HCEO Action at old address - No longer a UK resident.

[Brenda1995]

Hi

On the 10th March I received an email from Andrew Wilson advising me of a CCJ that had been transferred to a writ.

 

The Judgement was by default as I left the UK 10 years ago and was addressed to my childhood home where my mum still resides.

 

The sum includes charges for notification and enforcement, yet I was not resident at that address and have since sent them details of my last UK address and a copy of an (expired) residency permit overseas.

 

The original email did not include notice of enforcement, on request they provided a copy of the writ of transfer.

They have sent a bill including their charges but not the actual letter of enforcement.

 

The original debt has been paid to the creditor and the costs and interest too and I still haven't been served the notice of enforcement following the correct format including the 7 days to pay etc.

 

Where do I stand ?

Does a notice served at the incorrect address count ?

[AndyOrch]

Hi and Welcome to CAG

 

What date did you settle the CCJ ?

 

Andy

[dx100uk]

yea go get that moneyback..who did you pay? and how and when?

 

you were resident abroad, end of the matter!!

 

 

[Peterbard]

.

Was the date on the notice of the bill, (the document which informed you the debt was with AW ),  before or after you paid the bill, by what means did you pay the bill and to whom did you pay it , creditor or bailiff?

Edited March 24, 2020 by Peterbard

[Brenda1995]

21 minutes ago, Peterbard said:

.

Was the date on the notice of the bill, (the document which informed you the debt was with AW ),  before or after you paid the bill, by what means did you pay the bill and to whom did you pay it , creditor or bailiff?

 

I received the copy of the original writ on the 13th March, It was a copy of the writ not the notice of enforcement.

I've paid the original creditor as I owed them the money and don't dispute that, it was an oversight and their mails went to my spam folder.

Paid it by bank transfer.  

 

24 minutes ago, Andyorch said:

Hi and Welcome to CAG

 

What date did you settle the CCJ ?

 

Andy

Hi Andy,

I settled It with the original creditor as soon as I found who it was and how much it was for (Excluding the enforcement charges added by Andrew Wilson.

[dx100uk]

what was the debt?

who says you owed the money?

throw your morality card out the window..

 

you were? resident abroad at the time of the CCJ, you can't be issued with a judgement whilst resident abroad.

 

 

[Brenda1995]

I was resident abroad at the time of the original CCJ and the subsequent transfer to a writ.

It was legal costs for a messy divorce.

The original solicitor says I owe it (I did)

[dx100uk]

you say it was 10yrs ago.

what when you were in court regarding the divorce? ie when did that end?

 

and when did they issue the ccj please?

 

if its more than 6yrs between the two the debt is also statute barred!!

 

dx

[Brenda1995]

Sorry, I left the UK 10 years ago the debt was within the statute barred period.

I paid the bulk of a large bill off and must have overlooked the final payment.

[AndyOrch]

4 minutes ago, Brenda1995 said:

Hi Andy,

I settled It with the original creditor as soon as I found who it was and how much it was for (Excluding the enforcement charges added by Andrew Wilson.

 

 

Which was before or after receiving the Writ ?   You paid and cut out the Bailiff fees 

[Brenda1995]

After receiving the copy of the writ.

My issue is no enforcement notification was or has been given, Aren't they supposed to follow steps before accelerating charges ?

[AndyOrch]

Well they probably did but sent notification to your previous address...however if you had not been served correctly then I would wait and see what they intend to do with their costs.

Did the Solicitor issued an acknowledgment/Receipt of payment ? 

Have you checked the CCJ Registry Trust that it has been updated and CRA files marked as satisfied ?

 

https://www.trustonline.org.uk/?gclid=CjwKCAjw3-bzBRBhEiwAgnnLCrKjHc5c2_sTwDYVftQfu0942f5lRua94a-bSKTg6CK5BKgXZLwB5xoCR4oQAvD_BwE

 

You can request a certificate of payment of the judgment from the court that issued the CCJ.

[Brenda1995]

It's just been paid and the follow up email to the solicitor has been sent, no reply as yet.

I'll get that marked as satisfied as soon as the solicitor acknowledges receipt of payment.

 

My plan is... that I now just ignore the agent and let it run 12 months as unsatisfied and then the original creditor has to re apply for another writ which I assume they won't do as the debt is paid.  

[Peterbard]

 

So you are saying, the bailiff had done their work in contacting you, within the statutory timescale but because the notice was not compliant in form, you do not have to pay their fees?

That is even though the showed the writ

[Brenda1995]

I honestly don't know what I'm saying or how the process works, I just feel that emailing me isn't following the process. Adding the best part of 1k for sending an email seems excessive.

[Peterbard]

Well you could be right. The requirements of section 7 do state that the notice must be sent in order for the enforcement can continue. Many have taken a view as you have. Some have taken the more equitable view ad it has been found to be enough that the information was supplied.

