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    • Thanks everyone. Will speak with the manager first chance I get later today and let you know.
    • own topic created  tnx the info. dx  
    • this debt: MBNA Bank of Scotland Card debt- LInk got a CCJ - now want payment review - MBNA - Consumer Action Group and a barclaycard loan - did you ever send the a CCA in all these years.....when was it taken out?    
    • Welcome to the Forum. The PCN must be subject to Bye laws as the warning near the bottom of the PCN does not comply with the protection of Freedoms Act 2012 Schedule 4 Under Section 9 [2][f[] of the Act it should say: (f)warn the keeper that if, after the period of 28 days beginning with the day after that on which the notice is given— (i)the amount of the unpaid parking charges specified under paragraph (d) has not been paid in full, and (ii)the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver ,the creditor will (if all the applicable conditions under this Schedule are met) have the right to recover from the keeper so much of that amount as remains unpaid; Their version states they are pursuing you as the driver [because of the Bye laws they cannot transfer the liability from the driver to the keeper] even though you are the keeper. Should it go to Court Judges do not accept that the driver and the keeper are the same person. Obviously on many occasions another member of the family may be driving instead of the keeper. Indeed anyone with a valid motor insurance policy is able to drive your car. if any of the three cars were not driven by the keeper they are not liable to pay the PCN only the driver is.  as long as they do not divulge who was driving those lovely people at Alliance haven't a hope of winning against them in Court. What a shame. However while those keepers who were not driving are in the clear all is not lost for the other keeper drivers. Alliance still have to prove who was driving which is difficult providing those keepers do not appeal.  It is quite often that on appeal the keeper may say "I entered the car park at....."  immediately giving away that they were the driver. Plus even if you appeal it won't be accepted as a] they lose £100 straight away and b] mostly all the major car parking companies are dishonest scrotes. In the meantime you will be on the receiving end of threatening letters from Alliance, unregulated debt collectors and fifth, sixth or even lower rated solicitors all trying to frighten the life out of you to cough up. They can all be safely ignored since if you don't contact any of them they don't know who was driving so have no information that the can use in Court to identify the driver. Some time in the future they may send you a Letter of Claim which must not be ignored. Just let us know and we will advise a suitable snotty letter to send them which will show that you are not afraid of them and are happy to turn up in court knowing that you will win. Sorry it was a bit long winded.  
    • He’s still At it from a bungalow on Haslingden Road. Changed name to Bamberbridge cars with a Preston based phone number (01772) but dodgy dealings at the bungalow are still a go.
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Unknown CEL PCN CCJ - Metro Inn, Birmingham Road, Walsall, WS5 3 - How do I get it removed?


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 Date of the Incident 13/06/2017
 

 Date CCJ received 13/04/2018

 

Amount  £325.22

 

Is there any photographic evidence of the event?Unsure
 

Have you appealed? [Y/N?] N - Have written many times
 

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] N - Just more demands for payment
 

Who is the parking company?Civil Enforcement Ltd

 

 Where exactly [carpark name and town]Metro Inn, Birmingham Road, Walsall, WS5 3AB
 

Hi Everyone.  I am in a pickle and seeking help and advice about how to tackle CEL.  

 

My partner used to run a weekly open Mic night at the Metro Inn Hotel ( where I incurred the PCN).  I used to drop his music equipment off each week... literally drop and go.  

 

Then the hotel had a new parking system installed, which I did not realise and after dropping off the equipment one of the weeks I incurred a PCN from CEL.  

I took the letter to the Hotel Manager and he said he would call them up and get it cancelled, as he had received a lot of complains from people about the new parking system and people incurring unnecessary PCN and had called them a few times already to get the charges cancelled.   There was only one sign that I noticed afterwards and that was an A4 piece of paper stuck to the Hotel Reception door.  

 

My PCN did not end up cancelled, it just escalated more and more.  

I wrote to them several times trying to explain that I was merely dropping equipment for someone who worked there.

 

 It went on... and on...  eventually I began to ignore the letters as believed that the PCN could not be enforced.  

My partner also stopped working at the Metro Inn Hotel open Mic Night as the car park issue stopped regular attendees from coming to the weekly event, after many of them had fallen foul of the PCNs too and the Open Mic night died a death.

 

 Much later down the line and after a call to CEL I went back to the Hotel Manager to see if he could try and resolve it once more, only he had ceased working there and had been replaced my a new manager who said it was nothing to do with him and shrugged his shoulders at me.  The hotel has changed management several times again since then.

 

Now I find myself with a CCJ which I noticed when checking my Experian Credit File.  

I was shocked it had got to that stage without me realising.  

I may have had a letter, but like I say I began ignoring the demands after thinking they were just a scam company pushing their luck to get money out of me.

 

I recently called Northampton County Court to discuss the CCJ I had been issued, where I was told that I can write to CEL once again and ask them to remove the CCJ or apply to have the judgement Set Aside.

