Trying to calculate PPI offer from old Woolwich loan from Barclays Bank

[monyl]

I recently received a PPI offer from Barclays re an old Woolwich loan dated back to January 1989. 

They previously could not locate this under previous searches prior to the FCA deadline as all Woolwich current accounts had been deleted from the banking system when Barclays took over. 

 

They have made an offer of £2,163 but when I put the figures in the PPI calculators on-line, it comes out at £3k - £4k.  

The APR was 20.5%. 

Monthly payments were £141.29 for 60 months,

the credit agreement does not identify the payments for the loan and insurance separately.

 

 

Amount of loan	£5000.00	Optional Care Insurance	£469.50	Total loan	£5469.50
Interest	£2750.00	Add Interest	£257.90	Total interest	£3007.90
Amount Payable	£7750.00	Amount Payable	£727.40	Total amount payable	£8477.40

 

I remember seeing an on-line calculator on Martin Lewis site but it is no longer there and was wondering if someone could calculate the figures for me please or refer me to a calculator where I can do it myself. 

 

The letter says that if I think their calculations are incorrect then I have 3 months to send it back to them to look at again with my calculations before I send it to FOS within 6 months (p.s. I managed to find my old loan agreement).

 

Any help with these calculations would be very helpful.

 

Thank you

 

Any assistance would be very helpful.

 

 

[dx100uk]

scan up the agreement to PDF 

read upload carefully please

 

easy peasy if you have that

 

dx

 

[monyl]

Thank you for your quick reply.  Will read asap.  I have tried to scan and rephotocopy but as it is an old document, the text is very faint.  I will have to take it to a shop and try to photocopy again on a dark setting.  Will upload later.

[dx100uk]

you only need to be able to see the total sum for PPI paid and the total sum of the loan

either both with interest or both without

 

PPIPCM% = PPI/PPI+LOANx100 = % of total loan that was for PPI = say 13%

 

then everytime you paid anything ...13% was for PPI

then on the date of EVERY payment made ..

you enter that figure individually in the statint sheet.

 

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/286114-latest-spreadsheets-ppi-claims-and-charges-claims-dec-2011/

 

you leave the claimto date alone

the spreadsheet does everything for you.

 

 

 

 

 

[monyl]

Sorry but the problem was that the document is old and you could not see the figures when photocopied - have managed to do so now.  Thank you for the calculator - will try that and see how I get on.  I have now uploaded the document.  Thank you for your patience.

Woolwich-Barclays Loan.pdf

[dx100uk]

so 

 

469.5/5469.5*100=8.6% (PPIPCM%)

 

141.29*8.6%=£12.15p  (PPIPCM )

 

off you go

 

dx

 

[monyl]

I think I have managed this after a few tries. 

 

To make sure that I have the correct calculation, 

is the 'interest at 8% Simple' in Row 20/Column K meant to be £86.95 for £12.15 or I have used the spreadsheet incorrectly? 

 

Looking at their letter again, they state they have paid 'statutory rate of 8% from 1 April 1993 and at 15% before that'.  Their breakdown does not provide the difference in % from the dates mentioned above. 

How would this be calculated?  

 

Also is the statutory rate paid for the lifetime of the loan only or to the current date that they made their decision?  You have been so helpful in providing these spreadsheets. 

 

Thank you.  

[dx100uk]

thats quite interesting, as they are giving you a greater int rate before 1993, i am unaware of anything special about that date concerning statutory int , but it means more money for you, so i wouldn't worry

yes the spreadsheet is correct.

 

it runs till the day they settle.

 

have they actually given a fixed figure for the 15% period, if so, add that the the 'current' spreadsheet result and that should equal what they should be refunding....

does it match?

