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    • Sorry to hear about the "playground insults".    The fact you didn't write "without prejudice" means the letter could be produced in court, not that the PPCs ever seem to do so.  Well, so what?  Minister Baywatch HAVE made up fictitious charges.  Courts HAVE told the PPCs off for this numerous times.  DDJ Harvey DID go ballistic about this.  I don't' see what's wrong in refuting a claim and referring to a persuasive court case to back up your position. 
    • Thanks Dx. I have tidied the defence up with your suggestions amended. Does it look right now? Thanks!   1.    Monies due under current account facility xxxxxxxxxxxx. The claimants claim is for the balance outstanding under the facility provided by Halifax to the defendant. It was a term of the bank account that any debit balance would be repayable by the defendant in full on demand.   2.    The defendant has failed to repay the amount due following the service of a demand.   3.    The debt was assigned to the claimant.   4.    The claimant therefore claims 1. 5k 2. costs   Defence   1. The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are vague and generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.     2. The Claimants statement of case fails to give adequate information to enable me to properly assess my position with regards the claim.    3. The Claimant’s Particulars of Claim fail to state when the agreement was entered into.   4. Paragraph 1, Whilst I accept that I have in the past held a current account with Halifax Bank Plc. I have not serviced this account since 08/07/2016 due to the punitive charges and interest being applied which made the account untenable and impossible to facilitate. The amount claimed is far in excess of any agreed overdraft limit with Halifax Bank. I deny that the account exceeded an agreed overdraft limit due to overdrawing of funds and claim that this is a result of unfair and extortionate bank charges/penalties being applied to the account. It is therefore denied that I am indebted for any alleged outstanding residue.    5. Paragraph 2 is denied as the original creditor has failed to serve a Notice served under 76(1) and 98(1) of the CCA1974 Demand / Recall Notice and the Claimant is put to strict proof to evidence any breach.    6. Paragraph 2 is further denied as i am unaware of Halifax Bank ever providing me with a copy of the Notice served under 76(1) and 98(1) of the CCA1974 Demand / Recall Notice and Notice of Assignment.   7. Paragraph 3 is denied. I am not aware or ever receiving any Notice of Assignment pursuant to the Law of Property Act 1925. It is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of Section 136 of the Law of Property Act and Section 82A of the consumer credit Act 1974. The Claimant has yet to provide a copy of the Notice of Assignment its claim relies upon.   8. Paragraph 4 is denied. I refute the claimants claim is owed or payable. The amount claimed is comprised of amongst others default penalties/charges levied on the account for alleged late, missed or over limit payments. The court will be aware that these charge types and the recoverability thereof have been judicially declared to be susceptible to assessments of fairness under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 The Office of Fair Trading v Abbeyicon National PLC and others (2009). I will contend at trial that such charges are unfair in their entirety.   9. As per Civil Procedure icon Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed. The claimant is also put to strict proof to:-.     a. Provide a copy agreement/facility arrangement along with the Terms and conditions at inception, which this claim is based on. b. Provide a breakdown of their excessive charging/fees levied to the account with justification. c. Show how the Claimant has reached the amount claimed. d. Show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim. (f) Show how they have complied with sections III & IV of Practice Direction - Pre-action Conduct.   e. Provide a copy of the Notice served under 76(1) and 98(1) of the CCA1974 Demand /Recall Notice and Notice of Assignment.   10. On receipt of this claim I immediately requested documentation by way of a CPR 31.14 request, which was received by the Claimant on the *******. The Claimant has failed to comply with this request. Therefore the claimant in their non compliance to my requests have frustrated my attempts to clarify their claim and against pre action protocol should be considered when the question of costs arise.     11. By reason of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.    
    • MPs are pushing authorities to respond to allegations of potential fraud at certain banks, whereby it’s claimed home repossession documents weren’t actually signed by the authorised signatory View the full article
    • Thanks Dx. Amended defence set out below. Does it look right now?   1. By agreement between the defendant and Halifax on or around the 3/3/2015 (the agreement) Halifax agreed to loan the defendant monies.     2.The defendant did not pay instalments as they fell due.     3.The agreement was terminated following a service of a default notice.     4.The agreement was assigned to the claimant.     5.The claimant therefore claims 1. 4.5k 2. Costs    Defence   1. The Defendant contends that the particulars of claim are vague and generic in nature. The Defendant accordingly sets out its case below and relies on CPR r 16.5 (3) in relation to any particular allegation to which a specific response has not been made.     2. The Claimant has not complied with paragraph 3 of the PAPDC (Pre Action Protocol) Failed to serve a letter of claim pre claim pursuant to PAPDC changes of the 1st October 2017. It is respectfully requested that the court take this into consideration pursuant to 7.1 PAPDC.     3. Paragraph 1 is denied. It is accepted that I have had financial dealings with Halifax in the past. However I do not recall entering into any financial agreement with Halifax on or around 03/03/2015 and have sought verification from the claimant who has not complied with my request for further information.     4. Paragraph 2 is denied. I am not aware of any payment terms for the stated agreement.     5. Paragraph 3 is denied. It is denied that Cabot Financial served any Default notice on the Defendant pursuant to s87 Consumer Credit Act 1974. The Claimant is required to prove that a compliant Default Notice was served upon the Defendant. The Claimant is required to prove that the any Default notice relied upon complied with the requirements of s88(4A) Consumer Credit Act 1974 and that the notice was in the prescribed form as required by The Consumer Credit Enforcement Default and Termination Notice Regulations 1983.   6. Paragraph 4 is denied as I am unaware of any legal assignment or Notice of Assignment allegedly served by either the claimant or the original creditor.     7. It is therefore denied with regards to the Defendant owing any monies to the Claimant; the Claimant has failed to provide any evidence of credit agreement / assignment / balance / breach requested by CPR 31.14, and remains in default of my section 77 request, therefore the Claimant is put to strict proof to:   a. Show how the Defendant has entered into an agreement; and   b. Show how the Defendant has reached the amount claimed for; and   c. Show how the Claimant has the legal right, either under statute or equity to issue a claim     8. On receipt of this claim I requested by way of Royal Mail on 13/10/20 a CPR 31.14 request from the claimant’s solicitors and a section 77 requests to the Claimant, for copies of the documents referred to within the Claimant’s particulars to establish what the claim is for. To date the Claimant has failed to comply with my section 77 request and their solicitors, Mortimer Clarke, have refused my CPR 31.14 request.     9. As per Rule 16.5(4), it is expected that the Claimant prove the allegation that the money is owed.     10. On the alternative, as the Claimant is an assignee of a debt, it is denied that the Claimant has the right to lay a claim due to contraventions of Section 136 of the Law of Property Act and Section 82 A of the Consumer Credit Act 1974     11. By reasons of the facts and matters set out above, it is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief claimed or any relief.  
    • I'm generally convinced that there is at least 2 users on MSE that's in my thread that has friends or family or even themselves that have similar line of work to MB or Gladstone.   I don't mind different opinions but they're just throwing out playground insults to me for using that letter saying I'm stupid, prat, idiot etc etc for doing it and not including in the letter without prejudice so it can't be used against me in court. I think I'll leave MSE and just stick with CAG and in this case.    
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      After a summer of discontent with ASG I discovered that if you have paid HALF the agreement or more you can legally return the boiler to them at no cost to yourself. I've just returned mine the feeling is liberating.
       
