Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • Is there any point in revisiting the fact that the initial speculative invoice (which I never received anyway) was issued more than 14 days after the alleged incident anyway? Should that alone not merit the throwing out of the case to start with?
    • no cca = no pay ....end of. you should not have been running the sb date to infinity by paying debts no-one has enforceable paperwork for...might as well have burned the money for all the good its done you.   dx  
    • Despite the rapid start of vaccinating the population, the UK now has the 13th highest vaccination rate in Europe and the government has received criticism for the (lack of) speed of its booster program and the (lack of) availability of vaccines for 12-17 year olds.   - and falling - 11th not long ago   • Europe: COVID-19 vaccination rates by country | Statista WWW.STATISTA.COM Belgium, Ireland, and Portugal are among the European countries with the highest number of COVID-19 vaccine doses administered per 100 people.  
    • Just to be sure, you are suggesting that I adapt and use this text? ..... Grace Period: 45. Code 13 of IPC Code of Practice states: ‘13.2 Before a Parking Charge is issued Motorists must be allowed a Grace Period save and except when 13.3 is applicable. A Grace Period is a 10 minute period at the end of a Permitted Period of Parking. 13.3 A Grace Period is not required when the Permitted Period of Parking does not exceed 1 hour providing that the signage on the site makes it clear to the Motorist, in a prominent font, that no Grace Period applies on that land.’ Fifthly, I would ask the Claimant to provide evidence that the car remained in the car park for more than the ten minute Grace Period allowed by the IPC Code of Practice. The parking space became unpermitted at the moment the driver left the site, so then a ten minute Grace Period would apply. As the vehicle was there for no more than ten minutes, then according to the ICP’s Code of Practice, which the Claimants says they complied with at all material times, a PCN should not have been issued. Alternatively, the Claimant is invited to show the signage which makes it clear that no Grace Period applies. Planning Permission 46. Finally, the Claimant really emphasis their signage in their Witness Statement. In schedule 2 of their (expired) service agreement it says that ‘The Company will provide the following – 1. Supply 6 Vehicle Control Service v Claim Number: 16 x Enforcement Signs (MAXIMUM STAY 90 MINUTES WHILST SHOPPING IN THE STORES).’ I was only able to find 5 enforcement signs (Exhibit 15). This is another example of VCS not caring about legal obligations, this time within their own contracts. Regardless, I do not believe they have planning permission for these signs, which is a criminal offence under The Town and County Planning (Control of Advertisements) (England) Regulations 2007. I have requested proof of planning permission from VCS by means of a CPR request, but they have not replied. I have searched Hillingdon council planning portal and I cannot find planning permission for the signs. Whilst should mean a contract could not be formed between driver and the Claimant, as you cannot form a contract with illegality, I would like to use this as another example of how unbothered the Claimant is about the law and how they do not adhere to their own IPC Code of Practice as ‘Operators must be aware of their legal obligations and implement the relevant legislation and guidance when operating their businesses’ (Code 25.1 IPC Code of Practice). The Claimant does not care to adhere to Code of Practice they signed up to and generally do not care about keeping their legal affairs in order. I would consider that a blatant disregard for the rules and the law. 47. I have done some research into the Claimant and their court action. They have a pattern of behaviour whereby a VCS paralegal writes a Witness Statement, then mentions in the last paragraph they may be unable to attend court and then the paralegal never turns up to be crossexamined. In the event Ambreen Arshad is unable to attend court to be asked about her claims, then I would like to know why she is not able to attend when the hearing has been scheduled months in advance, is during working hours and as a result of covid, is online, so there is no travel involved. Mohammed Wali, the other paralegal employed by VCS, does exactly the same. Vehicle Control Service v Claim Number: 17 Additionally, I suspect the patrol officer will also have an aversion to explaining himself to the court. E. Double Recovery Legal Fees 48. The Claimant’s Particulars of Claim include £50 legal costs, yet in the letter dated 29th June 2021, the Claimant stated that they were no longer represented by Elms Legal and all further correspondence should be sent to the VCS in-house litigation department (Exhibit 16). I am not sure why the Claimant is asking the Defendant to contribute to their employee’s salary. 49. Furthermore, as per another letter dated 24th August 2021 (Exhibit 17), the Claimant wrote, ‘Should you fail to accept our offer of settlement then we will proceed to Trial and bring this letter to the Court’s attention upon question of costs in order seek further costs of £220 incurred in having to instruct a local Solicitor to attend the hearing in conjunction with the amount claimed on the Claim Form.’ I find this an extraordinary statement given the Claimant knows legal costs are capped at £50 in Small Claims Court. I cannot think of any reason why the Claimant would write this letter other than to intimidate the opposing party with the threat of an extortionate sum of money, hoping they would be able to take advantage of someone not knowing the Small Claims Court rules. Given that this letter came from the Claimant’s in-house litigation department, clearly well-versed in the law, I cannot see this as anything other than deceitful and disingenuous behaviour and I hope the court will not tolerate it. Vehicle Control Service v Claim Number: 18 Contractual costs / debt recovery charge 50. In addition to the £50 legal costs, the Claimant is seeking recovery of the original £100 parking charge plus an additional £60 which is described as ‘contractual costs and interest’ in the Particulars of Claim and as ‘debt recovery charge’ in the Claimant’s Witness Statement (para 31). No further justification or breakdown has been provided as required under Civil Procedure Rule 16.4. 51. In the event the court has somehow allowed Protection of Freedom Act to apply, then para 4(5) Schedule 4, Protection of Freedom Act, states, ‘the maximum sum which may be recovered from the keeper is the amount specified in the notice to keeper’ which in this case is £100. 52. In the more likely event that Protection of Freedom Act 2012 does not apply to this case, then the Claimant still must demonstrate how these alleged additional costs have been occurred otherwise it would appear to be an attempt at double recovery. 53. In previous parking charge cases, it has been found that the parking charge is a sum so high that it includes the cost of recovery. In the case the Claimant cited, Parking Eye Ltd v Beavis (2015) UKSC 67. It was held that the sum (£85) had already incorporated the costs of a private parking business model as it was inflated so as to comfortably cover all costs. The Supreme Court held that a parking firm which is not in [exclusive] possession cannot plead any part of their case in damages. The case provides precedent that £85 (or up to a Trade Body ceiling of £100 depending on the parking firm) covers the costs of the letters.
    • I deal some time with cash some time with card but i keep all recipts i put my money on  20 october  
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