 

 I began looking into requesting the judgment be set aside, but found that it is quite a costly route to take.

 I also checked a few forums where I got bits of advise as to what to say to them in my next letter.

 

I received a 'without prejudice as to save costs' letter from CEL on 24.11.20 stating that they now intend to apply for an order for me to attend before a Court Officer for questioning about my financial status.

 

I wrote to CEL once again, 3 plus years on asking them to remove the CCJ and stop demanding money from me.

 I also enclosed a letter from my partner who confirmed that he was running the open Mic and that I was dropping off equipment and had not parked as such.  

 

I included the following in my letter to them:

 

 

"This ongoing issue has become distressing and your persistent demands for payment for a PCN that was never justified. 

 

On that night in question I drove into the carpark, pulled up outside the main entrance where we unloaded the car of musical equipment and I drove away. 

 

I am not liable for these demands of payment and I am disappointed and frustrated that despite my attempts over the years to resolve this issue I am still been harassed.  if you check any photo or video evidence you have for that date, you will see that I did not even park in a parking spot.

 

I have taken some legal advice and have been told that this fine is not enforceable and that this harassment is in breech of my rights under the Data Protection Act.

 

I have been advised to write to you to request that you stop sending me these demands, cease writing to me, destroy my data and not pass it on to any third parties. I also request that you inform Northampton Country Court that this debt is settled/null and void.

 

If you do not inform Northampton County Court that this debt is settled or void and continue to harass me by pursuing this claim, I reserve all my rights to make a claim for damages for your harassment of me pursuant to the Protection from Harassment Act and for your breaches of my data protection rights. Also, if proceedings are issued then I will apply for costs under Rule 27.14(2)(g)."

 

No response to my letter as yet.

  Is there anyone out there who has any advise on how I should move forward with this?  

 

it grieves me to pay it, as they company seem as though they are purely a money making scheme, hounding innocent people and scaring them into paying.  

Hoping someone can help or advise, thank you.

 

Best wishes

Maxine

 

 

Moodle

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Where does anything say its a fine?

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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CEL are one of the most crooked of the PPCs, we're used to seeing their vile behaviour here.  You've tried to be reasonable but they're just conmen, only interested in £££££.  It's pointless, indeed counter-productive to keep writing to them.

 

Let's concentrate on the CCJ first.  Have you moved since all this started?  Is there a chance the court papers went to a previous address?

 

 

We could do with some help from you.

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ok i was being a bit cheeky

i had expected someone thats been on here for as long as i have would know better than to appear to go elsewhere and follow some strange route regarding section 10 etc when that not what we've ever advised if you get a CCJ, however you've not been around of recent but still doesn't explain why you didnt come here 1st for the correct advice.

 

its not a fine its a speculative invoice, a private parking company cant fine you anything.

 

alll they've done is most probably used an old address , the one that the car was registered too at the time of the 'offence?' to file a backdoor CCJ, as i expect you've moved close to the CCJ date?

 

getback  onto northant bulk

ask them for a copy of the CCJ and the Claimform

 

it might well be they dont have a copy of the claimform, so RECORD YOUR CALL.

ask them to readout the address the Claimform was served to 

AND 

the Particulars of claim 

 

whilst there it might pay you to ask them to readout how the sum of £325.22 was arrived at , as thats a very unusual figure for a parking charge, looks like extra debt collection charges have been slipped in which is a bit cheeky!

 

then comeback here with that info

you'll need the CCJ number from your credit file.

 

a word of note

paying the CCJ will not remove it.

only a set aside will @£255 but as yet i cant see a valid reason.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • dx100uk changed the title to Unknown CEL PCN CCJ - Metro Inn, Birmingham Road, Walsall, WS5 3 - How do I get it removed?

@FTMDaveHi... thanks for response.

I've been at the same address for 16 years.  I am assuming any court paper got lost in the abyss when I was ignoring their demands after already trying to resolve it... to be honest, a lot of their threats didn't seem real, so my own fault for not being more astute about what they were sending me.

 

@dx100uk I hadn't been on here for a long long time... and I don't know why i didn't come here first as I have always found it a top notch site, I guess I wasn't sure I was still a member. But after trying an old log in log in I found that I was... yay! 

 

CEL got me a bit panicky when I checked my credit file and saw that there was actually a real CCJ on there.   I initially used some advise from someone who'd had a similar problem... my bad!... but hey ho... after sitting and thinking properly about how to tackle the problem, I knew the best place to come was here.

Moodle

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8 minutes ago, maxine989 said:

a lot of their threats didn't seem real, so my own fault for not being more astute about what they were sending me.

 

Well yes, I didn't want to say so, but you've done just about everything wrong it was possible to do.

 

Applying for a set aside is easy, however it costs £255, mind you that is less than £325.

 

The problem is that the judge will want to hear two things, (a), how you intend to defend the claim, and that's easy, from your description CEL's signage was pants and you were within the 10-minute grace period, and (b) why you didn't defend the claim when you had the opportunity to.  The last part is the stumbling block.

