Managing Agent leasehold Property 4th Court Claim same issue.

[BlurredFX]

Thanks Andyorch, your on-going help is much appreciated. I can't remember if it got to allocation or not...

 

Hiya Guys,

 

I've just spoken to the Court once again.

 

On the 17th the Claimant informed the court it was settled, and apparently the claim has ceased.

That is the sum of the information I managed to glean (verbally) from the kind lady I spoke to.

 

I know the Claimant has had contact with the court.

 

 

The Claimant also has a nasty habit of submitting documents to the Court but not me...

 

I can't remember if it got to allocation or not..

he was ordered to submit a fully particularised case, which he failed to do,

does that mean it didn't get allocated?

 

 

I don't suppose you can allocate it without a properly particularised claim.

The judge warned him he'd be needing a solicitor...

 

I know it's possible to get the documents, because the Claimant had copies of medical documents I had supplied to the Court when I applied for a series of stays. I did not submit these to the Claimant, and the only people to have them were the Court, ergo, it's possible.

 

I really want any documents as my case is drawn out and I want to be able to explain, with evidence, what has happened, step by step to a Judge

- as frankly it beggars belief.

 

 

I also want to make sure he hasn't been submitting things to the Court but not me.

 

 

I know he continues in excluding me from decisions and communications about the service charges, as well as ongoing issues with double glazing.

 

 

They are also refusing to send a bill out

- they sent me a statement of account showing the amounts from the Court case as still due.

.. despite withdrawing the case, but not a properly executed invoice as required by law.

 

Blurred:)

[AndyOrch]

Then ask the court for a copy of the claimants disclosures.

[BlurredFX]

Then ask the court for a copy of the claimants disclosures.

 

I will do exactly that. Thanks. It's the correct wording that sometimes escapes me, and at my local Court if you don't know what you're asking for, they won't tell you.

 

I spoke to a Director of our RTM company and it appears that they finally took some legal advice and the advice was to withdraw their claim as they would lose - and the solicitor charged them £1,500 for the privilege hahaha.

 

The Director of our company said he would get onto the management co and get a corrected statement of account out to me - which is probably just as good a copy of their withdrawal letter to the Court.

 

So, I know that they know, that they are onto a loser. if that makes sense.

 

I'll get onto the Court in the morning.

 

Blurred:)

[BlurredFX]

Evening Folks,

 

I have a thread that is 17 pages and ten years old, but I cannot comment on it, so I am starting a new one. The old link is at the bottom. Does AndyDD still help on the forums?

 

I am happy that my legal position is right, but I want to know if my defence makes sense. My defence needs to be in next week.

The claim states that I 'enterred into a long leasehold interest in 2006. Covenants bind the RTM Company and BlurredFX to pay service charges as specified within the terms of the lease. We therefore request a judgement in favour of the RTM company to the value of £900-ish plus costs'

 

I'm going to see his £900, and raise him £15k, see what happens then. I'm sick of this.

 

There is a long old history to this case, including them getting paid previously for £6k of charges they were not due - that was paid by my lender. That judgement was set aside, but no monies were ever returned. This is the fourth time this has been dragged to court.

 

My first draft of my defence and counter-claim looks like this:

 

24^th – need to find out what was ordered in 1IQ so as to show he was not able to comply

Need documents showing him as a liar – I have those.

 

Quote

 

DEFENCE – skeleton argument

The defendant denies any monies are due to the claimant.

 

The issues within this claim have been the subject of previous litigation by the claimant, and are certainly not as simple as the brief details provided on the claim form. As such, it is requested that the Court order the claimant to file a fully particularised claim.

 

The claimant is a serial litigator, and a failed one, too. He has made numerous untrue statements to the Court at different times. He has invariably been ordered to produce a properly detailed particulars of claim, and despite numerous orders from the Court, has failed to do so.

 

This is because of the claimant’s lack of understanding of the law. He does not understand that a ‘neighbours collective’ is quite distinct from a properly authorised Managing Agent.

 

The claimant New RTM Company Limited established the ‘Right To Manage’ with effect from July 1^st 2014, and the defendant has met all obligations to that company since that date.

 

The defendant has not been furnished with a full statement of account, despite requests.

 

A very brief summary of the claims lodged and withdrawn by the claimant is provided below:

 

CLAIM2009 July 2009 – Claimant issues a claim, and there are hearings. The Court orders the claimant produce properly detailed particulars of claim, and then the claimant withdraws his claim.

