Santander withholding my money - suspected fraud - **SETTLED full amount+Court Fee+Compo**

[AndyOrch]

You can submit an amended POC...with a fee...but that's why I need to know what you have submitted already..verbatim.

You must have a copy as MCOL retains it on your dashboard.

[bradybunch]

havent submitted anything...I indicated I will attach it later

[AndyOrch]

Then why have Santander submitted a defence...if your claim issued does not state what you are suing them for ?

[bradybunch]

[BankFodder]

Excuse me coming in here but do I understand that you have started a claim in the County Court and you haven't prepared in advance and you haven't prepared a particulars of claim to send off even though you indicated you would be sending a more detailed particulars of claim after the issue of the papers?

 

[AndyOrch]

Claim was issued 21st Dec 2020 and now at DQ stage BF...yet BB states he has not submitted any initial particulars.

You can above that he did at .3

[bradybunch]

i am coming here to get materials/advice for that purpose. could you point me towards a suitable POC please. 

[BankFodder]

 

39 minutes ago, Andyorch said:

Claim was issued 21st Dec 2020 and now at DQ stage BF...yet BB states he has not submitted any initial particulars.

You can above that he did at .3

 

Thanks. But surely he must have indicated that he was going to send further particulars when he made his claim. However, particulars must be filed within seven days of issue of papers and a certificate of service has to be signed.

 

39 minutes ago, bradybunch said:

i am coming here to get materials/advice for that purpose. could you point me towards a suitable POC please. 

In order to give you the best materials and advice, I'm afraid we need to know exactly what you've done.

This is not only for your benefit but also for the benefit of others who view this thread – it seems to me that you came here for help and got some initial advice and then you suddenly reappeared having gone ahead and acted on your own without any further advice – and apparently without any preparation or planning.

Not only that, a brief scan of the defence suggest that the first thing they're saying is that you haven't stated cause of action – and looking at the claim which you have apparently issued, that is absolutely correct. You haven't identified any cause of action.

The cause of action is a legal basis for saying why you have issued your claim, and why you have the law on your side and the courts should support you – and why the other side doesn't have the law on their side and therefore they should fail.

You haven't set this out at all.

Did you indicate in your original claim that you are going to file a more detailed particulars of claim? Did you not realise that these particulars of claim must be filed within seven days?

If you want to file more detailed particulars of claim now, you are effectively attempting to put in an amended particulars of claim

 

[BankFodder]

As a matter of interest, when you stopped taking advice from us at the beginning of November, did you then go on to approach someone else or some other organisation for advice?

I'm asking this and need to understand the basis on which you been acting and the quality of any advice that you might have received elsewhere

[bradybunch]

nope. didnt take advice elsewhere. I have shown all i have here. I wrote in section 3 because it was my intention to add a "proper" POC 

 

i am happy to put in an amended POC as it is late. i understand that

[BankFodder]

I don't know what @Andyorch thinks.
I have a sense that an amendment might be so substantial that it effectively changes the substantive cause of action – such as it is.

I'm trying to read through the defence and understand it – but you have redacted it for identifiers which is fair enough, but for some reason rather you have redacted it for the amounts involved. This means that everything is £XXX and is simply confusing. I don't understand why you've done this.

Please could you repost the defence with the figures in place so that we can distinguish between the various figures and also understand the value of what you are dealing with. Don't put false figures. Put the actual figures. There is no disadvantage or prejudice to you.

 

[bradybunch]

alright. here it is. 

 

Thanks

BB

Defence (STDR).pdf

[BankFodder]

What is the date for the submission of the DQ?

My instinct would be to contact the other side and tell them that you are litigant in person and you agree that you haven't been handling it very correctly and the you would like them to agree to an informal extension and also to you filing an amended particulars of claim to which, of course, they would then enjoy an opportunity to respond to with an amended defence.

If you are prepared to do that – I think also an apology to them would be in order.

Of course, whether you can get hold of them by telephone as it's their own internal law department – is a matter of conjecture. Do you have an email for them?

