believes that no planning permission is necessary".

Filling those questions broadly like that and send it back and if they want clarification on any particular questions and they can let you know

[dx100uk]

couldn't agree more

simply conveyancing Solicitors ranking up fees.

when my neighbour bought their property their purchase was held up for 9mts by their own solicitors!

 

i enquired why it was delayed, they didn't really know, turned out it was over an ice house built in the 17th century!! that the sellers could not provide my neighbours solicitor planning perm for..

 

.told them how utterly stupid this was and threaten to pull out...  they moved in 3 days later and got almost £3500 knocked off their conveyancing bill too!

[Lecter]

Thanks for the replies, think I'll contact buyer myself and let him know whats going on , hopefully they'll get a good few bob knocked off as well.

Thanks again.

[BankFodder]

It might be an idea to contact the buyer – but in a nonthreatening way simply say that there is a possibility that you may have to sell elsewhere because somebody else is expressing interest and you consider that their solicitors holding things up.

If you express that in a reasonable way rather than in a conflict oriented way, that might add a little more motivation

[Lecter]

Just to update you.

I contacted the buyer and he's been on the case of his solicitor, he's happy with my side of things and it finally looks like we are progressing, Ive said I don't have proof of who built the porch,

 

that said, there seems to be a sticking point regards the wood burning stove, it was already installed when I bought the property in 2004, its had the chimney swept regularly but now it appears it would need a new plate fitting among other things to bring it up to Hetas regulations,

 

Hetas wasn't even around in 2004 so where do I stand now, why should I pay to have things done and would the buyer be able to get house insurance without a cert for it ??

 

It seems as soon as I clear one thing up another problem occurs.

 

[honeybee13]

Hi.

 

I'm sorry you're going through this. Do you know if the buyer is using a local solicitor or a telephone/internet conveyancing firm with a lot of paralegals who have a few solicitors supervising them?

 

I don't have a solution to the problem, sadly, but we had a buyer who was using a call centre type conveyancing firm a few years ago. They were unable to do anything quickly and just had ticklist questions that they kept asking. Every time they had an answer, the file went to a proper lawyer and was then referred back with further questions and it drove our lawyer mad. If you could tell us if it's a law firm or a telephone outfit, it might help us to figure out tactics.

 

HB

[Lecter]

Hi 

I'm unsre on that, but the tick list sheet is pretty much what they're using, every time I send the list back they conveniently come back with something else to question, in fairness its driving the buyer mad as well.

I've got a gas safe cert for the boiler and gas fire and going to pass that on and say the wood burner was installed prior to me buying the property in 2004, also before Hetas were invented, if they don't except that I'll simply say I'm taking the wood stove out and will make good the fireplace.

The buyer also said he's paid a one off conveyancing fee to his knowledge and isn't paying anymore.

Once again, many thanks for the help.

[honeybee13]

If you are interested in checking on the people your buyer is using, this article from the Money Advice Service has information that should help you to find out.

 

https://www.moneyadviceservice.org.uk/en/articles/find-the-right-solicitor-or-conveyancer

 

HB

[Lecter]

The latest on the property as of an email today, I'm getting stressed and very annoyed and don't know what to do now.

 

Title indemnity policy

They are now telling me I need an insurance policy, the buyers solicitor has identified a need for a breach of covenant indemnity policy, they are saying that I should protect the buyer from further against future reproach from the persons who imposed the covenants, and I should not make any approach to any third party, in particular, Harry Baxendale who had the property in and conveyance in 1935.

I didn't have to jump through hoops when I bought the property in 2004 , what going on, please help !!!

[honeybee13]

Are you aware of any covenant? Asking you to contact someone who owned it in 1935 seems a bit daft, how do they expect you to contact them?

 

It looks more and more like tick boxes, does your lawyer have any ideas how to get things moving?

 

HB

[AndyOrch]

Further new red tape I'm afraid...rather like a PPI policy...useless.

 

You do not have to agree to purchase if you reach an agreement with the buyer....or you can agree to to pay half with the buyer.

 

https://levisolicitors.co.uk/news/purchaser-property-asking-indemnity-policy-i-pay/

[Lecter]

Not aware of any covenant, they telling me not to contact the original owner from 1935, who I presume is dead, I don't know if he put a covenant on it, what exactly is a convenient ?

[AndyOrch]

Is the property leasehold or freehold ?

[Lecter]

This is what the letter states :

 

I write to inform you the buyers legal representative has identified a need for a breach of covenant indemnity policy, As you may be aware, the porch, garage and conservatory have been erected the property in breach of the restrictive covenants contained in the title documents. Your buyers solicitors have requested that you provide an appropriate indemnity policy to protect your buyers against future reproach by the person who imposed the covenants.

Please do not make any approach to any third party , in particular the Harry Baxendale with regard to the porch, garage and conservatory as this may render any proposed indemnity insurance policy void.Under the terms of these policies you are not permitted to discuss the matters for which insurance has been obtained with any third party.

In respect of that , the buyers legal representative has asked that you pay for the the policy referred to above. The premium is £104.70 , our fee for arranging it is £90.

 

As far as I'm concerned the house went on sale and someone agreed to buy.

The garage and porch are on the site of the original garage and porch, there is no conservatory, also Mr Baxendale is dead.

[Lecter]

Freehold, this is also attached.

 

Restrictive Covenant (Freehold)

A claim by a third party enforcing the restrictive covenants contained
in a Conveyance dated 07/06/1935 and made between Harry
Baxendale, John Edward Smith and Bernard Percy Eccles and
Gertrude Midgley Eccles.
The coverage for this Known Risk is provided based on the following
assumptions:
1. There has been no attempt to contact the persons thought
to have the benefit of the covenants and no notice of any
breach from a third party relating to the breach of freehold
restrictive covenants.
2. The freehold restrictive covenants were imposed more than
10 years ago.
3. The property has been used as a residential dwelling for a
minimum of 12 months.
4. If alterations or additions were carried out in the 12 months
prior to Policy Date, building regulations and planning
permissions were obtained if required and there were no
material objections raised at planning stages.

[AndyOrch]

Read the link I provided above....its very unlikely that anything would come of the covenant...its very unlikely that the buyers are concerned....its without doubt most likely their solicitor will get a commission for selling the insurance.

[Lecter]

Would the indemnity cover me for other situations once the sale goes through : i.e., the new owner has issues with another problem , say, a loose slate or internal doors that don't close properly, or even the kitchen cabinets are not fitted as they initially thought, surely the buyer could concoct anything,  this list can be ongoing can't it !!

[AndyOrch]

The policies differ and  cover different eventualities......request a copy of the policy first.....if you want it then see if the buyer is willing to go half with you.

 

The items above you state there is no comeback...its very unlikely you will hear from them again....once you have completed.

[Lecter]

Thanks again to all who contributed, I shall hopefully soon, posting to say "final handover completed" 

[AndyOrch]