 

CLAIM2011 May 2011 – Claimant issues a claim. Defendant is incapaciteted in Hospital. Claimant is swiftly awarded Judgement in Default.

 

September 2011 – Claimant makes an untrue claim to the Court (DOCUMENT) in order to SOMETHING SOMETHING and then threatens the defendant’s lender with a s146 notice.

DATE – PAYMENT MADE BY GE Money

                                Jan 2013 – Judgement is set aside, hearing is scheduled. WAS AN ORDER MADE for pariculars??

                                May 2013 – Claimant fails to turn up for a scheduled hearing.

 

CLAIM2014 August 2014 – Claimant issues a claim. Claim is stayed multiple times due to Defendant’s well documented hospitalisation.

April 2016 – There is a hearing. The claimant is ordered to produce a detailed particulars of claim. The claimant fails to do so. The claimant ceases his claim.

 

The Claimant has made many opportunities over three different claims and countless hearings and to clearly state his case, but has failed to do so despite the orders of the court.

 

The defendant has made all payments due to the claimant. The defendant has also made payment for his share for new double glazing to the whole of The Block (over £5,000).

 

The defendant is confused and embarrassed

 

Counterclaim – Skeleton Argument

Verbal agreements have been broken by the claimant.

 

Prior to July 2014, a ‘neighbours collective’ incorporated as ‘Informa Management Company’ was operating informally, and without the permission of the Landlord. That company made two claims against the Defendant, and collected a payment of £6262,61 that it was not entitled to.

 

CLAIM2009 was discontinued after the claimant (Informal Management Company) informed the Court the Defendant had settled the Claimant’s demands.

 

CLAIM2011 claim was issued, again with ‘Informal Management Company’ as the claimant. He obtained a judgement in default, which was subsequently set-aside.

 

Before that judgement (CLAIM2011) was set-aside, the Claimant signed a declaration to the Court that he was CHECK a duly appointed Managing Agent. This was not true. The claimant knowingly lied to the Court to obtain the defendant’s money. He has failed to repay that money.

 

Immediately following New Legit RTM Company Limited establishing it’s ‘Right To Manage’  in 2014 the claimant lodged a new claim, CLAIM2014. Once again, he failed to establish his case.

 

Without a properly particularised claim, the Defendant is unable to file a properly particularised defence and counter-claim.

 

The claimant has failed to return the amount paid when his claim 1IQ51775 was struck out. Payment was made in August of 2011, for the amount of £6,000 roughly.

 

Therefore, the defendant makes a provisional counter-claim for that amount plus statutory interest from August 2011. A provisional figure of £12,500 roughly, is given assuming an end date of August 2020. This amount is reducing by £95 a month.

 

Further, costs for each claim CLAIM2009, CLAIM2011, and CLAIM2014 are likely to be 50 hours each, at the prevailing rate for a litigant in person.

 

150 hours @ £19 per hour = £2,850

 

TOTAL APPROXIMATE CLAIM COUNTER-CLAIM: £15,368.99

 

 

 

[BankFodder]

I've merged this recent post with your old thread which is now unlocked – but as it is so long – 17 pages, I think it would be helpful if you could go through the story in a reasonably brief bullet pointed chronology without too much narrative because I don't think anybody could be expected to rehearse the whole thing.

AndyDD is no longer on the site team and I'm not sure if he has visited here for some time

 

I'm also going to say that looking very briefly at the document you posted above, it is far too emotive, angry and frankly a bit immature – I'm not intending to insult you – but you need to get rid of some of the stuff and I'm going to amend it in red.
The things I'm going to colour in red should either be left out altogether or you should change them into a more professional way of expressing yourself

 

Well I've made a few edits – but quite frankly the whole thing is so confused that it's impossible to do any more.

I think you need to lay out the story in a very brief chronological bullet pointed fashion – as I have already asked.

Certainly you should avoid saying that people are liars or that they deliberately did that or they deliberately did this. Your document should be in properly numbered paragraphs – one point per paragraph so the chronology is clear and it follows a logical chronological order. I'm afraid that what you have written seems to dance around.