  • Recommended Topics

Service charges went from £830 to £1,242.


style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 171 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)
15 hours ago, stu007 said:

Have you asked them for copies of the Policies I have perviously mentioned as you need to see these to be able to challenge them as to whether they have followed their own Polices and Procedures correctly

 

I haven't yet. I ended up emailing them so many times, and the only responses I get are "Someone will contact you" which never happens. They're not even sending me supporting evidence of the service charges which is a legal requirement which they've breached. They're not going to send me anything I ask for but doesn't mean I wont try. 

 

14 hours ago, dx100uk said:

sar time too surely?

 

dx

 

 

Thinking the same, but as above, I've been sending them so many emails and calling them, even speaking at the residents meeting in front of councillors and Clarion staff , the CEO's assistant assured me they were looking into the complaint and I would get a response in 10 days time. That will be by the 29th. If I don't hear anything, I will make a sar request, and also contact our MP. I already have SHAC (shaction.org) very interested in this. 

 

9 hours ago, unclebulgaria67 said:

I have seen thousands of these housing association service charges accounts and the one from Clarion is fairly typical. 

 

Some of the items will be fixed amounts where the contract cost is known for the year. Other items will be what are reserve estimated amounts, where they estimate cost based on previous year, but allow for some increase. This is so they collect enough in service charges during the year, to cover what they think the overall cost will be.  During a year for some items they will estimate more than the actual cost and for some items they will estimate below what the actual cost turns out to be. So they adjust items up and down as required.

 

I am not surprised by the issue you are highlighting (squiffy account details), but the important information, is what they will actually be charging. As long as they only charge you rent £101.23 and service charges £10.37 per week and they confirm that these amounts cannot be increased beyond an agreed percentage each year, then I would think this is reasonable.

