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Aldridgeboy

CPM-Trinity Park-Birmingham Airport-Successful Appeal

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Hi everyone

Ive had one for exactly the same road. My circumstances are that i pulled into the road in error on leaving the train station. I noticed a car do a u turn opposite me as if to follow me, and then do the same when i myself did a u turn at the far end of the cul de sac.

It was obvious he was following me, so i pulled over to the side of the road to let him drive past.

 

He just parked watching me, watching him in my rear view mirror. He then stuck his hand out of the window and was taking photos of me. I straight away and challenged him, pointing out in the process his car stank of cannabis. He replied "so what, you can't park there"

 

I took his photo (attached)at which point he sped off. I was going to follow him and call the Police to pull him, but by time i got back in my car he was long gone.

 

I had the PCN about a week later. I appealed with my concerns and submitted the photos of him and his vehicle. The appeal was not surprisingly allowed, do i have just appealed to IAS. Ive done a brief outline of the above in the second appeal, but have said I'm more than happy to go straight to court to deal with this.

 

I intend to visit the site in the near future to get a load of photos of the entrance to the road etc. ill be more than happy to post them here ( Although Squirlyines video is brill )

 

 

 

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Hello and welcome to CAG.

 

You need to start a new thread of your own please, so that you can have advice on your specific case. This thread is for advising the OP.

 

Best, HB


Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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Hi Aldridgeboy,

Welcome to the club; you're now the 3rd person with a similar circumstances come on to this thread!

No doubt you'll have started your own thread, but feel free to come back to see how the process is going and what correspondence you may receive.

 

You have brought some interesting new information to the table about their methods which none of us previously had seen or discovered (though the 2nd person's thread I haven't checked up on), that your parking adversary actively pursued you in, taking his 'camera' out of the window to take photos (presumably because the quality was not satisfactory) and that he'd likely been on the toke!

 

I am hoping that if it comes to hearings or such, that information from others can be shared; maybe one of the regulars can put me straight there. Either way ericsbrother has suggested that if they are to be held in the same court they could be asked to be held together; though there is the issue of timing with getting assigned and case being heard.

 

Also there did not appear to be any photo attached to your post, not sure if you tried putting it in pdf,  but that's generally how they want it (you may want to retry that)

 

Thank you for your comment re the video (my phone was makeshift strapped to the rear view mirror using one of my daughters hairbands!)

Either way best of luck with yours!

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1 Date of the infringement  -  7/10/19

 

2 Date on the NTK [this must have been received within 14 days from the 'offence' date]  -  10/10/19

 

3 Date received  -  12/10/19

 

4 Does the NTK mention schedule 4 of The Protections of Freedoms Act 2012? [Y/N?]  -  

 

5 Is there any photographic evidence of the event?  -  Y

 

6 Have you appealed? [Y/N?] post up your appeal]  -  Y

Have you had a response? [Y/N?] post it up  -  Y

 

7 Who is the parking company?  -  CPM (UK Car Park Management)

 

8. Where exactly [carpark name and town]  -  Trinity Park, Birmingham ( I was on a road, not a car park)

 

For either option, does it say which appeals body they operate under.  -  IPC

 

Hi everyone

Apologies for the delay in writing this. My circumstances are as follows

 

In October last year, I pulled into Trinity Park after leaving Birmingham International Train station on the airport complex.

As you come out of the train station, you come to a roundabout.

The first left is Trinity Park.

 

Apparently it’s a private road, but there are no signs today tis as you enter.

(research shows that years ago there were barriers and a manned hut in the middle of the road. These are no longer there)

I actually turned in there by mistake, not realising it was n fact a cut de sac. I was trying to exit the complex.

 As I entered the road I saw a male in a car look at me, and as i drove past him he immediately did a u turn and followed me.

 

I was a Police officer for 22 years, and just notice this type of thing.

I then quickly realised i was in a cup de sac and needed to turn around.

 

I did this at the end of the cul de sac, and noticed this male then did the same.