I suggest that you put up the claim form to begin with – in scanned PDF form and then your defence. I don't understand whether what you posted above is a defence or a skeleton argument. You seem to have both there. You can't have a "provisional counterclaim". Either you are making counterclaim we are not. You can't claim approximate sums – roughly. You can claim for sums "not exceeding £X X X".

But the sums you are claiming need to be justified.
I'm afraid that what you put here is getting close to rambling and incoherent and I can scarcely imagine that any judge could be bothered.

That's just for starters.
 

 

Well firstly what was ordered in 2013 when he failed to show up? There must have been some order.

Please can you post up the orders which were made in the 2009 hearing and the 2014 hearing

 

[BlurredFX]

I'd rather I was corrected here than in Court.

Thank you.  

 

[BlurredFX]

 

 

 

 

I think I need to ask for a fully particularised claim?? In it's current form, it is not sufficiently detailed for me to plead??

 

Anyway...
 

DEFENCE – skeleton argument

 

The defendant denies any monies are due to the claimant.

 

The issues within this claim have been the subject of previous litigation by the claimant, and are certainly not as simple as the brief details provided on the claim form. As such, it is requested that the Court order the claimant to file a fully particularised claim.

 

The claimant is a serial litigator. He has invariably been ordered to produce a properly detailed particulars of claim, and despite numerous orders from the Court, has failed to do so.
 

The defendant has not been furnished with a full statement of account, despite requests.

 

A very brief summary of the claims lodged and withdrawn by the claimant is provided below:

 

CLAIM2009        July 2009 – Claimant issues a claim, and there are hearings. The Court orders the claimant produce properly detailed particulars of claim, and then the claimant withdraws his claim.

 

CLAIM2011        May 2011 – Claimant issues a claim. Defendant is incapacitated in Hospital. Claimant is swiftly awarded Judgement in Default.

                              September 2011 – Claimant makes an untrue claim to the Court to the effect he is authorised by the Landlord for this claim. The defendant has documentary evidence to the contrary.

                              DATE CHECK Required  – PAYMENT MADE BY GE Money

                              Jan 2013 – Judgement is set aside, hearing is scheduled. **Need to check if particularised claim was ordered**

                              May 2013 – Claimant fails to turn up for a scheduled hearing.

 

CLAIM2014       August 2014 – Claimant issues a claim. Claim is stayed multiple times due to Defendant’s well documented hospitalisation. 

                              April 2016 – There is a hearing. The claimant is ordered to produce a detailed particulars of claim. The claimant fails to do so. The claimant ceases his claim.

 

The Claimant has made many opportunities over three different claims and countless hearings and to clearly state his case, but has failed to do so despite the orders of the court.

 

The defendant is confused.

 

Court order after the hearing where he failed to show up in 2013

:

This is the last communication from the 2009 claim. The claimant withdrew his case before the hearing, but I never got a letter.

 

There were two hearings in 2016, here is the order from after the first:

 

There is one from Jul 2016, too. Bear with me, my computer is a little disorganised.

 

Thanks dx.

 

Here is a copy of the last order I can find before the very last hearing. At the hearing, the claimant was told to get himself a solicitor, and I heard nothing subsequent, as best I can recall.

I have added two more documents to the file:

 

Merged_File.pdf

[dx100uk]

sev short posts merged to OP last post

[AndyOrch]

Does your thread title require an update  ?

 

What is the date of the new claim ?

 

Andy

[BankFodder]

you'll have to monitor this thread for a reply tomorrow but please could you combine all the PDFs into a single multi page document. It's really becoming hard work and I think that you should be more organised in presenting your material to the court and also to us who are trying to help you

[BlurredFX]

Really sorry if I have led you to think I am ungrateful. Please be assured nothing could be further from the truth.

I will get more organised, and revert.

 

[BankFodder]

actually it's getting a bit too much. Your computer may be disorganised but you are simply making a lot of work for us.

please will you stop posting material until you organise yourself so that you can post your material in a presentable u and acceptable way.

also I don't understand why, if you knew that the defence was due next week that you have left it until now to come here and tell us all about it

 

 

[BlurredFX]

40 minutes ago, Andyorch said:

Does your thread title require an update  ?

 

What is the date of the new claim ?

 

Andy

 

Thanks for updating the title.

The new claim has a Date of Service of 5th Mar 2020.

I'd have been online a bit quicker, but it has been a busy fortnight.