 

 

 

We get the actuals every September which shows how much they actually spent. I keep everything and went through all previous years, only this year have they made this cockup. I did call their accounts team to ask how much will be charging me, they said £125.54 per week which was the old amount. I told them my new revised letter says £111.60, they said they don't know anything about that and said someone from the service charges team will call me back that was 5 days ago. I was tempted to cancel my direct debit and only pay the amounts I have, but it may be better to see what they actually charge me. 

 

Just to reiterate, I requested supporting documents, invoices and receipts for the 2019/2020 service charges well over a month ago, they've committed an offence by not providing me with this, at this point, they've not been able to prove to me that any of the amounts are correct. I'm sure they're still overcharging, they know they've cockedup, and refuse to do anything more about it other than correct the three charges I complained about, for me only, and not for the other 500+ properties here. 

 

Oh and I don't know if this changes anything, but my tenancy ends in October 2021, my contract says I need to vacate unless they extend it. We're worried they may not extend it because of all this hassle we're giving them and we will have to move. 

 

Lastly, our tenancy agreement actually doesn't say if we have fixed or variable, they never filled in that page. 

Edited by JoeyJoeC
Link to post
Share on other sites

look back at post #18 by stu007. Contains a lot of useful information.

 

The issue here, could be that the tenants in the development where you live,  have different service charges depending on whether they are Housing Association tenants or they may be buying the property through shared ownership scheme.

 

And in your area I would think Clarion manage lots of different developments, so it is quite possible that with the huge amount of admin that is involved, that they have issued documents containing mistakes.

 

If you have a document stating that your total housing will be £111.60 per week, then that should be what you pay.

 

The other possible issue might be rent free weeks and the service charges are therefore spread over fewer weeks.  But normally rent free weeks are for either 2 or 4 weeks of the year, so not sure this would cause the increase.

 

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks, I will look at the post again.

 

The tenants I'm speaking to are housing association tenants just like myself, they have very similar charges to the ones I were getting which they admitted over charging on, there is no way a tenant should be paying £300 a year for communal water alone for example, when every year it has been around £4, and they have admitted to me that the £300 figure was a computer error and have corrected mine back to the lower figure. It's only right they should be correcting everyone's but no one I have spoken to has received a service charges letter other than ourselves. We have a Facebook group with 100's of members so I regularly post about this on that group. 

 

The mistakes are because the person who made the changes literally just changed some of the fields in an excel spreadsheet without calculating totals. The other values are the same as the old service charges letter.

 

We don't have any rent free weeks. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just re-read Stu's post, that's absolutely correct, we shouldn't be paying for a great deal of these charges as stated in the Landlords and Tenants act 1985 (section 11). We're certainly not a leaseholder, our tenancy is 5 years at a time. 

 

Furthermore, they've left the section in our tenancy agreement about which service charges we need to pay blank. A second document provided to us suggests it's variable however. 

 

Attaching the entire service charges letter (the latest one), please let me know if I should scan any other documents that may help with this. 

 

REDACTED (01-04-2021) Received 20 April 2021. April 2021 Revised Service Charges.pdf

Link to post
Share on other sites

stop faffin around give the people that might know everything you remotely think is relevant

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

Link to post
Share on other sites

cheap as chips now.

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't wait for them get your SAR Request into them now do not wait for a response get it sent and also make sure and ask for those policies I mentioned.

 

As for them saying it is a computer error no it isn't as it was a human that input that data so it was the staff member that put that incorrect data in not the computer, typical excuse.

 

How to Upload Documents/Images on CAG - **INSTRUCTIONS CLICK HERE**

FORUM RULES - Please ensure to read these before posting **FORUM RULES CLICK HERE**

I cannot give any advice by PM - If you provide a link to your Thread then I will be happy to offer advice there.

I advise to the best of my ability, but I am not a qualified professional, benefits lawyer nor Welfare Rights Adviser.

Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Link to post
Share on other sites

The section adding up to £125.54 contains obvious errors. They have added year before amount to estimate amount for current year.   If £125.54 includes anything towards personal charges towards your own flat and not a communal charge, then you need to ask Clarion. 

 

You should be charged the £111.60 per week as the standard amount , as I cannot see any reason to be charged more. For social Housing tenants that would represent the increase Housing Associations are allowed to charge these tenants. However, if you are required to pay a top up amount towards own flat individual personal service charges, then this may be why they state £125.54.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

Link to post
Share on other sites

As for the new letter I would still refer back to my Post#18 (why are you paying an Admin Fee that's a No No you pay for that in your rents that's just one my list says it all I would expect that of Homeowners/Shared Owners/Leaseholders NOT a HA Tenant).

 

I would have expected this to have been calculated in the HA Business Plan for the next Financial Year which is how they calculate what your HA Rent Increase is going to be for that FInancial Year.

 

You need to request the policies I mentioned and to get a SAR into them ASAP.

 

At least with that new letter you have the actual name of the individual who is the 'Head of Rents & Service Charges'.  

 

Also inform anyone else affected by this to do exactly the same as they wil also need to do the same thing to challenge them

How to Upload Documents/Images on CAG - **INSTRUCTIONS CLICK HERE**

FORUM RULES - Please ensure to read these before posting **FORUM RULES CLICK HERE**

I cannot give any advice by PM - If you provide a link to your Thread then I will be happy to offer advice there.

I advise to the best of my ability, but I am not a qualified professional, benefits lawyer nor Welfare Rights Adviser.

Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Link to post
Share on other sites

From what I have seen, Housing Associations in England do include a small admin fee for administering the standard services provided to tenants. But this is usually less than £2 per week.

 

For home owners and shared ownership tenants the admin fees tend to be much higher.

 

 

 

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

Link to post
Share on other sites

Just had a call from Clarion (of which I have recorded of course). It was someone from their complaints team who gather the initial information for a complaint. He said the complaint was put in their system on the 20th April, not the 14th of March which is when I sent the email titled "Official Complaint". The 20th of April was when I received the last "Revised service charges" letter, which to no one's surprise, they can't find a copy of on their system. 

 

Tomorrow they will email me and ask me to go into detail about the whole complaint to which I will include a timeline showing how many times they have ignored my emails and calls. It will also give me a chance to query whether or not I should be paying for half of these charges as a tenant (thanks Stu). 

 

I will of course ask for the policy documents, and I will send a SAR in as soon as I can. 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Policies you now want etc are:

 

Complaints Policy (not the leaflet)

Rent & Service Charge Policy (not the leaflet)

Customer Care Charter/Standards Policy (not the leaflet)

Communications Policy (not the leaflet)

Cyclical Maintenance Policy (not the leaflet)

Estate Management Policy (not the leaflet)

Procurement Strategy/Policy (not the leaflet)

Repairs & Maintenance Policy (not the leaflet)

Health & Safety Policy (not the leaflet)

Fire Safety Policy (not the leaflet)

Copy of your Tenancy Agreement

How to Upload Documents/Images on CAG - **INSTRUCTIONS CLICK HERE**

FORUM RULES - Please ensure to read these before posting **FORUM RULES CLICK HERE**

I cannot give any advice by PM - If you provide a link to your Thread then I will be happy to offer advice there.

I advise to the best of my ability, but I am not a qualified professional, benefits lawyer nor Welfare Rights Adviser.

Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

Link to post
Share on other sites

Sent detailed timeline of communication as well as in detail my whole complaint, and other issues that have arisen as a result. Requested all the policy documents in #38. Not sent the SAR just yet. 

 

They've started taken payments based on the initial incorrect service charges amount,  not even the reduced amounts shown on my latest service charges letter. 

 

Have been speaking to an action group, who are putting together a dossier regarding service charges from housing associations, they see this case as a strong case, and have gotten the interest of ITV and possibly the BBC. I don't know if at this point it would be a good idea to go as far as an interview on a news segment. Would it be best to wait for the outcome of the complaints process?

Link to post
Share on other sites

 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...