CRS AJJB chasing money for Photo Studio Group run by Michael John Hannah

[simond1000]

It says on their web site T&C's "All copyrighted images are sold on the day of the shoot only" - https://hype-digital.co.uk/terms-of-service/

That covers the "limited offers" black listed practice

 

The contract says "I understand that once I leave the premesis I cannot change or reduce the order"

 

That shows the offer is only available at that time and it is pressure selling by giving me the impression I cannot get the offer at any other time uinless I sign a contract there and then.

 

We had an initial email from them that suggests my daughter had succesfully passed their selection process and has been shortlisted. It goes on to say "if you are successful on the day" which gives you the impression you will pass their test to become a model but I expect everybody passes. I will attach this email.

Gmail - Successful Applicant.pdf

[BankFodder]

I'm not sure that what you are pointing at amounts to unfair practices for the purposes of nullifying any agreement.

Maybe you would like to link is to the unfair practices provisions, I haven't looked at them for some time – however, it seems to me that suggesting that something is time-limited when it's not – doesn't refer to a one-to-one contract. He refers to a general offer of proposal which in fact continues to be open to everyone even after the alleged deadline has passed.

Here you have a one-to-one contract. It is specifically made between you and the supplier and it doesn't appear to be open to anyone else.

I'm doing this from memory – but I don't see that the circumstances apply to your particular situation.

Also, I'm not sure what is wrong with suggesting that you are not allowed to change and reduce an order once you have left the premises. In fact it seems to me that at the moment you have a contract in place, then you wouldn't be allowed to change or reduce the order anyway – and whether or not you have left the premises has nothing to do with it.

I think that the fact that they say that she has been selected from thousands of applicants is far more interesting. However, looking at the email which you have attached to your post, I'm struggling to see where it says that there are thousands of applicants

[simond1000]

They said there were thousands of applicants to my daughter on the phone so we don't have proof of the word "thousands", just that she had been shortlisted on the email. I think the bottom line is a 14 year old girl could understandably think she had won the chance of a modelling contract and on the day her parents are put under extreme pressure to pay for portfolio's and photos that are pretty useless according to several sources including the Sun and Guardian newspaper and BBC Watchdog.

 

Everybody says not to pay them anything or to stop paying them if you started (including people on this site) because its a scam.

 

Now I have stopped paying them there is a chance they could take me to court and get a CCJ for the balance.

I can't see how somebody running a scam would be allowed to pursue legal action.

 

I just need to know if I should pay them and put it down to experience or are they likely to take me to court and if so are they likely to win?

[dx100uk]

there are no example of these modelling scam artists ever doing court.

 

dx

 

[BankFodder]

Frankly I don't think you should pay them – but on the other hand I think you should be as prepared as possible in case they decide to go ahead. This is extremely unlikely – but if they did, then it would be helpful if you had visited round the Internet and gotten as many other people as possible to show that they have had exactly the same sales technique and exactly the same lack of interest and lack of progress on any modelling career.

You say that you don't know how anybody running a scam like this should be allowed to take legal action. The whole point is that although you know it's a scam and we know it's a scam, you would have to prove to a judge that it is a scam. A judge would probably believe that it is a scam as well – but the judge will want to see evidence rather than simply go on a hunch.

You might want to ask how these people get away with it. Well I'm afraid that I think you need to look at your own situation and you will start to understand. I think that you were carried away by it – and of course you came under pressure from your daughter and for some reason rather, felt unable to stand up to her about it – even though, it would probably have been a better lesson for her to understand what was going on and to be told to be patient and to give it a day or two before making a decision. Now you have to deal with it – and I suppose that your daughter doesn't really show a huge amount of interest because of course is not her who has to pay and also it's not her who has the humiliation of having fallen into this trap.

I'm sorry to say but even on this thread you started off by telling us that they had said that there were thousands of others – and it's only now that I've pressed you on the point that you've agreed that this was only said verbally and furthermore, it is only now that you have admitted that they said this to your daughter and not to you.

Unfortunately the contract is with you and not with your daughter so as far as anyone is concerned, they're dealing with an adult who presumably has learnt a thing or two in life and is a bit canny.

We feel that these people never start court actions – and they probably make more than enough money without having to deal with the very few troublesome individuals who decide to push into court and to defend.

We would suggest that you don't take any action and that you tell them to go ahead and do their worst and that you will force them to produce evidence in court of the things which they have said. However at the end of the day, it is your decision as to what to do.