My documents are disorganised as I have been very ill over recent years, and I am still hooked up to a machine for 15 hours a day, so this isn't the only challenge I've got. I am grateful for all the help.

I just want the claimant to put a decent case to me, that I can answer. This is a complicated issue, though I understand it fully. It just isn't easy to communicate concisely.

 

1 hour ago, BlurredFX said:

A very brief summary of the claims lodged and withdrawn by the claimant is provided below:

 

CLAIM2009        July 2009 – Claimant issues a claim, and there are hearings. The Court orders the claimant produce properly detailed particulars of claim, and then the claimant withdraws his claim.

 

CLAIM2011        May 2011 – Claimant issues a claim. Defendant is incapacitated in Hospital. Claimant is swiftly awarded Judgement in Default.

                              September 2011 – Claimant makes an untrue claim to the Court to the effect he is authorised by the Landlord for this claim. The defendant has documentary evidence to the contrary.

                              DATE CHECK Required  – PAYMENT MADE BY GE Money

                              Jan 2013 – Judgement is set aside, hearing is scheduled. **Need to check if particularised claim was ordered**

                              May 2013 – Claimant fails to turn up for a scheduled hearing.

 

CLAIM2014       August 2014 – Claimant issues a claim. Claim is stayed multiple times due to Defendant’s well documented hospitalisation. 

                              April 2016 – There is a hearing. The claimant is ordered to produce a detailed particulars of claim. The claimant fails to do so. The claimant ceases his claim.

 

 

What I say above pretty much summarises what happened.

I want the Court to order him to properly particularise his claim, so I can shoot it down. That is easiest for me.

In a nutshell, if I can condense it down further: I was taken to court in 2009 which the claimant withdrew. He tried again in 2011 and a judgement in default was issued. That 2011 judgement was paid, but then the judgement was set-aside - but the claimant never returned the money he received.

I do have a contract with the claimant, from Jul 2014, from whence I have paid what is due. He tried to use the contract signed in 2014 to issue a backdated claim and failed. The claimant thinks we had a contract since 2006 - but I can show that is not the case, only since July 2014.

The pile of documents relating to this is a foot tall. Can someone tell me what would be the best to post?

[dx100uk]

all pdfs merged to a few posts up 

 

dx

 

[BankFodder]

I'm sorry about your illness – and it must be difficult especially during the current crisis. However, the fact that you are pretty busy sort of clashes with the fact that we are pretty busy – and it is we who are helping you. Please remember that we also are suffering confinement, we have our own worries and our own families and our own health fears. It is unfair to the people who help you to leave this kind of thing to the last moment – particularly because a lot of it is because you are simply disorganised.

Because all you are preparing here is a defence, there is no need to start going to skeleton arguments et cetera.

Therefore I suggest broadly:

 

Quote

1. The claimant's claim is denied.
2. It is denied that the defendant is in debt to the claimant as alleged or at all.
3. The claimant has merely produced a brief statement of case and has omitted a detailed particulars of claim.
4. Accordingly it is impossible for the defendant to plead fully and to particularise his defence.
5. If the claimant supplies a properly particularised particulars of claim then the defendant will be able to plead and also to file a counterclaim if it seems appropriate.

I don't think you need to do anything more than this at the moment. I don't think you even need to call attention to the abandoned cases from 2090 2014 at this point.

I would save those very important points until the case develops and particularly until it is transferred to your local court and at which point you can ask for direction and point it out to the judge.

Now I want to make a couple of other comments.

You are referring to the possibility of making a counterclaim for about £15,000. Although this case has been allocated to the small claims track, if you effectively introduce a new cause of action by means of a counterclaim which is wildly in excess of the £10,000 limit on small claims, it becomes possible that the court may exercise its discretion and reallocate this case to the fast track – and in which case you could be liable for costs in the event that you lose the case. We have no idea what the case is about because you haven't told us – and you seem reluctant to do so – and so at the moment we are unable to express a view on this.

Secondly, you say that you have got a file of documents a foot high. It seems to me that you are not in control of these documents. If I'm right then it's about time that you took control and so I would suggest that once you have filed your defence, that you spend the time putting your documents in order and there is a guide about how to deal with a subject access request disclosure or how to prepare a court bundle which I suggest you should follow as a matter of urgency. If this does go to a hearing then you will have to have your documents arranged anyway – and you will have to understand your file very thoroughly and also you will have to have it prepared in a way in which it can be presented to the court and to the other side. A mountain of documents won't cut it – and if you overwhelm the court with effectively a huge and disorganised bundle, you will lose any sympathy that the court might extend to you.