And of course, they might simply be bloody-minded and say – No.

However, I think you've entered it to a fairly complex bit of litigation and you've gone into it cackhanded. You are also dealing with an issue in which the bank will be prepared to act in a massively disproportionate manner to block you and to crush you if necessary. It is going to need a bit of sorting out and that means it's going to take some time.

[bradybunch]

Will do that. they actually missed the cut off time  to respond and i request a default judgement, only for them to email me with the defence saying they had IT issues. The court accepted it thoug. lets hope they will accept my request.

 

If they accept, do we have to inform the court, and does this mean i dont get to pay any charges to amend?

 

Thanks

BB

[BankFodder]

Yes, you would inform the court – and yes you would have to pay a fee to amend – but it means that there would be no objection from the other side and they wouldn't try to push for a striker because you hadn't responded with the DQ.

 

 

Did you send them on SAR? Do you know if they have reported a crime and do they have a crime number?

[bradybunch]

i sent them a SAR. There is no crime number

[BankFodder]

And what did the SAR say in respect of this problem?

In terms of the defence that you have posted up, we see that the name of the payee company has been redacted. Please could you let us know what this company is – including the name.

Also, it seems that their defence is based on their para 14

Please could you use a separate post to address the points made in their paragraph 14.

And she what would be really helpful would be if you would enter a two column table into a Word document with the paragraph 14 point that they make on the left column and your responses on the right hand column.

[AndyOrch]

Alternatively...just an idea... you could proceed to submit the DQ...dont bother with an amended Particulars of Claim... and then do a particularised witness statement stating the full details of the statement of case. MCOL has accepted your initial defence......your particulars although vague and not CPR 16 compliant appear to be fully understood and accepted by the defendant.

 

Their defence goes into great detail as to why the account was frozen so they are fully aware of the nature of claim and why you made the claim.

 

Permission to submit an amended defence using N244 fee is £100 without hearing..and you become liable for the defendants costs in submitting their amended defence if required.

 

What are your thoughts with regards to the defendants defence points 14 onwards ? 

 

 

.

 

 

 

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[bradybunch]

they sent back statements and notes on the account. they have two issues from their defence, the money £3k which i received from the car buyer and the £1k. the refercnce to the company is in respect to an attempted payment which is why the account was blocked.

 

 

On 12/02/2021 at 15:41, Andyorch said:

Alternatively...just an idea... you could proceed to submit the DQ...dont bother with an amended defence and then do a particularised witness statement stating the full details of the statement of case. MCOL has accepted your initial defence......your particulars although vague and and not CPR 16 compliant appear to be fully understood and accepted by the defendant.

 

Their defence goes into great detail as to why the account was frozen so they are fully aware of the nature of claim and why you made the claim.

 

Permission to submit an amended defence using N244 fee id £100 without hearing..and you become liable for the defendants costs in submitting their amended defence if required.

 

What are your thoughts with regards to the defendants defence points 14 onwards ? 

 

I have bank statements from the buyer, receipts and a letter from him stating that he paid the money and its not a fraudulent transaction. I have recent statements from him also

as i explained above, their legal department emailed me directly to apologise for their late submission so I have an email for the lady and her mobile number too

[AndyOrch]

Its the following that concerns me.....you was making a payment of £3K not receiving ?

 

On 17 July 2020, the Claimant told the Bank that the Attempted Payment related to the purchase of a car. However, the payee company did not appear to have any connection to vehicle sales, but rather to financial intermediation and other businesses. Consequently, the Bank had reasonable grounds to doubt the explanation offered by the Claimant and it did not permit the Attempted Payment to be made.

[BankFodder]

Okay, well the suggestion proposed by my site team colleague seems to be the best way forward. No risk of being refused. Cost free – but you still will need to do the detailed witness statement and so you still need to respond to their points in their paragraph 14.