      It all started mid summer during lockdown when they refused to service our boiler because we didn't have a loft ladder or flooring installed despite the fact AS installed the boiler. and had previosuly serviced it without issue for 4yrs. After consulting with an independent installer I was informed that if this was the case then ASG had breached building regulations,  this was duly reported to Gas Safe to investigate and even then ASG refused to accept blame and repeatedly said it was my problem. Anyway Gas Safe found them in breach of building regs and a compromise was reached.
       
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    • Dazza a few months ago I discovered a good friend of mine who had ten debts with cards and catalogues which he was slavishly paying off at detriment to his own family quality of life, and I mean hardship, not just absence of second holidays or flat screen TV's.
       
      I wrote to all his creditors asking for supporting documents and not one could provide any material that would allow them to enforce the debt.
       
      As a result he stopped paying and they have been unable to do anything, one even admitted it was unenforceable.
       
      If circumstances have got to the point where you are finding it unmanageable you must ask yourself why you feel the need to pay.  I guarantee you that these companies have built bad debt into their business model and no one over there is losing any sleep over your debt to them!  They will see you as a victim and cash cow and they will be reluctant to discuss final offers, only ways to keep you paying with threats of court action or seizing your assets if you have any.
       
      They are not your friends and you owe them no loyalty or moral duty, that must remain only for yourself and your family.
       
      If it was me I would send them all a CCA request.   I would bet that not one will provide the correct response and you can quite legally stop paying them until such time as they do provide a response.   Even when they do you should check back here as they mostly send dodgy photo copies or generic rubbish that has no connection with your supposed debt.
       