While you are arranging your documents, you might like to go through them carefully and see if there is anything that you can find which is not really relevant – and then you should put those into a separate place so that you know where they are – but they are not included in your relevant file.

In order to arrange a documents you will need ring binders and a hole punch. It may be that you are unable to purchase these at the moment – and so I would suggest that you buy them from Amazon and you can have them delivered reasonably quickly – but even then, while you're waiting, you can surely start to organise your documents.

Finally, I asked you several times to tell us about the case – the story – and you haven't. You seem to think that they be referring to a case in 2009 and then another one in 2011 and another one 2014 tells the story. It doesn't. Maybe somewhere in the 17 page thread it might be possible to tease out the issues – but it's really too much work.

I shall be closing the thread soon – you should use it to make comments about the defence that I have proposed and any other issues relevant to this present stage of your litigation. However, I would like you to tell the whole story in a bullet pointed chronology with the minimum of narrative. We want to know what the charges are about – were they paid – if not why not – and if they were paid then why doesn't the claimant seem to realise that they were paid – et cetera.
In other words we want to know the story that led up to the beginning of the litigation.

Please start a new thread for this because this will be locked so that we can start to look at the situation from zero. Please try not to overwhelm us with rambling information. If it does go to a hearing then it will be good practice for you not to have done this.

 

[BlurredFX]

BF,

 

Thank you for providing the clarity I need. You're right in what you say, and I am grateful for your candid points. I will crack on with typing a defence, and then move on to the whole story.

 

There is no particular reluctance from me regarding the whole story, I will get it typed up - any reticence you detect is probably because there is a fair bit of nuance, and it involves aspects of law that are a bit beyond the usual scope of this forum - but AndyDD did have some experience of them, which was very helpful.

 

To be clear: Without this forum, I would probably have lost my home.

 

Blurred.

[AndyOrch]

Quote

and it involves aspects of law that are a bit beyond the usual scope of this forum

 

 

Such as ?  We have dealt with 100s of similar claims since your last visit over 4 years ago BFX

[BlurredFX]

22 minutes ago, Andyorch said:

Such as ?  We have dealt with 100s of similar claims since your last visit over 4 years ago BFX

 

The leasehold law, and the relationship between Freeholder, Leaseholder, and Managing Agents, and the Right To Manage (RTM).

The details get quite nuances (which I will explain when I start a new thread later today). For example, the Freehold has changed hands, and there are actually two different companies (same personnel, and same management company) that have brought claims against me.

How does my first draft of the defence look?

Always grateful for the time and consideration given to this case.

 

 

Concise Defence.pdf

[AndyOrch]

But all that is irrelevant really when responding to a claim....you only respond to the particulars plead.Its knowing how to defend and the process that matters.

 

Your defence which has been suggested is not the way I would go about it because of the previous attempted claims and subsequent outcomes which should be brought to the courts attention at the earliest opportunity ...assuming all the facts and your reason for defending remain the same.

The claim has history 

[BankFodder]

Whether you are – two different approaches from the site team. Difficult choices.

I suggested my approach because at the beginning of the process, the claim simply goes through junior administrative staff and nobody significant sees it or makes any decisions. In my view you need to get at least to a point where the claimant puts in a detailed particulars which you can then address point by point and also bring to the notice of the relevant court that this claimant is persistently wasting everyone's time and money. Also, once again – this is not the time to put in a counterclaim – and certainly not for the kind of value you are talking about – which is why we need to know the proper story.

 

[Manxman in exile]

Just one point before this thread is closed - it may not be directly relevant to the new thread, but it might be!

 

I've certainly not read 17 pages, but are you saying that at some point several years ago the claimant (or their predecessor) persuaded your mortgage lender to pay them £6k (or thereabouts) and that this amount was rolled into your mortgage principal and you've been charged interest on it?  And you've not recovered it?

 

EDIT:  On second thoughts ignore this unless its explanation is necessary in the new post BF has requested.

Edited March 26, 2020 by Manxman in exile

[BlurredFX]

5 minutes ago, Andyorch said:

But all that is irrelevant really when responding to a claim....you only respond to the particulars plead.Its knowing how to defend and the process that matters.