Although your 14 year old daughters innocence turns against her, on the other hand a statement from her in which she confirms the conversation and that they spoke to her and that they told her about these thousands of other applicants, might go in her favour because she is only a child.

I would also spend time going around the Internet and contacting people who have also fallen for it and see if you can get them to help you with as many statements and evidence of emails et cetera as you possibly can. I think it would only take four or five people with a similar story to put before a judge to persuade the judge that there was some skulduggery going on.

 

To help you with your decision as to whether or not to bluff them out, here are some of your risk factors. First of all, there is a possibility that they are bluffing. We think they are – but of course there is a risk. So your first risk is that you would receive a claim.

Your second risk is that you could lose in court and that means that in addition to the money they were claiming, you would also have to pay their claim fee in the hearing fee. This could add another £250 onto the final bill. Of course you would ask the court for instalments and I can imagine the court would be extremely sympathetic to this request.

As it is, they may will start trying to charge all the late payment fees et cetera which are included in the contract. These late payment fees are only enforceable if they truly represent their administrative losses caused by any breach of contract by you. You can force them to produce evidence of these administrative losses before paying.

I can imagine that any judge in the County Court would probably take a very dim view of their late payment charges and failed payment charges et cetera.

 

If it did go to court, then a hearing will probably be online. They all seem to be that way these days. However, if it was an in-person hearing, then it would probably be a good idea if your daughter turned up as a witness and you should make sure that she is presented as a child and not as a glamour model.

[simond1000]

Thanks for the advice, actually my daughter would have waited a day or two before making a decision but we wern't given that option, it was there and then or the photos would be deleted.  I'm not seeing how the word "thousands" is so significant, I would have thought being told you were shortlisted after applying to a nationally run ad would infer there were a large number of applicants.

 

I cannot find any information either about anybody being taken to court by any of these modelling platform companies. Is there any sort of court register where you can search by company name to see how many court actions they have brought by them?

 

I would have thought the evidence from BBC Watchdog and the Guardian Newspaper exposing the same scam by companies run by Michael Hannah would be enough to persuade a judge he is a scammer. These are the links in case you haven't seen them 

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/articles/2DJ6GCxl7JWHd08jZMb4kSG/kube-studios 

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2017/dec/18/modelling-agencies-platforms-scam-studio-collective

 

I think I will tell them to send me the court date and time and not to contact me again until then and see what they do.

 

I will keep you posted

 

 

[BankFodder]

Yes I'm sure that that media coverage will certainly help. You should print it out – but also it would be a good idea to try and contact other victims and see if you can get there first hand accounts. You will find that some people have actually paid up everything and they will probably be sufficiently angry that they will want to help you very actively.

It was you who use the word "thousands" first of all and so that's why it became significant. However if those are the words that were used, then that is obviously very helpful if your daughter is prepared to give a statement to that effect.

I think you need to go through it all with your daughter – gently over a period of time – compiling an account and then updating it and then bring in anything else that she remembers. A good statement can often take many days as recollections improve. Once you have put an account together then turn into a statement and that will probably be helpful.

 

If you go to this site https://www.trustonline.org.uk/ you should be able to find judgements and also discover if they are satisfied or outstanding. Unfortunately when find the names and addresses of people involved – but let us know what you find. Unfortunately there is a fee.

 

If you right back to the debt collectors then maybe you should fire a shot across their bows. Tell them that you are looking forward to court and you will be bringing in evidence from other victims and also producing the media coverage so far in court and specifically tell them that you will be referring to Michael Hannah and that you may even require him to go to court.

Tell them also that if this does go to a court action then you will certainly be contacting interested members of the press because you are aware that this is an ongoing national scam.

Please keep us updated.

Also if you find any other victims who are prepared to help you then please point them to this forum and maybe they will give information as well which can be useful for others. If they are prepared to give statements then if they are happy to have those statements included here in a file of evidence for others then that would be useful too.

If they do decide to issue a claim against you then of course let us know immediately and we will do everything we can to put together a defence and to support you all the way through

[dx100uk]

9 minutes ago, simond1000 said:

Is there any sort of court register where you can search by company name to see how many court actions they have brought by them?

 

i have 

there isn't.

 

and there never will be 

it's a scam

just regurgitates itself in differing formats on differing social platforms hoping to catch mugs out by their fake promises, bit like pop up stands in your local shopping centre

they rent a business establishment in an area typically for about 1 month, then vanish to the hills with all the money the mugs paid them

 

dx

 

[simond1000]

How do you know there have never been any court actions by these companies if there is no way to see who the claimants are on the CCJ register?

