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CEL ANPR PCN PAPLOC- Morrisons, Butterfly Walk Car Park Denmark Hill Camberwell, London SE5 8RW - paid-did not enter Reg No - POPLA rejected appeal


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They rely on threats and an ever increasing bill to persuade people to pay, just ignore as stated until they try it on with a letter of claim.

We could do with some help from you.

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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  • 2 months later...
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Where have you got the idea any debt can have bailiff s involved before you've lost in court????lll   you paid, just because their stupid system shows an extra mystery payment and your reg n

Perfect, so basically make a lovely file of future origami fodder until or if a Letter Before Claim arrives.   At which point it's time to get my legal ducks in a row.

And this is exactly why you never appeal, they have pointed out that they are now pursuing you as the driver, not the keeper.   Assessor supporting rational for decision The appellant

Hi all,

 

Just wanted to check in with the latest nonsense from these guys. They say the debt will be passed to a collection agency, is that even possible with out going to court? Their threats seem to just skip this part of the process out?

 

Should I be responding to them that I will happily discuss the case in court. Just getting wary of sitting on an ever mounting, if total tosh, bill.

 

All the best,

 

David

 

final reminder.pdf

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If you & I were in legal dispute, I could sue you and you could sue me.  My next door neighbour couldn't sue you, your best mate couldn't sue me, the case would have nothing to do with them.

 

Similarly debt collection agencies have no power and can do absolutely nothing - it's not their case.

 

The involvement of DCAs may sound scary, but in reality Civil Enforcement aee threatening that, if you don't cough up, er, you'll have to open another envelope.  Not really a grand, apocalyptic threat!

 

Sit back, relax & ignore.

 

 

We could do with some help from you.

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Only letter to action is a Letter Before Action/Claim

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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  • 4 weeks later...

Hi,

 

Has anyone got an update on this? I recently got a parking charge from this same car park for parking there for 20 minutes.

 

My mum is disabled and she needed the toilet so I stopped in this car park so she could go to the toilet in Morrisons. I did not see the parking charge as I stayed in my car to monitor my car as I didn't realise it was a camera controlled car park. Also not sure if disabled parking is free anyway as I don't know what the signs say?

 

I haven't replied to this yet but I'm not sure it is worth trying to appeal or just go down the route of ignoring them?

 

Would love any advice on this please? Thank you

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Your case is quite different from Yewneik's, so it would be better if you started a new thread.  Simply click on "Start New Topic" towards the top of the page on the forum.

Edited by FTMDave
Usual typo!

We could do with some help from you.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Just to keep things updated, Just received the below, it appears a debt collection group have taken over the case and will be the ones to take me to court. Also very useful that I received the letter on Sunday, missing the payment date stated in the letter. Just wondering if now is a good time to contact Civil Enforcement Limited regarding the CCTV footage of the Carpark, as if it does go to court this will be the best piece of evidence in my defence?

 

Will have a look for a letter template for requesting this in the forums, but if someone has a direct link I'd appreciate it.

 

As always thanks for advice in advance.

 

All the best,

 

Yewneik

 

 

IMG_9500.pdf

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read the letter carefully and a few threads here in the same forum

doesn't say WILL anything

and a DCA is not the debt owner.

 

and that id not a letter of claim

 

ignore

 

PDF next time please

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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ZZPS are paper tigers, they can no more take you to court than Larry the No 10 cat can.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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  • 2 weeks later...

Usual series of letter s if you go read like threads here

Its actually from zzps using QDR letterhead in the same printer the last one came from.

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • 2 months later...

Right, A big boy come this time,

 

Should I be getting my ducks in a row now?

 

I assume I can use the included form to request their cctv records of the day, and their planning permission for signage and ANPR cameras in the car park?

 

Or is it time to suck it up, pay them a stupid amount of money and save myself from having my credit score buggered?

 

Cheers all

 

Y

PCN-250321s.pdf

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have you not been reading up here in the last 2 months?

CAG is about self help too..then you'd already know how to respond and what and whatto do say...

 

snotty letter time.

everything else you mention is not for now or p'haps ever unless they do get northants bulk to issue you a speculative claimform hoping you'll think as you have above and wet yourself and cough up like most mugs do...

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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  • dx100uk changed the title to CEL ANPR PCN PAPLOC- Morrisons, Butterfly Walk Car Park Denmark Hill Camberwell, London SE5 8RW - paid-did not enter Reg No - POPLA rejected appeal

Thanks DX100uk, Will dig in.