      The money you are paying them should, as far as you are able, be put to a savings account for yourself and as a means of paying of one of these fleecers should they ever manage to get to to the point of a successful court judgement.  After six years they will not be able to start court action and that money will then become yours.
       
      They will of course pursue you for the funds and pass your file around various departments of their business and out to third parties.
       
      Your response is that you should treat it as a hobby.  I have numerous files of correspondence each faithfully organised showing the various letters from different DCA;s , solicitors etc with a mix of threats, inducements and offers.   It is like my stamp collection and I show it to anyone who is interested!
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Excel ANPR PCN Claimform - Brewery St car park, Chesterfield on 02.07. 2018


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No, they haven't covered themselves.  It was the driver of the car who entered into any contract with Excel.  It's got nothing to do with you.  You weren't even there!

 

So in your defence I'd add something like "I was not the driver of the vehicle and so could not enter into any contract with Excel". 

 

Also "The driver of the car effected complete payment of the parking fee".

 

The easiest way to see if the place is covered by bye-laws is to go back there if the place is local to you, or get someone who lives locally to do so.  There are normally signs up about bye-laws.

We could do with some help from you.

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you have till sunday week to AOS   can you not use the lost details link?   https://www.access.service.gov.uk/login/signin/creds   get the CPR off today! do MCOL lat

Sorry, there's just so much to read through and I can never seem to find stuff that's specifically relevant to me.   If it's any consolation, I now know what it's like to be on the other end

If you draft a WS along the lines suggested, include a photocopy of the ticket as Exhibit X related to point about they say you hadn't paid, then say well not displayed so breach of T & Cs, can't

they have abused the law by trying to add 2 different things togethjer as a single point whe they actualkly fail to create the conditions to create a contact by either of them alone.

so your simple defence is

1 the defendant was not the driver at the time and no keeper liability ahs been created under the POFA2012

2 the driver at the time paid the prescribed fee so there was no breach of contract and thus no cause of action against anyone.

 

The defendant requests that the claim be struck out by the court using its management powers under CPR 3.4

 

 

now the last bit probably wont happen but if the court clerks read this properly then the chances are Excel will be forced to show they do have proof of their claim or it will be booted out. Quite often all that happens is the paperwork is filed until later so if you dont hear anmything dont be surprised

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Thanks for that, appreciate it. I've not had chance yet to have a good read through those links etc, I've got another couple of weeks yet I think.

 

Should that be enough then, along with a brief explanation of what actually happened on the day?

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Just file the 4-line defence that EB has suggested.  Nothing more.  That's all that is needed at this stage.

 

If Excel are stupid enough to continue with the case, you will have time later on to expand on what happened at WS stage.

 

I think your deadline is 9 August, whatever you do don't miss it!

 

 

 

 

 

We could do with some help from you.

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didn't need too at this stage 

we hit them with that later so they waste more money on court fees...

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

 

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

 

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

 

 

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15 hours ago, Slaughter64 said:

Surely it will help if I explain the ticket was purchased and I still have it etc? They don't know the details as yet.

No, thye are the ones whio have to prove their case so let them waste £100 of their money getting nowhere rather than you spend money on a stamp.

you can have them for breach of the GDPR later if you want becasue they have lied to the DVLA to get your keeper details and then  continued to process your data unfairly. You might have a claim for harassment as well but the bar is set quite high for that.

these parking co's back out of thousands of claims when thye are challenged and if everyone of those sued Simon would be out of business

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  • 2 weeks later...

Ok, I filed the short defence and have received a Notice of Proposed Allocation to the small claims track, along with a N180 Directions Questionnaire.

 

I presume this is standard procedure, but what do I put? Do I agree to the case being referred to Mediation? What about the questions referring to the 

potential court hearing etc?

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No to  mediation

We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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so you've not been reading up here in the 'downtime' between stages?

plenty of pcn claimform threads here on with what to do.

 

dx

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

 

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

 

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

 

 

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Sorry, there's just so much to read through and I can never seem to find stuff that's specifically relevant to me.

 

If it's any consolation, I now know what it's like to be on the other end of inane and repetitive questions, from the forum that I frequent regularly, in my own field!

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Narrow your search 

 

Pcn claimform n180

 

Dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

 

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

 

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

 

 

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  • 1 month later...

I just received a Notice of Trial date and a N157 Allocation to Hearing (early Jan).