[dx100uk]

because the claimants will be the well known bunch of people in the pyramid structure of these pop up modelling scams .

they would not pass up a 'win' and publicise it to the hilt to force people into paying.

 

but they don't really need to as 1000's of people each time these scams appear splash out £100's even £1000's for zero outcome, another few £1000's means nothing to them.

 

the 1 month/1 week/1 day rent is up 

they fold and run to the next county where they are getting lots of interest from and do the same there.

 

by all means go pay them...

your mistake was writing with a silly prove it letter to AJJB

 

hey joe...what..we've got a mug here scared out of his boots...look at this...oh yea..send them another letter..they might just wet themselves and blindly pay...

 

 

 

[BankFodder]

Good point. I'm afraid I haven't visited the site for some time so I can't quite remember exactly what you can search on. Visit it and try. There is no fee for searching – but to see the results then you will have to pay a fee.

I've attached a file so you can see the way that the reports look – but in this case I was searching on a defendant company.

However it may allow you to to search on the claimant instead.

 

I'm afraid that now you phrased it, I'm not sure anymore!

Report-201907389426.pdf

[BankFodder]

In fact  the more I think about it, I expect that it is only used for finding defendants - not claimants - so sorry for misleading you

[simond1000]

I get your point but don't worry I don't intent to pay them unless instructed to by a court but only when I have checked the CCJ is legitimate as I have read there are numerous court and bailiff scams out there demanding money off people.

 

This company (The Photo Studio Group)  is not a popup but is listed in Companies House as existing since 2017 and then as Kube Studios since 2012. Maybe it would be worth doing a defendant check on them to see if anyone has taken them to court to get their money back, that might help my case?

[BankFodder]

Yes, that would be fun – but of course you won't get the claimant's details. If you're prepared to put up the fee then try it. However, maybe it's not worth spending any money on it unless it escalates in some way

[simond1000]

I will do it if they give me a court date.

One angle I've been thinking of is the contract cannot be enforced because there have already been two chargebacks made by my credit card company against this account which were not contested and the money can not be requested again so I could not pay the total sum in the contract and therefore I could not receive the goods so they broke the contract by not contesting the chargebacks. 

Does that sound feasible?

[BankFodder]

I'm afraid that I think that it is tenuous at best

[dx100uk]

to date all you have had is silly text msgs and emails..no letters.

block and bounce all the email addresses 

report the texts as spam by 7726.

 

 

[Nobby_v]

 

Personally I feel that all of these things are sent to test us.

 

If they think they have a case against you then let them take their chances in court.

 

In nearly all of these cases, they are just trying to bully you into settlement.

 

It's a numbers game for these legal firms and debt collectors - send ten letters - get one settlement. Profit made, they move on.

 

Then the list of debts get sold on to another and then another.... 

 

Collate the evidence and your reasons for non payment. If they think they have a case, let them tell that to the court. 

If the court decides against you then you've been unlucky. 

Balance of probability in my thinking is that will never happen.

 

However the stress of mithering over it will shorten your life.

 

They know that if they harass you sufficiently you'll pay.

 

Not because there is anything they can legally.

 

This is not a business that is run for legitimate purposes - it's whole reason for being is to perpetuate at near scam levels. 

 

Learn the lesson, move on.

 

Richard

 

 

[honeybee13]

Hi. I've had to hide your photo of the 13th October letter because you left your name at the top of it.

 

It's best to convert it to a pdf file so that only members of this forum can view it.

 

HB

[dx100uk]

await if/when they issue a letter of claim.

 

dx

 

[simond1000]

I have blanked out the reference number as well

AJJBLawLetter.pdf

[simond1000]

I have just had a response from Which legal team after I sent them the so called contract. They are saying they cannot see an agreement to pay for the  photo's, Efolio / Digital zcards at a price of £2,000 but they can see a credit agreement to repay a loan I haven't had.

[dx100uk]

and you have a copy of this 'agreement'?

 

[simond1000]

Yes, I posted it on this site in message number 20

[dx100uk]

urm the top left staple hides what i think says secured by the consumer credit agreement?

not sure what that means

it's not a secured loan

and i believe that agreement is void

 

it is very interesting as research appears to indicate that the photo studio is allowed to pass details on to a sep company that appears to give them the money to supposedly loan to people.

guess who owns that company ......

 

you didn't sign a DD mandate did you?

as the first payment will be sucked from your bank account in 2 days if you did

you need to go online and cancel that at you banks webportal.