It will help enormously if you can do the tabulated responses I've suggested. You will need this for a witness statement in any event and it's best that we get to understand the entire situation as quickly as possible so that we can then help you to produce a witness statement that helps you

[bradybunch]

25 minutes ago, BankFodder said:

Okay, well the suggestion proposed by my site team colleague seems to be the best way forward. No risk of being refused. Cost free – but you still will need to do the detailed witness statement and so you still need to respond to their points in their paragraph 14.

It will help enormously if you can do the tabulated responses I've suggested. You will need this for a witness statement in any event and it's best that we get to understand the entire situation as quickly as possible so that we can then help you to produce a witness statement that helps you

Thank you for this BankFodder.

 

Do i need  the witness(es) to sign the statement or is it something i can write and undersign on my own. also 

[BankFodder]

A "witness statement" is simply a statement that you prepare yourself which effectively will be a response to their defence and it will be something that you supply before a hearing goes before a judge.

However, start to worry about who's going to sign it is really getting ahead of yourself.

Please can you simply prepare the tabulated document that I suggested twice

 

Incidentally, there is no massive hurry for this. I suggest that you do it carefully over the weekend and post it up on Monday or Tuesday.

In the meantime, have you dealt with the DQ?

[AndyOrch]

If you intend to bring in extra witnesses who will confirm the transaction's...then that must be denoted on the DQ ...

 

D.3 Number of witnesses (including yourself)

[bradybunch]

On 12/02/2021 at 16:30, BankFodder said:

Incidentally, there is no massive hurry for this. I suggest that you do it carefully over the weekend and post it up on Monday or Tuesday.

In the meantime, have you dealt with the DQ?

 Hi folks, please see the draft witness statement below:

 

Background:
I am Jane Doe residing at 50 Santander House house, London EC1N 6AR
I am employed as a Secretary  and where the opportunity arises I engage in side business to supplement my income.
I opened an acount with Santander bank on the 25th of June 2020 with customer  account number 55061583
I have been operating the account in accordance with the terms and conditions as aoutlined by the banks leaflet and online pdf communications.
On the 14th of June 2020  I sold a car on behalf of my friendnd Mr April May for £3120 to Mr John Johnson the  represented an above market price for the car and I considered it good business.
On the 17th of July 2020  i attenpted to transfer out the money as directed by Mathbeecom Ltd, but the transaction was unsuccessful as Santander (The Bank) put a hold on the account.
The bank then asked me to provide evidence of source of funds and I have sent them copies of the sales receipt and bank statements from the Buyer.
At no time did I mention that I sold a scooter and I have never sold one
The £1035 amounts to payments received from D C R consultant.

I have provided the evidence to Santander at all stages of making an attempt to resolve the issue.

Brief Summary:
I made several visits to the bank to persuade the cashier to release my funds as I was under financial pressure and needed to money, at first the cashiers refused, and after a few more visits the bank decided to release £621 to me which I refused.
On the 18th of August 2020 1 wrote to the executive team (to resolve the impasse) to inform them of how the bank has treated me appalingly and request that someone investigate it.
I got a response back on the 24th of August 2020 asking me to go to the bank to collect my money but the cashiers informed me that the bank could only release £621.
I rejected the Bank's offer to pay me only a paltry sum as it had no lawful reason to withhold my money after receiving evidence and receipt and closing the account

What I am applying for.

My prayer to the court is to compel Santander Bank to release my money plus interest and pat court costs.
I do not seek to re-open the bank account and I do not want to re-establish banking relationship with Santdander

Additional Information.

I have included in this witness statement, the evidence bundle
1. SAR from Santander
2. Bank statements from Mr Johnson who purhased the car
3. Letter from DVLA
4. email communication from the Snatnder Executive Office
5. Letters of support from witnesses who transferred money into the account whilst it was still active

Final Summary:

In summary, Santander have unlawfully withheld my legitimate funds and have put me under sever hardship by continuing to deny me accres to my money.
I would be glad if the court can rule in my favour and ask Santander to provide re-imbursements of my full funds including court costs.