 

dx

 

[monyl]

So according to this calculator my refund should be £4562.96 at the 8%.   This is in line with some of the management firms calculator on-line.   I have checked their letter again and they have paid from 1 Jan 1989 - 1 Jan 1994 only. They have refunded all the insurance premiums totalling £469.50 and the interest paid on the premiums to date of £257.90.  Additional interest of £1,436.36 after tax on top of refund as compensation.  Statutory rate of 8% from 1 Apr 1993 and at 15% before that.  They have not provided a breakdown of payments from 15% - 8%.  Only below:

 

£  469.50 - Refund of PPI premiums paid

£  257.90 - Refund of interest charge on the premiums paid

£1,795.44 - Statutory compensation

-£      0.00 - Less any previous successful claim

-£      0.00 - Less any previous refunds made directly as result of this policy

-£       0.00 - Less any statutory compensation already paid

-£   359.08 - Deduction from any statutory compensation interest for income tax at 20%

_________

£2,163.76 - Total refund due

 

This will be the second time I am returning their calculations.  They made a decision last year and used a wrong date as they could not read the date and made up a date then it went to the back of the queue to be recalculated.  I had already queried the refund amount with them and they have moved the date again from the 22 Jan to 1 Jan!

 

Are they using a different calculator/principal why the figures are so far apart?  How am I going to show them this calculation without it going to FOS and sitting there for years to be assessed?

 

Can I also ask how to do the 15% calculation?  Thanks so much.

 

[dx100uk]

as i said unsure of what this 15% is about.

 

the FOS/FCA clearly describe how refund calcs show have been made the their relevant sites.

 

p'haps at this juncture it might be better to scan up to ONE multipage PDF their refund letters 

another set of eyes is always belter.

 

please read our upload guide carefully

 

 

 

[monyl]

Have uploaded document.  I noticed that they were meant to have included some information from Which and Money Saving Expert but it was not enclosed.  Thank you.

WoolwichLPc.pdf

[dx100uk]

well there you go you see.

not once have you mentioned that this was a commission refund determined by the Plevin ruling.

 

you can't have BOTH.

 

either you accept the plevin commission reclaim

or 

you reject it and push for a reclaim of the actual PPI sums paid.

 

Did you initially complain?

or was this all shock after receiving a letter that a refund was due?

 

[monyl]

This is interesting as I was not aware that there was a difference in the PPI claims/calculations. 

 

Long story: I asked for this PPI reclaim over 5 years ago. 

The Woolwich loan was taken out when I had a Woolwich current account. 

The banking sort code for Woolwich was deleted off the banking system when Barclays inherited it hence they could not find my current account let alone the loan. 

 

They had told me that I had provide proof of the loan as they could not locate it. 

I did the FCA deadline search and it still was not located. 

 

As this was the last resort, I had to go into the loft and found it by chance. 

They changed the new reference number from the search and attached it to the old past reference number as the complaint was still on their system. 

 

Even speaking to them about their calculations and the one I got from the on-line calculators, no one can explain the difference, they just keep saying that they cannot speak to the PPI calculations team, they have to email them! 

 

Also I thought the Plevin paragraph was standard information. 

So this is where the mystery lies,

 

I can reject the Plevin calculation and ask for calculations based on my actual PPI sums paid,

 

would this then be in line with your calculator?

[dx100uk]

Plevin is not a calculation.

its a refund of commission they got as they had a backhander of greater than 50% of the PPI sum paid for selling it on behalf of the insurance company that underwrote the PPI policy.

 

you are after reclaiming the PPI itself.

and that is what all our PPI stuff is geared too.

 

have you still a copy of what you originally sent

though as you don't even KNOW what plevin was , how could you have ever have asked for it.!!

 

pers i'd write back. (you seriously need to stop talking on the phone!!)

stating quite clearly that you REJECT totally their refund under the Plevin Rules.

my Claim was to reclaim the PPI i paid, not for a refund of your hidden commission!!

 

i give your 14 days to refund inline with the enclosed spreadsheet , else i will raise a complaint without further notice to the FOS.

 

please reply in Writing Only.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[monyl]

I see.  This is good to know.  I will try and see if I can find my original letter and send to them in writing and see what happens.  Will let you the outcome.  Thanks so much for all your quick replies. Thank you.