 

If there's a specific article to look at I'd appreciate the link. I assume I write them a letter stating that the claim is unjustified etc. Will look for templates on the forum.

 

Thanks for all your on going help. Obviously don't want to give these buggers anything if I don't have to.

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Using miley_b ob 's great letter as a template, is the below along the right lines:

 

Dear Civil Enforcement (CEL) Limited

 

I write in response to your Letter Before Action - Claim for Debt , which I have received in relation to PCN Number: ?????, you have issued in response to a case I have explained is baseless.

 

I am writing to notify you that I have no intention of paying these ridiculous and made-up sums of money, for allegedly breaking some imaginary contract with yourselves. Expecting me to pay you a baseless fine for not entering my cars registration details amounts to extortion. You already have my £2 for parking in your car park, a fact I'm sure you realise due to the fact you own all CCTV in the carpark. I would also reference the fact that the parking meter that issued me a ticket without entering my registration has since been fixed, which shows that you are fully aware of the problems it has caused.

 

You have also scored a big own goal by adding a £82 admin fee. Presumably, this admin fee is some sort of unicorn food tax. I suggest that you look at DDJ Harvey’s judgement at Lewes County Court on 05/02/2020 (Claim number F0HM9E9Z). He was not very happy with these made-up amounts, was he?

 

You can either drop this foolishness now or get a good spanking in court. The choice is yours.

 

Hopefully we will not be speaking again,

 

xxxx

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What you've written is top draw in the snottiness stakes... 

 

... and includes excellent legal arguments as to why their case is pants. But there is the problem. We have a case at the moment where a motorist wrote a detailed defence full of superb legal points - which gave the PPC's solicitors months to think up lies to counter those points. Forum regular dx always emphasises not to play your cards too early, and that's why. It's best to keep the fleecers guessing. So I would suggest - 

 

 

Dear Civil Enforcement (CEL) Limited

 

I write in response to your Letter Before Action - Claim for Debt , which I have received in relation to PCN Number: ?????.

 

I am writing to notify you that I have no intention of paying these ridiculous and made-up sums of money, for allegedly breaking some imaginary contract with yourselves. 

 

Go and look up "de minimis" saddos. 

 

You have also scored a big own goal by adding a £82 admin fee. Presumably, this admin fee is some sort of unicorn food tax. I suggest that you look at DDJ Harvey’s judgement at Lewes County Court on 05/02/2020 (Claim number F0HM9E9Z). He was not very happy with these made-up amounts, was he?

 

You can either drop this foolishness now or get a good spanking in court. The choice is yours.

 

I look forward to your defeaning silence. 

 

 

- see tomorrow if any of the regulars suggest further tweaking, then send off on Wednesday with a free Certificate of Posting from the post office. 

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

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Yes at this stage less is more, otherwise it givews them ammunition in how they think a defence will play out.Its to let them know theit position is pants and they will waste good coin chasing you for no gain.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

 

The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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Right last version before I throw it in the Post.

 

Dear Civil Enforcement Limited (CEL)

 

I write in response to your Letter Before Action - Claim for Debt , which I have received in relation to PCN Number: xxx

 

I am writing to notify you that I have no intention of paying these ridiculous invented penaltys, for allegedly breaking an imaginary contract with yourselves. Muddied misplaced signage does not magically create a contract, that after having paid for a ticket, of which you are well aware, allow you to harass and extort me for money.

 

Especially in the current climate, bombarding me with invented penaltys has cast a dark cloud over an already incredibly difficult year.

 

You have also put yourselves in a poor standing moving forward, aside harrassing me with threats of bailiffs being sent to my house without due process, but illegally adding a £82 administration fee, presumably as some sort of unicorn food tax. I suggest that you look at DDJ Harvey’s judgement at Lewes County Court on 05/02/2020 (Claim number F0HM9E9Z). He was not very happy with these made-up amounts.

 

You can either drop this foolishness now or I will instruct legal council, compile my case against your dispicible company, and look forward to walking over you in court.

 

I hope we can call this matter over with, and that to that end I will never have to suffer another one of your pointless letters again.

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Send what you want, but the version in post 74 is much better.

 

You're playing your cards far too early.  The reason I suggested the line "Go and look up "de minimis" saddos" is because it shows you know the law and what is wrong with their case - without actually telling them what is "de minimis".

 

Plus they know you won't instruct legal counsel, the cost would be more than their claim, and you could never claim a solicitor's fees back at small claims.

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

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