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VCS Spycar PCN PAPLOC - now claimform - no stopping - East Midlands Airport


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Thanks.  I'll have a look at your WS this evening.

 

Dealing with a court hearing in England when you live abroad is not something that crops up much here, and TBH I'm not sure what the procedure is.  However, never fear, either more experienced Site Team members will pop in during the day, or if they don't I'll flag your post up this evening and invite them to contribute.

 

Do I take it that until the court date this month you have family members living at your old address who will see any post from the court or from VCS?

We could do with some help from you.

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OK, I've had a look at your WS.  It's excellent, there are just a couple of paragraphs that need to be moved round to make your arguments clearer.

 

It's just a personal preference but I've seen some cracking WSs on the forum where the OP has added titles to the various sections to make it clearer to the judge what legal points are being argued.  I would therefore suggest the following sections with the odd paragraph moved:

 

Introduction: 1-6.

 

Locus Standi: 7, 8, 13.  Add to (13) that you do not believe the Claimant possesses these documents.

 

Bye-laws: 9, 10.  I would split (10) into two points, one about the RTA, and one about bye-laws, and lay it on thick about bye-laws which is one of your strongest points.

 

(11) is repetition and can go.

 

Prohibition: 12, 17.

 

Enforcement area: 14, 15, 16.

 

Double recovery: 18-25.

 

A couple of typos.  (4.2) "within 4 minutes".

 

In "7", you finish with "there is no valid contract end of".  I would change that to "there is no valid contract".  Small claims encourage informality but there's taking it too far!

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We could do with some help from you.

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I've just reread the thread and remembered that Simon is representing himself here.  So before your current (18), at the start of the "Double Recovery" section, stick in another paragraph "The Claimant's Particulars of Claim include £50 legal costs, yet in a letter I received on XXXXX (exhibit XXXXX) the Claimant states that they are not represented by solicitors but are representing themselves".

 

Change the start of current (18) to: "As well as £50 legal costs, The Claimant seeks recovery of ..."

 

When you get time, please post up a revised version of the WS and we'll see what the other regulars think.

We could do with some help from you.

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That Legal costs is one of the keys there for sure well spotted Dave.

We could do with some help from you.

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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I've asked for advice from Site Team members more experienced than me.  If these were normal times your move would be a problem, but as the hearing will be by video link due to COVID it really makes no odds where you connect from.  Simply follow the court's instructions for logging on that day.  Other stuff though -

 

Please retweak your WS and post up a new version so the other regulars can comment, and obviously later respect the court's deadline for sending it to the court and to Simon.

 

Don't forget to check if Simon actually pays the hearing fee on 1 September.

 

What worries me somewhat is that there may be a period between your family relocating and the court date when important court papers could turn up at your old address, unchecked.  If this is so, then say a week before the move contact both the court and Simon, make it quite clear you will be attending, but state you have moved and you want any documentation to be e-mailed.  We normally don't advise use of e-mail but if you're in the Middle East really there's no other choice.

We could do with some help from you.

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Posted (edited)

I have had another look at your WS and I see that you didn't include perhaps a key point.

 

That the airport is not owned by EMA but by Manchester air group so as they are the land owner they are the ones who should be signing any contract with VCS. And even if they have allowed EMA to sign on their behalf there must be some kind of confirmation from MAG.

 

No contract means VCS lose since PoFA is based on their being a contact between the motorist and VCS. Of course this another example of VCS not complying with their COP and yet another dubious claim that the WS is a true statement. You must hammer home the veracity of the WS and their breaches of their COP.

 

The more things you can challenge that puts them in a bad light with the Judge the more likely is that they won't go ahead with the case.

https://www.airport-technology.com/projects/east_midlands_airpor/gs

 

I have looked at their NTK and it is a pity that you outed yourself as the driver when you appealed as the NTK is not PoFA compliant. If there is a next time do not appeal or write the appeal in a manner that you do not expose yourself as the driver.

 

Edited by dx100uk
block of text spaced to paragraphs
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7. The Particulars of Claim submitted by the Claimant state that the claim is for “A breach of contract for
breaching the terms and conditions set on private land; namely Stopping in a zone where stopping is
prohibited.”. It is contended that the No Legal contract existeds between the VCS and the East Midlands
Airport at for the time of this incidence.t

 

Definition of "Relevant contract"
from PoFA 2 [1] means a contract (including a contract arising only when the vehicle was parked on the
relevant land) between the driver and a person who is-
(a)the owner or occupier of the land; or
(b) authorised, under or by virtue of arrangements made by the owner or occupier of the land, to enter into a
contract with the driver requiring the payment of parking charges in respect of the parking of the vehicle on
the land.
According to https:j/www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/46/section/44
For a contract to be valid requires a director from each company to sign and then two independent witnesses
must confirm those signatures. The fact that no witness signatures are present means the deed has not been
validly executed. Therefore, there can be no contract established between VCS and the motorist. And even
if "no stopping" could form a contract [which it cannot], it is immaterial. There is no valid contract end of.

 

im not sure on the above , well TBH the whole of this from for...but most certainly i would not be using ....There is no valid contract end of.

 

just musings

 

 

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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Thank you guys @FTMDave @lookinforinfo  @brassnecked   I appreciate the effort you guys put in. I have now updated the WS. please see attacehd. attached separately the "negotiation letter" where they would be seeking further costs of £220. mentioned about that in Point 19 and attached the same letter in Section 3. I am still not sure which letter states that Simon would be representing himself. can you please help on that?

 

Family would be in the UK till 06 Sep. will check Simon's payment on 1 and send him and court the letter on the same day about move.

In the County Court - FI_Redacted.pdf

8. VCS Negotiation Letter_Redacted.pdf

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He definitely wants to claw something out of it, he might well have squeaky cheeks, and the £220, an attempt to scare.   The other's will be along soon.

We could do with some help from you.

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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Your WS is superb - well done on all the work you've put in.  File it with the court and send to Simon nearer to the court's deadline.  That also leaves time in case any of the other regulars have tweaks to suggest.

 

I love the way you've "hoisted Simon by his own ..." by including the ludicrous letter saying they will ask the court for a further £220 in costs.  This is a complete lie to try to frighten you.  We've seen this letter several times and never have VCS asked the court for these costs, simply because they know costs are capped at £50 and they would be humiliated before the judge.  But now it is you who have brought the letter to the judge's attention  👏

 

Jake Burgess who normally signs these letters has now morphed into George Burgess.  Or maybe his younger brother now also works for Simon!

 

The letter where VCS say they are representing themselves is the one you got in April, uploaded in post 72.

 

I see you're all primed for 1 September!  Make it clear to the court and Simon that you will be attending, but you have moved and want all communications to be by e-mail.

We could do with some help from you.

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Hi Alaska, who took the photos attached in section 2 from page 14 onwards?

 

The reason I ask, although it may be mute, is that part of the defence is predicated on the fact that stopping doesn't consitute parking, then in the witness statement there are photo's of what could be a parked car.

I wondered what the learned thought of introducing such evidence.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Ask the court monday

please don't hit Quote...just type we know what we said earlier..

DCA's view debtors as suckers, marks and mugs

NO DCA has ANY legal powers whatsoever on ANY debt no matter what it's Type

and they

are NOT and can NEVER  be BAILIFFS. even if a debt has been to court..

If everyone stopped blindly paying DCA's Tomorrow, their industry would collapse overnight... 

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