 

 

We could do with some help from you.

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29 minutes ago, maxine989 said:

I am assuming any court paper got lost in the abyss when I was ignoring their demands after already trying to resolve it...

 

that could be your downfall sadly.

if you ignored the court papers then sadly you miss the 1st part of satisfying a set aside - why did you not respond to the initial claim. ignorance is not a reason. 

 

might be better to go ring CEL and state you are happy to pay the sum claimed but want the CCJ removed from your file as part of the deal. you could possibly kick off about the extra about £100 added to the normal CCJ sum for a speculative invoice claim which is about £200

 

go get that info i posted about and lets see if you have any cards to play with.

the 10mins stay rule might be useful but at this stage i'm not too sure esp if the particular of the claim don't actually state 'what' you did wrong.

 

i suspect this was an ANPR camera in/out timed PCN . that cold help

did you dump all the paperwork to date or have any of it still?

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Just throwing an idea - probably stupid - out there.

 

You've had this CCJ for nigh-on three years, without knowing about it.

 

Presumably you're OK in your home & financially.  If you simply ignored it for another three years, it would then drop off your credit record.  Could that be an idea?  It would also save you the £255 and deny CEL their ill-gotten gains 😃 but maybe that's not a road you want to go down, as I say, just throwing ideas around..

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

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8 hours ago, maxine989 said:

I received a 'without prejudice as to save costs' letter from CEL on 24.11.20 stating that they now intend to apply for an order for me to attend before a Court Officer for questioning about my financial status.

well the court would write about such, and that letter was +2mts ago. 

  • Like 1

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Share on other sites

@FTMDave

That is a very good idea indeed!!!!  Like you say, it's been there for almost three years anyway. Would CEL be able to reapply for another CCJ or further chase me for the penalty once the current CCJ has expired though?  I am not looking to remortgage for a few years, so I guess I could leave it sitting there despite my credit rating being shot.  Thanks for the heads up. :)

 

@dx100ukI dumped all the old paper work sadly... but how about what FTM Dave suggested and leaving the CCJ to expire in a further three odd years?  I am not looking to remortgage just yet, so could perhaps leave it sitting there until it's automatically wiped off my credit file?  Cheers

Moodle

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I don't think you really have any other option but to ride it out as its very unlikely you would be successful in getting a 3 year old judgment set a side..for whatever reason.

 

Andy

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHER

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group - The National Consumer Service

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1 hour ago, maxine989 said:

further chase me for the penalty once the current CCJ has expired though?

 

Well CEL have won the case by default, that part is over, the next stage would be enforcement.

 

I'm not an expert on this, but I do know

   - bailiffs can be involved if the figure is over £600, you're under that amount so safe

   - CEL have done nothing in three years

   - from time to time we have "backdoor CCJ" cases here, invariably where the motorist has moved and so never got the court papers, and in all those cases the PPC did nothing to enforce the CCJ either.

 

Now, all of us on the forum have made mistakes in legal matters when starting out, that's inevitable, the important thing is to learn from bad experiences for the future, especially as these vermin infest car parks all over the country so we're likely to come up against them again!

 

1.  Never correspond with the fleecers.  You've seen that does no good.  Even worse, you encourage them to press for money and throw away your protection under the POFA 2012.

2.  Use the time to build up evidence against them - in your case that would have been their pants signage (which i doubt they had planning permission for), your stay being under 10 minutes, etc.

3.  If eventually they formally threaten court with a Letter Before Claim then do reply, ridicule their case, and show them you'd be big trouble if they did do court.

4.  If they were then stupid enough to issue court papers, then defend the claim, follow the legal process and see them in court.  PPCs lost two court cases to Caggers last week.  A well-defended case is almost certain to win in court.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

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2 hours ago, maxine989 said:

Would CEL be able to reapply for another CCJ or further chase me for the penalty once the current CCJ has expired though?

it is not a penalty!!

a CCJ doesn't expire, it's just removed from your credit file after 6yrs.

a claimant has 6yrs to enforce it via the courts, should they fail it's very rare for a court to allow enforcement outside of 6yrs.

 

sit on your hands. dont kick their pramwheels.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi All

Update

I received a letter from ZZPS of Surrey this week, dated 3rd February.

 

Letter begins:

 

NOTICE OF APPOINTMENT AS SPECIALIST DEBT COLLECTORS

 

"We invite you to contact us on 01932918916 to discuss the options available for you to comply with the terms of the judgment.  Please be assured that if you fail to contact us within 14 days of todays date, we shall seek our Clients instructions on how they wish to proceed to recover all sums due under the terms of the judgment without further notice to you; we look forward to hearing from you".

 

Trying not to kick the pram wheels...

Shall I contact them?  Should I offer to pay a reduced settlement amount? or just sit tight?  Any advice is much appreciated.

Thanks

 

 

Edited by maxine989

Moodle

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nope

a dca is not a bailiff

dx

 

  • Thanks 1

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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