It made no sense to me that he would, from the entrance of a cul de sac, go back in to then turn back around to come back out.

It was clear to me he was following me and was suspicious.

 

I pulled over at the side of the road briefly, so he would have to drive past me.

However, he didn’t, and was sat in his vehicle about 10 metres behind me.

I was watching him in my rear view mirror, which is when i saw him put his phone out of the window and start taking photos.

This was now beyond strange, so i got out of my car and walked up to his to challenge him. 

 

When i got to his vehicle it absolutely stunk of cannabis.

I asked what he was doing , an all he said was " you can't park there".

I said I wasn't actually parked, but had come to see what he was up to.

I them pointed out his car stunk of cannabis, to which he silly said " so?"

 

I then took his photograph, to which he said I couldn’t.

I pointed out that  I could, at which point he sped off (the photos of him and his vehicle have hopefully uploaded successfully)

 

Within a week I received a PCN.

I immediately appealed stating that I didn’t consider I was parked.

I had pulled over due to the operator’s suspicious activity, which then led to me having to leave my vehicle to challenge him.

 

I provided my photos, told them about the drugs and that I was a police officer, and more than happy to go to court and give evidence around this.

I also said that I would be asking to see his business insurance for the vehicle in court.

I also pointed out that in the photo they had of me, my brake lights were still activated, suggesting I had indeed just pulled over on the road.

 

This appeal was rejected, they said they would raise my concerns about the operative and the company may be n contact around this ( they haven't to date) I then had an email about another appeal to an adjudicator.

 

I put very little details on this one, saying id really just like to go to court and cross examine the operative.

I also explained that I am a qualified drugs expert witness, entitled to give evidence of opinion in court cases.

I would now start research on this case, and be charging my day rate to every day I spent on it.

 

A few days ago I had a further email to say my appeal had been allowed.

Ill paste the reply below.

 

The crux of it is, which hopefully may help others going forward, is that where i was "parked" it was impossible to see the signs saying no parking. 

 

Here is their reply to my appeal:

 

The Appellant should understand that the Adjudicator is not in a position to give legal advice to either of the parties but they are entitled to seek their own independent legal advice.

 

The Adjudicator's role is to consider whether or not the parking charge has a basis in law and was properly issued in the circumstances of each individual case.

In all Appeals the Adjudicator is bound by the relevant law applicable at the time and is only able to consider legal challenges and not factual mistakes nor extenuating or mitigating circumstances.

 

Throughout this appeal the Operator has had the opportunity consider all points raised and could have conceded the appeal at any stage.

The Adjudicator who deals with this Appeal is legally qualified and each case is dealt with according to their understanding of the law as it applies and the legal principles involved.

 

A decision by an Adjudicator is not legally binding on an Appellant who is entitled to seek their own legal advice if they so wish.

 

The Appellant contends that the Parking Charge should not have been issued as he only pulled over due to the suspicious behaviour of the parking attendant.

The operator submits that the signage is clear and the Appellant should have seen this signage and been aware that he was unable to stop on the roadway.

 

The one sign I can see in the photographs submitted is some 10 metres in front of the Appellant's vehicle and could not be read by the Appellant from where he stopped.

As the operator has failed to submit a site plan, I cannot be sure whether the Appellant had already passed further signs indicating the restrictions, or where in fact the restrictions start and end on the roadway.

 

As much as the Appellant wishes to attend court on this matter, due to the lack of any further evidence submitted by the operator, I cannot be satisfied that the Parking Charge was properly issued, therefore I am allowing this appeal. "

 

 

 

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Hi.

 

I've removed your photos while I check whether we can allow them. Please bear with me until I've talked to the team about this.

 

HB


Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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Hi.

 

We think it would be best to block out your registration rather than blur it, in case someone can de-blur it and identify you.

 

We also think you should pixel out or obscure the face of the operative [if that's who it is] to keep this anonymous.

 

Could you adjust your photos and repost them please?

 

HB


Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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Hiya

Thats the operatives car, not mine 

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Thank you, I'm sorry I misunderstood. I don't think the advice on keeping things anonymous on this forum changes though.