Bit of a shock tbh, but I guess they may still pull out

and just pay the 25 quid.

All I've had from Excel in the meantime is an offer of reduced fine to £125.

 

I now have a few weeks (early Dec) to prepare my witness statement.

I'm presuming I am the witness in this case, even thought the wife was using the car at the time -

I've not told her this is ongoing as she would worry too much (and would have just paid the original fine).

Any help or guidance or things

I should include in the statement, I  would be extremely grateful.

 

I guess I'll know if they are taking this all the way if I receive a copy of their evidence in due course?

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witness statement time then

plenty here use our search.

 

you most certainly don't mention anything about your wife driving.

and ofcourse you having the ticket still will blow them out the water.

esp as their trade body has just stated in the new proposed guidelines 

such issues as yours would not result in a PCN

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

 

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

 

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

 

 

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Play this right and you will have a nice claim under GDPR against Excel. the existence of the ticket and its scanned image as an exhibit will be a killer for Excel.

We could do with some help from you.

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If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

 

The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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Why should I not mention that my wife was driving? Excel already know this, AND that I still have the ticket, from my original letter

to appeal to the fine from two years ago. They still rejected it, just saying it was not clearly displayed. The court don't know any of this,

so surely they'll throw it out once they know all the facts?

 

I'd just like this to go away, I don't want to drag it out any further and appeal against them, I could just do without the hassle.

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fine?

 

dx

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

 

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

 

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

 

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

 

 

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3.At all material times the Defendant was the registered keeper and/or driver.

 

They are suing You as Keeper, saying who was driving at this point is counter productive.  Work up a WS and post it up as PDF then we can help fine tune it If Excel are suing the wrong person as if they knew she was driving at appeal they should have been suing her.  Or have I missed something here?

We could do with some help from you.

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Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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The matter won't just "go away", and was never going to from the moment that you decided, quite rightly, to fight it.

 

You're being taken to court, and you need to prepare for that, in particular you need to prepare a Witness Statement.

 

Simon has a lot of previous of starting cases he knows he has no chance of winning, as a tactic to try to intimidate the motorist into paying, and then withdrawing the claim after WS stage.   This may well happen to you.  But even if you do end up in court, a civil court hearing is no more intimidating than a job interview.

 

Remember that Excel's case is total and utter pants.  You are quite clearly legally in the right.

 

No, you won't find a WS on CAG that perfectly fits your own case, but what you will find is parts of different WSs that you can use.  In particular

   - Excel have no locus standi (that bit should be easy)

   - no planning permission (again, easy)

   - no keeper liability

   - they suffered no loss and are suing over a triviality.

 

 

We could do with some help from you.

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I certainly mentioned in a letter to them that she was driving, but I'm the registered keeper anyway, that's what they're focussing on.

 

I really don't want to go to court, even if it is straightforward and easy, I could just do without wasting the best part of a day, not to mention the hours I'll have to spend putting the WS together.

I still don't see why not telling the Court the whole story at this stage will work against me.

 

I can see it from you guys' point of view - to make him go all the way, but you need to see it from mine.

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If you draft a WS along the lines suggested, include a photocopy of the ticket as Exhibit X related to point about they say you hadn't paid, then say well not displayed so breach of T & Cs, can't do that to you as keeper as POFA not met.  A robust WS might well make Simple cut and run, he won't want to be tolchocked by a DJ for his rubbish POC and potential abuse of process. If he cries off you can hit him for around £500 for flagrant breach of GDPR.

 

Its either WS and submit, or cough up his "generous" offer (NOT) of a reduced invoice. Or sit on hands and wait for the inevitable Default Judgment, and Simon walks away laughing.

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We could do with some help from you.

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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Brassnecked is spot on.

 

You don't seem to understand that courts run to a legal procedure, and there's nothing you, me or any of us can do about that.

 

Excel have decided to sue you.  You have chosen to defend the claim.  The next stage is that both parties have to prepare WSs.  That's how the courts work.

 

The court will give you every opportunity to state your case - in the WS and then later in person in court (if it gets that far).

 

You can of course decide not to prepare a WS.  In that case you will have nothing to rely on in court, the judge will only hear Excel's side and you will lose the case.  Sorry, but if you want to beat Excel you need to put some work in. 

 

 

We could do with some help from you.

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 Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

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It does say in the small print that I do not have to attend the hearing, and it will be heard in my absence (as long as they have notice), not sure if that is advised.

 

Best get writing that WS then...

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