 

Your defence which has been suggested is not the way I would go about it because of the previous attempted claims and subsequent outcomes which should be brought to the courts attention at the earliest opportunity ...assuming all the facts and your reason for defending remain the same.

The claim has history 

 

A big part of the problem is that the Claimant is useless, and has not consulted a solicitor. The individual who is handling this claim is not the individual who has handled the previous ones - he doesn't even work in the field, he works as a teacher.

 

BF - I want to go with your approach at this point, for the reasons you give. I need the Claimant to properly state his case so I can shoot it down. I think I have been trying to second guess what his claim might be, and then shoot that down, which is daft.


Assuming the draft defence above is good, I can send that next week in the absence of a better choice.

In the meantime, I will type up a timeline of events so that it is clear to see, and hopefully people will have the time to read it.

Also, given the poor administration on my side, how easy is it to get a copy of all the submissions in each case? That would make it easier for me.

Thanks again to everyone taking an interest.

 

1 minute ago, Manxman in exile said:

Just one point before this thread is closed - it may not be directly relevant to the new thread, but it might be!

 

I've certainly not read 17 pages, but are you saying that at some point several years ago the claimant (or their predecessor) persuaded your mortgage lender to pay them £6k (or thereabouts) and that this amount was rolled into your mortgage principal and you've been charged interest on it?  And you've not recovered it?

Manxman - yes, that is correct. To get the money back, I suspect I may have to start action against my mortgage company, who will in turn take action to reclaim the sums paid to RTM company (or it's predecessor). That is what a friendly Judge said when the Claimant failed to turn up. (The Judge said this informally, after the hearing had ended). I figure that would involve me claiming that money back from the Mortgage company, plus interest, who would then pursue the claimant in my case - for my claim amount against the mortgage co, plus another load of interest!? That comes to big money. Let me get the full story typed up. This claim needs dealing with first.

BFX

[Manxman in exile]

Sorry - you posted while I was editing my post suggesting you ignore my question unless it's essential to your summary in the new thread.

 

Ignore me and concentrate on pulling together the new thread.

 

Thanks for the prompt reply though!

[BankFodder]

It worries me that you use phrases such as "shooting down" their case. This is all gung ho – and so far I don't feel that you are up to the job. I think a bit more careful and methodical approach is needed.

You never know, this may be the time that they do particularise the claim correctly and maybe they will be able to put forward a serious case against you. Of course because so far you have declined to put up the bullet pointed chronology that I have repeatedly asked, we are unable to give any particular view.

You are asking how you can obtain all the submissions – are you saying that with this foot high mountain of paperwork that you have, you don't have all of the documents?

[BlurredFX]

Thanks BankFodder,

 

I have made an attempt at the chronology in the below PDF. 

 

I have gone through foot high pile of documents - though I have not managed to get it into files properly, yet. That is the next job, but it will not be today. It is all mixed together with other stuff, too - such as medical notes that I have submitted to the court to apply for various stays etc. It is a right mess. I'll start tomorrow.

 

It is clearly my responsibility to manage my own administration, which is pretty poor, but please allow that every time they have started new action, they have done it pretty soon after an emergency admission to hospital. That is what they have done again this time - I was rushed in again in Jan this year, and lo and behold - new claim.

 

The timeline I have produced probably isn't perfect, and there will be more questions, possibly some dates to add, but this is my attempt at a timeline of events. It has taken the lions share of two days, and sapped a lot of energy - but it has been cathartic, if nothing else.

 

Please read the PDF first, but the crux of my position is that prior to Jul 2014, there was no entitlement by the company(ies) trying to collect service charges, and this is backed up with letters from the new Landlord - see 22 (and especially 22d). I have been paying, by and large, since 2014 when the RTM company was established.

 

I want the fees before Jul 2014 removing, and the amount claimed from my mortgage co (Mortgage Company-one) applying to my service charge account - which should leave me a few thousand in credit. I have a nasty feeling though, that once all is said and done, that ultimately I should be chasing 'mortgage company-two' , who will chase the management companies that took the money from them (not me). A friendly Judge explained that this way would be best when we had a chat after one of the hearings the claimant failed to attend. However, I am reticent as Mortgage Company-two are not known for being easy to deal with, or particularly consumer oriented.

Should I start a new thread still, or are we OK to continue with this one?

BFX