 

The unredacted photos could well prove useful to you later.

 

HB


Illegitimi non carborundum

 

 

 

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Yes a good result, but agree with HB, blanking out of number plate of operators car  avoids issues.


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As usual, the appeals people ignore all the inconvenient bits of the law that side with the appellant and find on your behalf on a matter that they have ignored for years despite proof of insufficient signage being presented in those cases.

 

It is usual for the IAS to say that they just believe that the operator is telling the truth without even looking at any evidence from them and certainly not providing that evidence to the appellant to rebut if necessary even though the operator gets to see yours

Glad that you won your appeal but it shows that it is not only the cannabis thak stinks at the IPC

 

Should others caught out at the same place appeal on the same grounds?

I would certainly use this as evidence that there is insufficient signage ( the IAS ignored the fact tyat it is prohibitive, fails the 10 minute grace period etc) but not at this stage as CPM have clearly not learnt anything from this.

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On 12/01/2020 at 15:20, Aldridgeboy said:

I also explained that I am a qualified drugs expert witness, entitled to give evidence of opinion in court cases. I would now start research on this case, and be charging my day rate to every day I spent on it.

😂 Wow, he really got unlucky with you didn't he!!

I didn't know you were a police officer before, that definitely helps put confidence in our ongoing challenges to this crooked operation!

 

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8 hours ago, ericsbrother said:

Should others caught out at the same place appeal on the same grounds? I would certainly use this as evidence that there is insufficient signage ( the IAS ignored the fact tyat it is prohibitive, fails the 10 minute grace period etc) but not at this stage as CPM have clearly not learnt anything from this.

 

Thanks ericsbrother will keep this in mind. As it is the tenet of our rebuttals (that and the size of the writing) it will help consolidate our position!

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1 hour ago, squirlyline said:

😂 Wow, he really got unlucky with you didn't he!!

I didn't know you were a police officer before, that definitely helps put confidence in our ongoing challenges to this crooked operation!

 

He did 😂

this happened a week before I retired. I was gonna pull him out of the car, but he sped off before I could 

 

Not my Force area, but have emailed west mids with the red and his pic, along with the details. 

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I laughed several times reading this. Brilliant!!

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Hopefullythen the local police will go to the location in an unmarked car and torment him by doing what you di as in stopping, and walking over to his motor.

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Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

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The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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3 hours ago, Aldridgeboy said:

but have emailed west mids with the red and his pic, along with the details

 

This story just gets better! 😁

Now all we need is the confirmed connection that he is loosely employed by CPM to carry out their 'shanannigans' and we have the setting for a fabulous showdown!

Edited by squirlyline
the system doesn't like the word 's.c.a.m'

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also confirmed surely that he is using a mobile phone.

I wonder if this phone is his personal property or company issue

 

I also wonder if the vehicle is his personal vehicle or owned by CPM?

 

if its not , then he is using his pers car for business purposes and should have business insurance.

 

dx

 

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..

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Either way there are serious breaches of various regulations in the situation, It's unlikely the 'erb smoking dude has business insurance,  he risks having the car seized by police if a copper in an unmarked car is followed like Aldridgeboy.  If it  was a personal phone used pictures of a vehicle, GDPR and probably Data Retention breaches, as did the pictures remain on the phone, or were they deleted when passed to CPM?  Either way the dude and CPM would be jointly and severally liable for the breaches.  Hope that WMP follow it up, especially as a police force was stung by a PPC with an invoice for a vehicle on blues and two's stopping in a car park on the shout.

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We could do with some help from you.

PLEASE HELP US TO KEEP THIS SITE RUNNING EVERY POUND DONATED WILL HELP US TO KEEP HELPING OTHERS

 

Have we helped you ...?         Please Donate button to the Consumer Action Group

 

If you want advice on your thread please PM me a link to your thread

 

The bailiff: A 12th Century solution re-branded as Enforcement Agents for the 21st Century to seize and sell debtors goods as before Oh so Dickensian!

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