 

Really the creditor should send your payment to the bailiff and then he should take his fees, as per the schedule 12,and credit the balance to the sum due to the court. AS a result you would still owe off the debt.

[AndyOrch]

If the Solicitor accepts your payment.....he will become liable for the Bailiffs costs.

[Peterbard]

As Andy says, the creditor will be liable for the enforcement stage bill also.

[Brenda1995]

24 minutes ago, Peterbard said:

As Andy says, the creditor will be liable for the enforcement stage bill also.

So if I haven’t received the first notice saying I have seven days to pay can they just move onto to second action and charge me for it ? That’s my main point of contention. 

If I get them to follow the procedure and send my the 1st notification then I’ll Just pay the £70 and be done with it. 

[AndyOrch]

As per my post #12...you have not been served correctly..therefore the process is invalid.

[Peterbard]

2 hours ago, Brenda1995 said:

So if I haven’t received the first notice saying I have seven days to pay can they just move onto to second action and charge me for it ? That’s my main point of contention. 

If I get them to follow the procedure and send my the 1st notification then I’ll Just pay the £70 and be done with it. 

 

The money has been paid yes, but did they call(enforce)to get it? they did not send a notice, you say. They just sent an arrears note.

,  did they continue the action ?? If they didn't, there is no breach of the act, you paid voluntarily.  Fees are due on the bailiff recieving the writ, not sending the NOE to you. see below.

 

or this is what they say,

 

The compliance fee is for all actions

6.—(1) The relevant stages of enforcement under an enforcement power conferred by a High Court writ are as follows—, 

(a)the compliance stage, which comprises all activities relating to enforcement from the receipt by the enforcement agent of instructions to use that procedure in relation to a sum to be recovered up to but not including the commencement of the first enforcement stage, or, where sub-paragraph (c)(i) applies, the commencement of the

second enforcement stage.

Stages of enforcement for which fees may be recovered – enforcement other than under High Court writs

5.—(1) The relevant stages of enforcement under an enforcement power which is not conferred by a High Court writ are as follows—

(a)the compliance stage, which comprises all activities relating to enforcement from the receipt by the enforcement agent of instructions to use that procedure in relation to a sum to be recovered up to but not including the commencement of the enforcement stage;

 

 

Edited March 24, 2020 by Peterbard
repeating myself

[Brenda1995]

Sorry I’ve not been in this position before and now I’m really confused Peter.

Am I liable for all the costs even for actions they have not taken ? 
 

[dx100uk]

no!!

 

no NOE for the correct address.

and the CCJ is invalid anyway

what you've done is paid the creditor what you owed + a bit for court fees I expect too?

 

so if you wanted to be pedantic you could run the N244 route (£255) get it set aside but to what end..simply another £255 for nothing different than what you have done.

 

the bailiff can wave his arms around all he likes

cant enforce anything in the 1st place let alone his fees.

nothing there is yours anyway. not your property either

 

 

[Peterbard]

3 hours ago, Brenda1995 said:

So if I haven’t received the first notice saying I have seven days to pay can they just move onto to second action and charge me for it ? That’s my main point of contention. 

If I get them to follow the procedure and send my the 1st notification then I’ll Just pay the £70 and be done with it. 

 

The money has been paid yes, but did they call(enforce)to get it? they did not send a notice, you say. They just sent an arrears note.

,  did they continue the action ?? If they didn't, there is no breach of the act, you paid voluntarily.  Fees are due on the bailiff recieving the writ, not sending the NOE to you. see below.

 

or this is what they say,

 

The compliance fee is for all actions

6.—(1) The relevant stages of enforcement under an enforcement power conferred by a High Court writ are as follows—, 

(a)the compliance stage, which comprises all activities relating to enforcement from the receipt by the enforcement agent of instructions to use that procedure in relation to a sum to be recovered up to but not including the commencement of the first enforcement stage, or, where sub-paragraph (c)(i) applies, the commencement of the

second enforcement stage;and it is dueon the receipt of the writ by thebailiff and signed for, not when the letter is sent.

Stages of enforcement for which fees may be recovered – enforcement other than under High Court writs

5.—(1) The relevant stages of enforcement under an enforcement power which is not conferred by a High Court writ are as follows—

(a)the compliance stage, which comprises all activities relating to enforcement from the receipt by the enforcement agent of instructions to use that procedure in relation to a sum to be recovered up to but not including the commencement of the enforcement stage;

 

No my fault, I should have made it clearer for you.

 

How much would you still owe, is it just the Compliance fee of £90

[Peterbard]

The act says that the bailiff fee is due when the bailiff receives the writ from the court, not when the bailiff sends a letter to you. He would have had to find you and process you case. So yes in this regard he is due his fee.

He would not however be permited to continue to enforce, (visit you) until he sends a compliant notice to your new address.